How much do you use presets? [Poll]

[Nielzie]

the whole argument of people here saying they use presets to save time is absolutely laughable.
cos if you really know how to use a synth making most of the the sounds you need is actually faster than browsing through tons of presets and synths and trying to squeeze someone elses preset into your music.

-the time it takes to make a bass on a synth to your exact specification : select oscillators, adjust filter and resonance, adjust modulations. total 5-15 minutes
-time it takes a preset junki to make a bass: look for preset threads, input credit card , wait for the sounds to arrive, browse through presets, select a a sound and try to squeeze it in your muusic with eq and compression or try and tweak it somehow cos u don't understand how the sound was made. total: hours

obviously learning a synth well takes time (and yes presets can be useful for learning)....but ultimately an elctronic musician should strive to know how to use at least one synth inside out (the synth is one of the core instruments of an electronic musician) ...unless he plans to make shitty generalistic edm ala avcii or just be a keayboard player.
someone who just plays back presets is using the synth as a rompler...not as a synth.
in the history of electronic music "sound design" was always integral part of the music making process. an electronic musician who doesn't try and push boundaries synthwise is not worth listening .

btw all these preset threads in instruments i'm not sure are really the result of high demand...but more the result of these so called "sound designers" spamming. they open preset threads and bump them no end . the actual majority of kvr in a recent poll voted to not even have preset threads in this main section. that says it all.
the kvr "sound designer" is a very strange phenomenon (probably the result of difficult financial times). they are generally musicians who are not yet good enough to produce music but as soon as they vaguely learn how to use a synth to make basic sounds they feel entitled to spam kvr with presets hoping to make some money from newbies and wannabes or find some sort of status among peers.
and most of them just copy sounds from popular music productions . hence they are copying sounds which were actually made by musicians and producers first. which shows that the really good musicians/producers don't actually need sounds from these "sound designers" and ironically it's exactly the other way round.

You can't make it to MTV without presets.
If you tweak your own, you'll get a mention in Sound on Sound for a squeaky demo, at best.

j/k

daft punk, depeche mode, chromeo, la roux etc manage just fine.
infact i don't know any existing good electronic musician which relies on presets.

btw i used "sound designer" in quotes throughout my post cos a true sound designer is actually someone who makes sounds for tv , movies or videogames (anything but music!).
the job descriptor "sound designer" was specifically introduced to indicate someone who used synths and instruments catering to other mediums but music.
someone who made sounds with synths for music related purposes was either a musician or a producer (or "synth programmer" was used too occasionally when dealing with the dx7 or huge modulars)
the term "sound designer" got raped since the late 90s when rob papen started using the term inappropriately to describe himself when releasing his virus soundsets (copying popular trance and pop productions sounds) and others soon followed suit like the guy from vengeance sound (who would release exact copies of the sounds he heard in other dance productions).then it caught on quickly on kvr.

now the situation is this:
basically the person who comes up with the original sound is simply an electronic musician/producer.
then one who tries to copy those sounds or anyone who spams forums selling presets "a sound designer"
and the ones using the presets wannabes looking for a shortcut to sound like the stuff they hear on tv (and these are the majority and unfortunately the reason why there's so much shitty unexciting music nowadays )

sorry if this offends anyone but i'm very passionate about music, and imo preset culture is the cancer of modern electronic music .

For most of us it's just a hobby, sir.

[tanabarbier]

You can be pasionate about music without being disrespectul.

Well I do agree, I think I personaly haven't been even just a bit disrespectful.

I think that one marvelous thing about electronic music is that you can make the sounds, compose, mix and master, and so be a 100% responsible of the result, like a painter of his paintings.

That's prolly because painters usually paint, instead of thinking all day long how to invent never seen before colours (ok, some actually did) You can have total control over your music: you're the one "painting" the song note by note, you decide what sounds to use and so on. Stock presets are not the enemy - getting stuck in your own awesomeness is (talking in general)

Stock preset are not the enemy, the enemy is the inner part of someone that makes him take the easy road. I don't exclude myself, I am more harsh on myself than I am on others.
Then again, to me art is about diversity of highly personal propositions, so nothing wrong about using presets, neither MIDI files that you find for free or buy, or "audio to MIDI" coming form your favorite hits, nothing wrong about sampling. Everything is about what you do, how you do it, and how personal you sound.
The only problem is that at the end when it tastes funny because of too much industrialy procesed ingredients, well it just tastes funny.

[Frantz]

I agree with this philosophy in the general sense. If I like a sound that has a arp melody, I will almost always disable the arp. Composition is MY job.

On the other hand, if the arp is, say, a standard repetition of 8th notes on a bass, etc., I may keep it.

I totally agree. I have no problem using generic up/down arp patterns that nobody wrote. But if the arp pattern is a distinctive riff, I never use it and write my own to avoid Vanilla Ice syndrome.

