Why don't you like rap/hiphop ?

[BONES]

Have a listen to some Immortal Technique, not all of it is that well produced, very underground repetitive beats etc. - but the lyrics are highly politically charged.

How can it work to a backing of soundtrack-like orchestral strings and girly piano? Compare "Point of No Return" to LEAETHER STRIP's "Zyclon-B" [mentioned in both songs]. Its like saying a Stan Ridgway ballad or Little River Band is "charged". Any energy/feeling in the vocals is totally diffused by the Romper Room [kid's show] backing track. It just doesn't work.

[soulkraka]

It just doesn't work IMO.

[ugo]

Please, take a listen to Jay-z's "You don't know" (produced by Just Blaze):
http://users.volja.net/neres/YouDontKnow.mp3
... and tell me what's not good about this song.

- his delivery is really weak. it lacking strength, power and creativity. he's just walking through it. it sounds like he isnt even trying to do a good performance.

if you've got a rap / hip-hop track that isnt mainly about the beats, arrangements, melodies, etc. then it has to be about the vocals...it has to be about the rap. the thing is, rap is a form of spoken word. its poetry. but if the poetry sucks and the poet cant recite with emotion, then there is nothing left worth listening to. imho, that is the case with this track.

- the track is painfully monotnous. sure, it aint easy to do minimalist arrangements and still keep the listeners attention...but its one of the things that can seperate the greats from everyone else. juding by this track, again only imho, jay-z and his producer are just 'everyone else.'

- the mix isnt so great either. the vocals arent integrated into the performance in the least. it sounds exactly like is it...a guy talking over a pre-recorded track.

now truth be told, i havent been an avid listener of (the various forms of) hip-hip for about 15 years. i dug a lot of stuff in the 80's and early 90's and public enemy i always considered to be the pinicle. i was really excited to see how hip-hop would grow and develop.

instead it went into stagnation.

as hip-hop became increasingly more commercialized and the only requirement for a record deal became the ability to deliver a poorly crafted dialog about being a low-life over the exact same beats and the same damn p-funk synth samples, my interest rapidly dwindled. i thought the genre held so much promise, but i was really disheartened by what it was turning into.

before too long after that, i stopped listening, got into a whole bunch of other styles, and totally missed out on all that hip-hop has gone through all this time. when i did hear some, i was usually turned off by hearing obvious formulas (or at least formulas that didnt grab me) and extreme over production, giving the tracks an uncreative, manufactured sound.

but of course, due to the infrequency that i was listening, i'd only be hearing an extremely small sampling (no pun intended) of what was actually out there. to make matters worse, i was only hearing the most mainstream stuff. the mainstream in most genres is not the best work but rather just what record companies chose to make sell the best. so more often than not, i was probably hearing some of the worst hip-hop had to offer, not the best. (though i have dug a bunch of the missy elliott tracks i've heard.)

but anyway, as a result, my interest in hip-hop was not rekindled and i didnt venture forth to hear what else the genre had to offer.

of course, now i kind of wish i had given it more of a chance because i know i've missed out on some great stuff, but there you have it. one of these days i really ought to dig back catch up on what i've been missing all this time, as well as see what the best work is on offer today.

-ugo

[The Chase]

TBH, I cant stand most hip hop but there is that 5% that I just LOVE.

And I think that pretty much somes up everything that this thread is about

Unless you slavishly follow some genre to death, then you are only gonna like about 5% of its output (if that actually makes sense).

exactly. I probably like no more than 5% of any genre.

[The Chase]

Please, take a listen to Jay-z's "You don't know" (produced by Just Blaze):
http://users.volja.net/neres/YouDontKnow.mp3
... and tell me what's not good about this song.

i like a lot of rnb/hip hop, and i hate that song and its terrible, despite jay-z putting out a bunch of other good music.

Also some other songs, like "Drop it like it's hot". What's wrong with that song?

that song is alright, but just because of snoop's prior reputition.

[TeeLangSun]

BONES, do remember that you haven't heard all hiphop in the world - probably not even a small fraction of it considering your comments.

So you'd lump Public Enemy in with all the current krap, would you? usually in these threads they are quoted as a shining example of everythign that hip-hop should be. I think the're krap.

besides, 5 sounds is one more than a standard rock trio has, haha.

Yes, and if the bass player didn't play anything and the guitarist played the same bland riff through an entire song without any variation in tone, it would still sound better than that song but that band wouldn't get very far. Anyway, a trio has 3 voices, making for a total of 6 instruments.

So Bones, you don't like Rap. It's totally understandable. I totally understand why people don't like rap. They have no way of relating to it. Same reason I don't like heavy metal or the kind of screaming and yelling music that you do. And I don't mean that to be offensive, but that's what it sounds like. A lot of screaming while somebody else happens to be playing some instrument. I'm certain that it makes total sense to you and your fans, but makes no sense to outsiders. But what I don't understand is why most of the people in this thread, including you, feel that you're qualified to judge rap music. The most I can say about the music you do is, I don't like it, but if your fans think that you're the greatest band in the world, then I have no reason to dispute it. Who am I to say it is or isn't? You guys should extend the same courtesy to other forms that you have no way of relating to and are not qualified to judge.

[Mr Smith]

My question is why DO people like hiphop/rap? Why hiphop is the commecially most sucessful new genre is a true mystery for me... ok if it stayed underground but what attracts people? no melodies (except for stolen ones), not much of a dancegroove at all and a guy who rytmically talks about nonsense, in my ears he is just annoying after 2 minutes.

Guess we only got one thing that could attract people, the tits & asses and the cool/redicilous culture and the attitudes that surrounds the music. Yeah, it must be...

[vurt]

yep,and your mum thought elvis was shite too,and so on...

[Mr Smith]

yep,and your mum thought elvis was shite too,and so on...

?

[vurt]

as we get older we dont understand that which follows...

[The Chase]

What i dont understand is why people look down upon music that is based on rythem and percussion as opposed to melody. Some people are preferably attracted to it. If you make friends with someone who likes rap/hip hop/RnB and they also are not an MTV robot sheep then you will find a lot that their music has quite a bit to offer.

Mr. Smith, the comment you just made makes it obvious the only intention you have of the genre is the poppy fluffy shit that mtv and clear channel are pushing everywhere.

For the record, just about everyone likes "A Tribe Called Quest"

[soulkraka]

as we get older we dont understand that which follows...

[diverdee]

Have a listen to some Immortal Technique, not all of it is that well produced, very underground repetitive beats etc. - but the lyrics are highly politically charged.

How can it work to a backing of soundtrack-like orchestral strings and girly piano? Compare "Point of No Return" to LEAETHER STRIP's "Zyclon-B" [mentioned in both songs]. Its like saying a Stan Ridgway ballad or Little River Band is "charged". Any energy/feeling in the vocals is totally diffused by the Romper Room [kid's show] backing track. It just doesn't work.

As I said - the early stuff especially is often comparatively poor musically - I dig the guys lyrics though.
& the 'doesn't work' is indeed your opinion, as someone else stated.
Revolutionary volume 2 has better production values & i'm waiting to see where Immortal Technique progresses to.
To be honest I (imo) feel that he would benefit from a bit of the old defjux style production, some mad el-p shit like cannibal ox's 'cold vein', just my opinion though.

[vurt]

you say wha???

[soulkraka]

hehe...thats gotta be the record for the quickest giffing ever. you must have been in a frenzy there Vurt LOL