NI could learn from Spectrasonics

[Dr.Wu]

Omnisphere is a synthesizer that uses samples or realtime generated synthwaveforms to produce sound. Both complement the other perfectly.
Things like pulsewidth modulation or oscillatorsync dont work with samples, Things like Timbreshift or samplestartmodulation dont make sense with realtime generated synthwaveforms.
Many of the waveforms in Omnisphere couldnt have been generated with pure synthesis.
Hidefsampling also allows to capture a certain character of a vintage synth something that can only be emulated to a certain extend with realtime generated waveforms.
I find the fact that Omnisphere combines both ways to generate sound a perfect match.

[zvenx]

.......
omni is a rompler/sample playback machine basically...sure, it can do other stuff, but thats the core of it, otherwise why would you include a 40gb library?

To avoid what I think is happening with a very popular synth here....That came with imho not so impressive sample set to put it mildly and only now almost a year later as more developers are coming on board it is starting to sound decent despite it being called the greatest synth/sample mangler/whatever ever..... see for me features are secondary to how it sounds....I don't care how much stuff it can do if it doesn't sound good.....that's why I like omnisphere, sounds great and can do a boat load of stuff.

I guess if/when omnisphere includes the ability to bring in your own samples it will become more of all things to all people.. Because I am mostly a preset player I prefer a great soundset off the bat, rather than a poor soundset with a million ways to manipulate it.
rsp

[Kriminal]

.......
omni is a rompler/sample playback machine basically...sure, it can do other stuff, but thats the core of it, otherwise why would you include a 40gb library?

To avoid what I think is happening with a very popular synth here....That came with imho not so impressive sample set to put it mildly and only now almost a year later as more developers are coming on board it is starting to sound decent despite it being called the greatest synth/sample mangler/whatever ever..... see for me features are secondary to how it sounds....I don't care how much stuff it can do if it doesn't sound good.....that's why I like omnisphere, sounds great and can do a boat load of stuff.

the VST you are reffering to (i assume) is not really a preset players wet dream (i dont think its meant to be) its a users wet dream...its a tool to use. You can load in whatever you want and use/abuse it however you want..you are not 'limited' to the library that comes with it (thankfully some say...)

IMHO, the only reason companies make closed format stuff like this is so they can make a shed load of money from selling extra sounds etc...

The money seems to be in selling on new sample pack content, rather than letting users make their own content for free.

BTW, im not trying to start a VST war as is the norm for here, just makig a point, which may or may not be valid or interesting....

im off to watch a movie and drink some wine

[el-bo (formerly ebow)]

prob cos a 40+GB sample library means its a ROMpler...nothing to be ashamed of, i see no reason to hide it.

Nope. Not in my understanding of how that term is generally applied.

"Rompler" has lots of negative connotations and is often a euphemism for:

• Inflexible
• Preset Playback instrument
• Not for Sound Designers
• Boring
• Not a real synthesizer
• Not powerful
• If you get it you will sound like everyone else

Wouldn't you agree?

Examples of famous Romplers: Korg M-1, Sound Canvas, etc

"Rompler" is a dirty word around here at Spectrasonics, because Omnisphere doesn't fit that description at all. It is very much the opposite of all the above.

well, its all about how you perceive it...i mean, samplers arent samplers anymore are they..they play back samples, but they dont sample

omni is a rompler/sample playback machine basically...sure, it can do other stuff, but thats the core of it, otherwise why would you include a 40gb library?

or it's a synth with a lot of presets and the ability to play back samples from a huge included library....your description is how i might view something like titan

but as i said, the kriminal i was familiar with new a lot about synths...maybe you have just yet to get any time in front of omnisphere

omnisphere would be a powerful synth without any of the library...but you wouldn't be able to say the same for a rompler

[zvenx]

"IMHO, the only reason companies make closed format stuff like this is so they can make a shed load of money from selling extra sounds etc... "

so far they have given away 3200 presets for free.....let us see if this is the case with omnisphere..... I personally doubt it...but we shall see.
And ironically it is that other synth that has so far charged for three sets of 'extra sounds', although they have also updated their factory library for free.....

I really do believe the best case scenario is an incorporation of both.. great factory library and the ability to import your own for those who like to do such things......although I am not really one of them per se, I would like spectrasonics to go that way with omnisphere. Ironically I just bought NI's Acoustic Refraction and if you like the unusual sounds of omnisphere, AR is a great complement to it and it would be nice to import those samples in omnisphere and mangle them with the STEAM engine, if one was so inclined.
Enjoy your wine my friend
rsp


p.s. I take note you have mentioned the NO demo once in this thread...lol

[spectrum]

well, its all about how you perceive it...

I suppose you can choose to perceive something any way you like, but that perception can be completely inaccurate.

omni is a rompler/sample playback machine basically

Sorry, but you are wrong.

A Rompler by definition cannot generate sound without playing back samples.

Omnisphere is by definition a synthesizer, because it generates sound on its own.

...sure, it can do other stuff, but thats the core of it,

That's incorrect.

If the realtime synthesis features of Omnisphere were just "other stuff", then why would the vast majority of patches in Omnisphere rely on the synthesis features?

Omnisphere was designed as a synthesizer.

otherwise why would you include a 40gb library?

To have more options for synthesis and sound creation of course!

Are you saying that synths can only be categorized as a true synthesizer if their selection of sampled waveforms for their sample-based oscillators is limited to a certain size?

So what's the number then? Under a gigabyte? Less than 100mb?

Are the following sample-based instruments "true synths" simply because they have small memory sizes and a more limited selection of waveforms?

Propellerheads Maelstrom
PPG Wave
Roland JD-800

BTW, if you take away the samples from any of these respected synths, they produce no sound at all.

