why waves plugins cost that dam much ? i dont get it

[jupiter8]

but now, a much more hateful word "fag" is used consistantly (certainly not just this thread)

what's up with that?

What's wrong with it ? It means cigarette does'nt it ?
And as i have a nicotin addiction i did'nt particulary mind it.

[maxhodges1]

Hmm, don't know about Z-Noise, but it's predecessor X-Noise was a "simple" multiband expander. To my knowledge all modern (commercial) denoisers work like this. So i doubt there could be too a huge difference anyway?

You could always take a look at the Z-Noise product page:
http://www.waves.com/content.asp?id=2027

Z-Noise is not just a more precise version of X-Noise — it's based on a brand new algorithm that reconceptualizes the way noise is treated. Z-Noise's breakthrough features include extensive noise profile shaping tools, innovative transient preservation, exclusive extractive/adaptive dynamic noise detection and increased low frequency resolution.

[herodotus]

Are there really people who would walk out of a studio that they were going to use because they found out said studio doesn't use Waves plugins?

There are contracts that specify, among other things, TDM.

People who farm out production work want legally solid assurances that they can work with the material, that is, send it to someone else -- In other words, easily fire you and not be hung out to dry because of your processes.

Somehow, this seems unlikely.

In a contract situation *everything* is stipulated down to the last detail.

OK, I don't doubt you, but what sort of contracts are you talking about?

I mean, I have worked in a lot of studios over the years and what most people seem to care about are microphones, room quality, and signal path (board, converters, preamps, etc.). I haven't heard plugins mentioned once.

Hell, Steve Albini's Electrical studios are always booked solid and they don't even have a DAW, much less a ProTools rig with a bunch of Waves plugins.

Is this like TV stuff you are talking about?

[bleebsen]

Hmm, don't know about Z-Noise, but it's predecessor X-Noise was a "simple" multiband expander. To my knowledge all modern (commercial) denoisers work like this. So i doubt there could be too a huge difference anyway?

You could always take a look at the Z-Noise product page:
http://www.waves.com/content.asp?id=2027

Z-Noise is not just a more precise version of X-Noise — it's based on a brand new algorithm that reconceptualizes the way noise is treated. Z-Noise's breakthrough features include extensive noise profile shaping tools, innovative transient preservation, exclusive extractive/adaptive dynamic noise detection and increased low frequency resolution.

Thanks, I've read that, but that's just advertising talk... of course it's better™...

but it's still a multiband expander, erm, "reconceptualized"

[TotcProductions]

They cost that much so you'll but the bundle instead. Typical marketing approach.

Also, at the time most of them were released, they were the shiznit! They're getting a little long in the tooth now though. Honsetly, I still use alot of them over some other plugs that I have...but do to problems with PACE on my system, I'm slowly replacing them, since there really is so much commercial stuff out there that matches or betters the old Waves Line. Some of the new stuff is well worth the price though IMO...the GTR set, the SSL4000 set, the L3. Never got into the IR1 though...if I was going to buy a convolution verb that used pace and cost that much money, I'd probably go with the newly PC Formatted Altiverb instead.

Peace

[TotcProductions]

Hmm, don't know about Z-Noise, but it's predecessor X-Noise was a "simple" multiband expander. To my knowledge all modern (commercial) denoisers work like this. So i doubt there could be too a huge difference anyway?

You could always take a look at the Z-Noise product page:
http://www.waves.com/content.asp?id=2027

Z-Noise is not just a more precise version of X-Noise — it's based on a brand new algorithm that reconceptualizes the way noise is treated. Z-Noise's breakthrough features include extensive noise profile shaping tools, innovative transient preservation, exclusive extractive/adaptive dynamic noise detection and increased low frequency resolution.

Personally, I think Waves f**ked themselves by skipping the "Y" in the Alphabet. What the hell are they going to do when they want to release a new noise killer.??? they're out of letters!

[james0tucson]

In a contract situation *everything* is stipulated down to the last detail.

OK, I don't doubt you, but what sort of contracts are you talking about?

Film post, for example.

[thecontrolcentre]

Waves were the standard, around 1998 when there wasn't much alternative.

There are free plugins that do the same thing now.

that's great news. can you provide some links please

[bduffy]

Waves were the standard, around 1998 when there wasn't much alternative.

There are free plugins that do the same thing now.

that's great news. can you provide some links please

If I may: there are free EQs and compressors that are equal and better than Waves (Poshifopit, Vanilla Compressor), but there are some things that are uniquely Waves and are simply hard to replace, especially for free. Some people like to attack Waves for being "bloatware" or something, but it's useful to note that many of their plugins are plugins are so simple, they'd make a BetaBug blush! Like Ren Vox, Ren Bass, etc, and there is something about those plugins and their programming, that they just "work" and sound great, and I never see anything - especially free - that replaces them.

But I think we're in a world where they're just not necessary, like they used to be. You know, there are several threads here where we tried to suggest replacements for the full Waves catalog...maybe I can dig one up...

[sloworm]

Why the f*ck is vagina so overly priced? I mean, you have to wine and dine the lady, which is a pretty penny. Then you have to be sensitive and all that metrosexual stuff! I mean, geesh, why not go home and beat it, or use a flesh light? I mean is vagina that much better than a flesh light....? I just don't get it.

ooops, wrong thread....*edit*

[stag]

The L series IMO there is nothing like that, no matter how extreme is the setting it doesn't break up with artifacts.
RVox, try it as a gate, not to mention Z-noise... SSL4000, this thing rocks. Waves are great, their marketing and the dreaded WUP that's another story.

