I think Logic Pro only has PDC on insert FX. Correct me if I am wrong.munchkin wrote:Look ahead limiters, delays, reverbs, synths are just a few of the plugin types that may require PDC I think. There is also the issue of how plugins are routed in a host to consider. Some hosts have PDC on insert FX only while others have PDC on busses as well.
I think you're right.christianmusicmaker wrote:I think Logic Pro only has PDC on insert FX. Correct me if I am wrong.munchkin wrote:Look ahead limiters, delays, reverbs, synths are just a few of the plugin types that may require PDC I think. There is also the issue of how plugins are routed in a host to consider. Some hosts have PDC on insert FX only while others have PDC on busses as well.
, but anyway it's not like ableton are saying they already had it on the box and deceiving anyone, people are downloading the demo and being very happy with the app, abletons not strongarming anyone making them throw away their copy of sonar or Logic, shoot I still have my copy of Sonar if you want pdc you can have it 
. Hi Stale bread...but isn't it just great dicussing Live 4 which is a very positive development in the Music industry rather than bugs fixes and patches?stale bread wrote:so here we are at this conclusion. Live 4 looks to be a great app, pdc is important, ableton have even said that they are going to implement it so I don't know what all the fuss is about
Alan I am a fan of the software you're right but I just wish folks could calm down, nobody is going to use Live if they don't Like it and I think that's enough protection.
Whilst everything should be sample accurate on playback, real time delay compensation breaks the law of causality and therefore is, always has been and always will be, impossible.dr.wackler wrote:As much as I would like to have a great laugh about thisnuffink wrote:Whilst everything should be sample accurate on playback, real time delay compensation breaks the law of causality and therefore is, always has been and always will be, impossible.munchkin wrote:But it doesn't seem to work this way in Sonar 3. This has full PDC and it's possible to play synths in realtime including my Virus without perceived delay. Even look-ahead limiters seem to work ok.
Instead of saying that everything but the compensated tracks is being delayed, you could also say that the compensated tracks are pre-read. What you hear and what you see (e.g. the position-line in your playing arrangement) is realtime except for the compensated (pre-read) tracks, since the only latency you had was from pressing the start button to the actual beginning of playback.
This means, unless you have a plugin that needs to be compensated for in the audiopath of the instrument that you want to play in realtime, there should be no problem playing it without noticable delay. Am I right or did I miss something?
The real problem with Ableton Live and PDC would be triggering clips on tracks with PDC'ed plugins, and that's why it makes no sense for a live use - and thus also for one of the finest features of Live in the studio use: Jamming along an arrangement and arranging in realtime.
But that is similar to what nuffink is saying and you've just provided two examples: PDC will cause problems in the context of playing live 1) if you put PDC-based plugins on the track of the instrument you are playing live and 2) if you trigger tracks that have PDC-based plugins on them during (in the middle of) a live session. Each of those cases cause fundamental problems.This means, unless you have a plugin that needs to be compensated for in the audiopath of the instrument that you want to play in realtime, there should be no problem playing it without noticable delay. Am I right or did I miss something?
The real problem with Ableton Live and PDC would be triggering clips on tracks with PDC'ed plugins, and that's why it makes no sense for a live use
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