[Frantz]

@Frantz: because if fits the song. It's that simple

Suit yourself. While I don't mind people using presets in general. In this specific case (preset + arp with distinctive riff), I think you are being lazy.

As for the pattern...it's just a pattern

Yes, it's a very nice pattern written by Vangelis.

In fact, try identifying the other presets used in that song - see if you can see from what synth and bank they are 'Cause I certainly can't without opening the project

I don't have a mental encyclopedia of all presets that would allow me to recognize them. However, I have a fairly good knowledge of 70s and early 80s electronic music. If you used another preset + arp that replicated something famous from that period, I would have probably picked it up.

[trimph1]

where is this b.s about "you are not a real musician" stuff coming from?

good grief...leave the elitist garbage behind and deal with it...ppl gonna use whatever the beep they wanna use....sheeesh...

[chaosWyrM]

i use presets all the time. most of the time i tweek them, sometimes i dont. what i do do however is run just about everything through complicated effect chains...the end result sounding nothing like the preset originally did. i find using effects enables far more creative and unique sounds than a synth makes on its own.

i dont see the problem with that...my creativity lies in another areas besides synth programming. why should it matter?

its a silly thing to care about. why should electronic musicians be held to a higher standard than say mozart who used the preset sound his harpsichord made? its not the sounds you use...but how you use the sounds.

[The_Hidden_Goose]

I do like the idea of music "tasting funny" though!

[Sendy]

Speaking of elitism, I swear in the late 90's I was in a community forum and I met a guy who swore blind that if you worked with electronic instruments and didn't understand electronics it "invalidated your work".

Man alive, that guy was a deck.

[tanabarbier]

why should electronic musicians be held to a higher standard than say mozart who used the preset sound his harpsichord made? its not the sounds you use...but how you use the sounds.

Just for the sake of discution

Well because electronic music is particular, it has the possibility of scuplting sounds impossible in nature, and for a good part of it is based on that. We love that it sounds just different. If we compare with "classical" tradition, I feel that were we are now with electronic music is more of something like early 20th century: some people have brought new things by precisely looking at the timbres and how they count as important part of the composition, and we will need a giant kick in the nuts (WW2 like) to change the way we percieve (and thus make) music.

[chaosWyrM]

why should electronic musicians be held to a higher standard than say mozart who used the preset sound his harpsichord made? its not the sounds you use...but how you use the sounds.

Just for the sake of discution

Well because electronic music is particular, it has the possibility of scuplting sounds impossible in nature, and for a good part of it is based on that. We love that it sounds just different. If we compare with "classical" tradition, I feel that were we are now with electronic music is more of something like early 20th century: some people have brought new things by precisely looking at the timbres and how they count as important part of the composition, and we will need a giant kick in the nuts (WW2 like) to change the way we percieve (and thus make) music.

i understand the point but, just because you have the possibility do something...doesnt mean you must.

it would be like saying since there is computer generated art...all computer generated art must be images of things no one has ever seen before. if someone made a computer generated image that was a still life of a bowl of fruit...somehow thats not art because he "should" have made something else?

[Crackbaby]

As for question asked last page: Yes i make all my drumsounds from the ground up
The first thing im going to do when i get my Analog Four tomorrow is to delete all pattern and patches! Im THAT elitist!

---
Just a reminder: I only complained on presetusing when it comes to psytrance/trance where things sound so generic and bland. I hate the idea of creative and forward thinking musicians get drowned by all those productive presetusers (a la nexus).

I have very high respect for Theo, Lotuzia and Ingo among many many others here. I respect your profession and i enjoy listening to your demotracks when you make them. Thought i should mention that..

[chaosWyrM]

---
Just a reminder: I only complained on presetusing when it comes to psytrance/trance where things sound so generic and bland.

ah...theres your problem right there. you need to make the jump over to darkpsy. its far FAR more creative (well the good stuff anyway).

[briandc]

I couldn't vote! The reason: My answer would have been, "it depends on the synth."

Some synths have a wide variety of wonderful presets, and so far I've just used those. (ie. ZynAddSubFX)

Other synths have nice presets, and I sometimes tweak from those. (ie WhySynth)

Other synths have few presets, and I enjoy tweaking away! (ie amSynth... 11 banks (128 patches each) so far..)


brian

[Lotuzia]

As for question asked last page: Yes i make all my drumsounds from the ground up
The first thing im going to do when i get my Analog Four tomorrow is to delete all pattern and patches! Im THAT elitist!

---
Just a reminder: I only complained on presetusing when it comes to psytrance/trance where things sound so generic and bland. I hate the idea of creative and forward thinking musicians get drowned by all those productive presetusers (a la nexus).

I have very high respect for Theo, Lotuzia and Ingo among many many others here. I respect your profession and i enjoy listening to your demotracks when you make them. Thought i should mention that..

No problemo Crackbaby, that's how I understood it

Just do what makes you the happiest, and enjoy music

[thecontrolcentre]

I use them if they fit. Usually they don't.