Well, another iLok drama unfolding

[dayjob]

some people like the dongles and they're more convenient for them. people w/multiple systems in a studio who need to move thing around a lot etc.. dongle is way more simple than entering a bunch of serial #'s or whatever.

I've always been a proponent of "please just give us another option. keep your dongle but let us do something else as well" and of course.. 2 installs would be nice.. 1 for laptop 1 for desktop.

i hate dongles.. i hate lot's of things i think are dumb and i avoid them. no big deal. but doesn't mean i'm "right" just means i know what works for me and what doesn't.

so, use your dongles all day long or whatever.. i hope they never cause a problem for you... ever. really.

but when Pace/iLok shits the bed i can't help but feel glad i don't use their shitty shit and also feel sorry for all the people inconvenienced. it's a drag.

[Hink]

well i hate all copy protection, I would rather be trusted...just like where I live I have double locks on all my doors and yet I grew up half my life in a place where entry could have been gained at anytime (we had a cabin on a lake in Maine, not only did we have windows that didn't lock there was one deputy for like three tows and becauseit was so remote anyone could have robbed us blind during the winter).

But let me ask this...is it possible that if it were not for copy protection some of the best software would be gone because the companies would go out of business? I say that's highly likely so yes when such things happen it's going to piss me off, I am going to rant too...but every storm passes and then it's time to move on.

So I hate copy protection, but it beats the alternative which could mean losing software I really like...a dongle is a small pita (even if it shuts down one piece of software for a month) compared to all the good that software has brought to improve my passion and how I enjoy my passion. I'm sorry if others cannot see their way to that point, but that's not my problem.

FWIW I think the 'choice' is the best route, but I am not going to be able to change any company's mind on that so I must live with it or find something else.

Edit: btw I would not celebrate a company going out of business...companies have employees that do not make the decisions but will suffer if the company fails so that IMHO is a terrible statement to make...I bet you would not want me to say..."I hope you lose your job because I dont like your bosses"

[Mr Arkadin]

Edit: btw I would not celebrate a company going out of business...companies have employees that do not make the decisions but will suffer if the company fails so that IMHO is a terrible statement to make...I bet you would not want me to say..."I hope you lose your job because I dont like your bosses"

A company's right to exist should not be based on how many people they employ but whether they provide a good service.

[The_Hidden_Goose]

It would be better if that company changes it's practices due to the pressure of people not buying their stuff anymore (and in the case of companies that use PACE to licence their software that would include them). I don't think these slanging matches and debates really make a dent in that - it's the practical and real-world effects that make the difference, and they still haven't (yet) put enough people off them (including devs) to make that much of an impact.

Some have changed and moved away from iLok.

Some, or at least one that I know of, offer a choice of dongle (XILS). If a company is going to use dongles to protect their software, they are unlikely to offer an undongled version, as this would effectively negate the whole purpose of using the dongles - in that there would be versions of their software out there that are easier to crack. I think that's the best you're going to get there.

[Hink]

Edit: btw I would not celebrate a company going out of business...companies have employees that do not make the decisions but will suffer if the company fails so that IMHO is a terrible statement to make...I bet you would not want me to say..."I hope you lose your job because I dont like your bosses"

A company's right to exist should not be based on how many people they employ but whether they provide a good service.

that's one way of looking at it, I still choose not to wish ill will on others for things out their control. That certainly does not mean I support a company not giving good service, if the bosses are making bad business decisions replace them. Maybe some of the employees can step up and turn the company around. Whether I had any interest in a company or not I would much rather see that then another company going out of business. Of course that's not always going to happen, but that doesn't mean I cannot empathize with the workers who get caught in the crossfire.

[Hink]

It would be better if that company changes it's practices due to the pressure of people not buying their stuff anymore (and in the case of companies that use PACE to licence their software that would include them). I don't think these slanging matches and debates really make a dent in that - it's the practical and real-world effects that make the difference, and they still haven't (yet) put enough people off them (including devs) to make that much of an impact.

Some have changed and moved away from iLok.

Some, or at least one that I know of, offer a choice of dongle (XILS). If a company is going to use dongles to protect their software, they are unlikely to offer an undongled version, as this would effectively negate the whole purpose of using the dongles - in that there would be versions of their software out there that are easier to crack. I think that's the best you're going to get there.

but there is the point I brought up earlier in this thread...dongles have got a new life, a new world...a second chance...google and amazon have streaming dongles. Dongles as we know it could change quite a bit, not just for copy protection but for data storage as well. Imagine a wifi ilok that not only had your serial number but also had all your projects on a cloud. I am not suggesting I want this...it's just an example of how dongles may change. They may all really start going into streaming, data storage, copy protection...who knows..but I think things are changing and the word dongle is going to become far more popular in the future...but that's just me

[Gamma-UT]

Maybe before leaping into a thread with both feet, perhaps take some time to read the posts. No-one has criticised Compyfox for wanting to use dongles – they are simply reacting to his refusal to pay attention to what's actually happened. He has repeatedly misconstrued the situation and then wonders aloud why people disagree with his points.