[thecontrolcentre]

I know the outboard will keep its value and never be outdated.

i've spent thousands on outboard equipment over the last 10 years or so ... it's worth next to nothing these days. I was recently given a Roland samper that cost $3000 dollars in 1996 ... it's shit.

[Stupid American Pig]

I know the outboard will keep its value and never be outdated.

i've spent thousands on outboard equipment over the last 10 years or so ... it's worth next to nothing these days. I was recently given a Roland samper that cost $3000 dollars in 1996 ... it's shit.

Indeed, the *only* gear that will really keep value is the few pieces of analog outboard gear that are ridiculously expensive anyway.

[sounddesigner]

Voxengo geq overtone is great freeware, nyquist is great freeware eq, plpareq is much better then waves and it was free at one time.Then theres IIEQ and posifopit.These eq's are close to/good as/ or better then waves.

I can't really think of no freeware compressor that's as good as, close to, or better then waves.But i can think of plenty of low-costing ones or ones just a little bit cheaper such as Uad-1's.
Voxengo marquis,compadre, soniformer etc etc.
Even waves biggest bundle (the mercury bundle) is not as big of a bargain as some make it to be, i can work Uad's ultra pack/flexipack system (resaling extra cards i don't need) and buy alot of plugs from many other developers and come out with higher quality and quantity then waves 91 plugs for $7500, do i need to list how? For $7,500 if i don't buy waves i can pretty much own every plugin from every other developer on the market (not all the way true but most big names yes i could have), People forget that plugins such as izotopes are many plugins rolled into one, and Quantum fx comes with 50 fx to start with and gives you the ability to create unlimited ( quantum fx has some of the best sounding modulator plugs out here). For $7500 i assure you i could come out with more quality and quantity and diverse sounding plugs as well as have a more customized to wants and needs arsenal. I could own reverbs that i believe waves reverbs are'nt even close to, i could build my own supreme modulator monster with quantum fx,have eq's such as plpareq,uad precision, voxengo harmonieq etc etc
In the end it boils down to personal taste so if one loves waves sound they should go with waves, but i personally went other routes and feel i have a much better arsenal because so. I think if you don't throw all your eggs in one basket you can shop many places and be more eclectic (getting the best from several different developers) having a more thought-out arsenal of choice rather then someone telling you what you need by you buying one huge bundle from only them. If you go elsewhere you can buy both expensive and cheap plugins of high-quality and still come out with more quality and quantity then the waves at a better price as well.Keep in mind that with the waves mercury bundle many of us don't like every plugin in the bundle, for me personally over half that bundle is useless.This is not saying i don't like all waves (i own and love audiotrack), i'm crazy about some but far from 91.

[kritikon]

The Spark wrote:

I know the outboard will keep its value and never be outdated.


Laughing i've spent thousands on outboard equipment over the last 10 years or so ... it's worth next to nothing these days. I was recently given a Roland samper that cost $3000 dollars in 1996 ... it's shit.

Haha. Yeah - h/w only keeps its value if you buy the absolute best of the best, and even then there's no gaurantee. Occasionally some cheaper-but-quirky unit will gain cult status, but look at some of the units in the past that were standard issue for anyone. Most of them are bargain basement now. Analogue synths are mostly the only exceptions and even some of those are losing value.

Look at some of the old analogue units that have kept their price. Pultec Eqs, Urei compressors, Trident desks etc. You needed a mortgage back then to buy them, and you still do. Alesis, Akai, Allen & Heath, Yamaha, even some of the old Lexicons etc all dropped dramatically in price over the past 5 years or more, and they were studio "standard" in their time. For example...going back to samplers - I wouldn't piss on any of the old h/w samplers nowadays (except maybe for a top-spec Emu, and even then I wouldn't Pay much). An old Lexicon LX15, Alex, Reflex, and even the newer ones...why pay the money when there's things like Princeton reverb and CSR (which will sound reasonably like an older PCM unit, although not quite IMO). Almost any old h/w digital synth...you can do more in s/w for a fraction of the price. I can even replace my Wavestation for a small fee.


Good h/w still has its place, but only the very good h/w.

At least with Waves, you have a reasonable certainty that you're going to get upgrades that'll keep up with the new stuff for many years to come. Not my personal choice, but I can see why people go for them. When I look back at the money I've lost in depreciation for all the h/w I've bought in the past... I could buy several Waves bundles and update them every year and still be ahead in 2015.......
I don't specially insure my gear now (I've finally found insurance companies over in NZ that will cover me under the normal household insurance for everything (nice ) and I can actually specify the items too. I recently found some old paperwork when we moved house earlier in the year; I found an old insurance covernote from 1999. I was insured for 30,000 quid. And really, I'm pretty sure I'd under-insured...I doubt I'd covered the full cost of all the looms and leads and jacks and little bits and bobs that you pick up along the way. Admittedly I've got rid of maybe half of that stuff (although not the leads and jacks and bits and bobs) and I doubt I could get $10,000 for it here. $10,000 would be around 3-4,000 quid. It's decimated in value. From 30,000 to 3,000 in only 7 years. I'm sure I could sell some of my synths for more in the UK, but even so....now I'm f**king depressing myself.

I've got a DAW with plenty enough quality s/w to enable me to make better actual sonic quality music from 1999. And I suspect my whole DAW with s/w only cost something like $5-6,000 all up.


Sheeeesh.... Waves seems like good value compared to my h/w now.