I don't buy the idea that smaller memory sizes for smaller selections of sounds makes a better synth.

I believe in more options and more flexibility, not less.

IMHO, the only reason companies make closed format stuff like this is so they can make a shed load of money from selling extra sounds etc...

That's a pretty offensive comment when it's directed at us here at Spectrasonics.

What is this accusation based on exactly?

I'm pretty sure that in the year since Omnisphere was released, we've created and given away more free patches than any company ever has in the history of synthesizers - hardware or software. If that's not accurate, somebody please correct me!

Well...since we are tarnished with this "money-grubbing" image here at KvR anyway, maybe we should charge a bunch for all our presets like the majority of other developers do.

Just kidding of course. We love creating patches with Omnisphere and sharing them with our users and not charging them for it. We figure they invested a good chunk into the instrument, so they should share in its evolution with us.

But it's definitely kinda weird to be accused of that sort of "greedy capitalist" reputation while you are giving away tons of stuff for free.

Cheers!

spectrum

[eduardo_b]

A Rompler by definition cannot generate sound without playing back samples.

Omnisphere is by definition a synthesizer, because it generates sound on its own.

My understanding of romplers is they play samples that themselves are finished products, but can be "changed" using effects. The samples can include synthesizers, but the rompler doesn't create the sound, only plays it.

I think the confusion might be the result of how few synthesizers come with "libraries." They have presets, but rarely libraries to create new sounds.

That about right?

[spectrum]

A Rompler by definition cannot generate sound without playing back samples.

Omnisphere is by definition a synthesizer, because it generates sound on its own.

My understanding of romplers is they play samples that themselves are finished products, but can be "changed" using effects. The samples can include synthesizers, but the rompler doesn't create the sound, only plays it.

That's correct and also why it's the wrong term for what Omnisphere is.

I think the confusion might be the result of how few synthesizers come with "libraries." They have presets, but rarely libraries to create new sounds.

That about right?

Perhaps so. But of course every synth has a collection of waveforms to work with - whether it's a few or thousands. Generally speaking, the more waveforms you have to start with and the more you can do with them determines how flexible that synth is.

This is one of the reasons why we call the waveform/soundsource area the "core library", because it only represents a starting point for your own exploration. (not a finished preset like a Rompler would have)

[macalister]

prob cos a 40+GB sample library means its a ROMpler...nothing to be ashamed of, i see no reason to hide it.

Nope. Not in my understanding of how that term is generally applied.

"Rompler" has lots of negative connotations and is often a euphemism for:

• Inflexible
• Preset Playback instrument
• Not for Sound Designers
• Boring
• Not a real synthesizer
• Not powerful
• If you get it you will sound like everyone else

Wouldn't you agree?

Examples of famous Romplers: Korg M-1, Sound Canvas, etc

"Rompler" is a dirty word around here at Spectrasonics, because Omnisphere doesn't fit that description at all. It is very much the opposite of all the above.

well, its all about how you perceive it...i mean, samplers arent samplers anymore are they..they play back samples, but they dont sample

omni is a rompler/sample playback machine basically...sure, it can do other stuff, but thats the core of it, otherwise why would you include a 40gb


library?

Dude!, you are talking about 40 GB?? of Soundsources, do you have any idea how hard was to create this kind of samples material?, normalized, cuted, mapped, selected, etc...40gb of one of the best samplesources ever created before on a Synth plug-in platform! Korg Oasys (u$ 7800) for example included less that 700 mb of data (some sounds are totallt junk! I own one,I know what Im talking about), Omnisphere (u$ 479) included those 40gb and one of the best interface (simple but powerfull) and the sound quality is top!, if you go to mention 40gb in Omnisphere, first take your hat off!

[noiseboyuk]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Kriminal just trolling now?

I'm pretty much a preset guy (if I touch the filter cutoff I think I've turned into Wendy Carlos) but it's as factually wrong to call Omnisphere a ROMpler as it is to call it a tambourine. It's been pointed out many times on this thread now that Omnisphere has its own very comprehensive synth generation facilities, so it aint a rompler - which can only PLAY from ROM. End of story.

Unless someone can point out that the colossol synth generation features don't actually exist, surely its not unfair at this point to assume any further rompler comments are just trolling? Sure it's fine to compare with other synths with other features (such as Alchemy), but the rompler taunts seem pretty childish at best.

[Dr.Wu]

i think what he really wants to say is that as long as it has no demo it cannot be a real synth........

[Sampleconstruct]

Sorry for causing such an uproar throwing in the term "Rompler" into this discussion. Everybody calm down again now and forget the Rompler thing, I was just uttering my prejudices against Omnisphere, the 2 hour testing session in my music store didn't impress me at all, but that's a totally subjective impression caused by my very personal expectations of what a Software Instrument should be capable of nowadays. Alchemy, Kontakt, Absynth, Reaktor, Massive and the AAS collection (Tassman, String Studio, Ultra Analog) do it all for me.

[kevvvvv]

Kriminal wrote:
IMHO, the only reason companies make closed format stuff like this is so they can make a shedload of money from selling extra sounds etc...

spectrum wrote:
That's a pretty offensive comment when it's directed at us here at Spectrasonics

.

I wouldn't find it offensive if someone accused my company of making money. We're not a charity.

Omnisphere's 1st year mission is to become the world's go-to synth. Cool

Hopefully free presets, forum excitement, reviews, more videos, advertising, sales events - plus more i7 machine sales - will make it so. And provide the reward for the risk

Soon we'll all be begging for extra soundpacks - like Stylus

Maybe "a shedload of money might be made". Don't be offended

I wish you luck

[ericj23]

if your not hoping to make lots of money you could give me one for free

You could look on it as a demo

[hibidy]

We're not a charity.

Sorry, could not resist