I use iLok-protected products. I have no interest in pushing them out of business. I do, however, have an interest in PACE not acting like dickwads at every possible opportunity.

[Jace-BeOS]

Good summary. If anyone should be out there defending dongle use by example, it should be PACE and such behaving like good citizens, treating their customers right. "Lead by example". Instead, they abuse... because they can and it's just business and etc...

[The_Hidden_Goose]

but there is the point I brought up earlier in this thread...dongles have got a new life, a new world...a second chance...google and amazon have streaming dongles. Dongles as we know it could change quite a bit, not just for copy protection but for data storage as well. Imagine a wifi ilok that not only had your serial number but also had all your projects on a cloud. I am not suggesting I want this...it's just an example of how dongles may change. They may all really start going into streaming, data storage, copy protection...who knows..but I think things are changing and the word dongle is going to become far more popular in the future...but that's just me

I think u might be right about that Hink, and I'm not entirely resistant to the furthering of the basic technology behind them. Any tech is troubled in it's infancy, and there'll be other bright ideas based on the general concepts that come before. That's technology, and I'd be a fool to discount that completely.

[Hink]

Maybe before leaping into a thread with both feet, perhaps take some time to read the posts. No-one has criticised Compyfox for wanting to use dongles – they are simply reacting to his refusal to pay attention to what's actually happened. He has repeatedly misconstrued the situation and then wonders aloud why people disagree with his points.

I use iLok-protected products. I have no interest in pushing them out of business. I do, however, have an interest in PACE not acting like dickwads at every possible opportunity.

I did not say people were jumping on him for using a dongle...I said they were jumping on him for disagreeing and having a different read on the situation. I surely did not single you out in any way or suggest you do not use dongles. I did read the thread and tbh I think people making a mountain out of a molehill

[Hink]

but there is the point I brought up earlier in this thread...dongles have got a new life, a new world...a second chance...google and amazon have streaming dongles. Dongles as we know it could change quite a bit, not just for copy protection but for data storage as well. Imagine a wifi ilok that not only had your serial number but also had all your projects on a cloud. I am not suggesting I want this...it's just an example of how dongles may change. They may all really start going into streaming, data storage, copy protection...who knows..but I think things are changing and the word dongle is going to become far more popular in the future...but that's just me

I think u might be right about that Hink, and I'm not entirely resistant to the furthering of the basic technology behind them. Any tech is troubled in it's infancy, and there'll be other bright ideas based on the general concepts that come before. That's technology, and I'd be a fool to discount that completely.

maybe with any luck at all dongles will be better for us too...maybe PACE will add more jobs trying to service their expanded uses...maybe I'll hit the lottery Seriously, there could be a change in the air coming from a whole different direction, I'm in wait and see mode

[hibidy]

brother, nobody is attacking compyfox. Other than one instigator and compyfox's "interesting" POV, I see mostly people that are concerned about this issue.

[Gamma-UT]

I did read the thread and tbh I think people making a mountain out of a molehill

So, let's see. A number of people complain that PACE removed licences from their dongle, for which they had paid hundreds of dollars on the secondhand market (and in some cases from the original publisher), with almost no warning and told not to contact PACE over the matter. This is a molehill? OK, whatever.

[Compyfox]

It would be better if that company changes it's practices due to the pressure of people not buying their stuff anymore (and in the case of companies that use PACE to licence their software that would include them).

Oh yeah, let's thread another company with "no purchases". LinPlug dropped their USB key protection due to this. Shows how we are such good people.

...they are simply reacting to his refusal to pay attention to what's actually happened. He has repeatedly misconstrued the situation and then wonders aloud why people disagree with his points.

I did read the thread and tbh I think people making a mountain out of a molehill

I have read the thread in question and posted accordingly from my perspective as iLok user. I also agree with Hink's viewpoint.

End of story.

[Hink]

I did read the thread and tbh I think people making a mountain out of a molehill

So, let's see. A number of people complain that PACE removed licences from their dongle, for which they had paid hundreds of dollars on the secondhand market (and in some cases from the original publisher), with almost no warning and told not to contact PACE over the matter. This is a molehill? OK, whatever.

so now you are going to start an argument with me on this? Save your time, I wont argue, you are 100% right and I am 100% wrong, better? How will changing my mind or compyfox's mind on this going to change anything? Like I said in my post you responded to, I think more time is being lost to this argument than time that has actually been lost because of an issue with a dongle...YMMV