Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

DSP, Plug-in and Host development discussion.
User avatar
Aleksey Vaneev
KVRAF
3540 posts since 7 Sep, 2002

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:04 am

Hi! After observing successes of blockchain and cryptocurrencies, I've come up with an idea which could benefit producers of free audio plugins and create a kind of "stock market" for free audio plugins industry. I think this idea is doable, but since I'm a resident of Russia I have legal limitations to work on it myself. Some people with domestic ICO projects ended up in jail. This may be different in other countries like Japan. At this time I may not even be able to benefit from such a project.

Many of you are familiar with the idea of "mining". Its main use is to provide blockchain with data that can't be forged easily. Another use is to create new coins.

The idea is to attribute mined coins not only to miners, but also to producers of free audio plugins, probably in proportion 10% to miners, 90% to producers. Later even commercial producers may become a part of the blockchain.

So, instead of investing resources into "hashing power" which mining uses, one would invest resources into developing and marketing plugins.

The most tricky part here is to how spread the coins between producers. This requires a kind of "consumer proof" similar to "proof of work". Of course, the most complex problem is how to minimize the chance of faking the "consumer proof".

The basic elements of blockchain (they involve public-private key pairs):
wallet (similar to most cryptocurrencies, used to transfer coins)
producer record (name, website)
product record (name, website, producer-defined part number)
consumer record (name, address)
production record (refers to product record and niche index)
consumption record (refers to production record and consumer record)

When a product is "produced" a production record is added to the blockchain. Product also claims a niche (e.g. in the range 0-15), the mined coins are evenly spread between claimed niches, in each niche mined coins are further spread between actually consumed products.

In the case of plugins, "production" means issuance of a single product key.

When a consumer "consumes" a product which mean he downloads and installs a product, a "consumption record" is added to the blockchain, "signed" by the consumer (with an imposed limit of like 1 signature per day or per 1000 blocks, depending on blockchain's frequency). The consumption record claims a production record, production record can be claimed only once.

When miners find a new blockchain block, they process the "consumption records", finalize claims and calculate producer coin rewards.

In a general case, such blockchain requires a central authority for "consumer records" so that they can't be easily faked or robotized.

What's the purpose? Plugin industry reached its peak, most commercial producers frequently offer insane discounts, so the money supply is obviously at the decline. Creating a "stock market" for this industry offers a chance to inject a huge speculative capital from all parts of the world. In the end this may benefit the pro audio user in the form of new innovative products.
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stratum
KVRAF
2118 posts since 29 May, 2012

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:37 am

Hi

That looks like an interesting idea. One thing I wonder, what would be the incentive of miners to attribute coins to plugin producers instead of mining bitcoin with which they can keep the profit to themselves?
~stratum~

User avatar
Aleksey Vaneev
KVRAF
3540 posts since 7 Sep, 2002

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:41 am

stratum wrote:Hi

That looks like an interesting idea. One thing I wonder, what would be the incentive of miners to attribute coins to plugin producers instead of mining bitcoin with which they can keep the profit to themselves?
I'm well into mining at this time (own bitcoin mining contracts). The mining is about cryptocurrency's price and mining competition. New coins without huge miner community are usually always profitable to mine.
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mystran
KVRAF
5035 posts since 12 Feb, 2006 from Helsinki, Finland

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:06 am

Personally I feel cryptocurrencies are just an absolutely terrible idea, because they waste crazy amounts of electric power on the "mining" and therefore contribute to global environmental warming. We should be looking for ways to make the modern society MORE energy efficient, not less.
If you'd like Signaldust to return, please ask Katinka Tuisku to resign.

User avatar
Aleksey Vaneev
KVRAF
3540 posts since 7 Sep, 2002

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:10 am

mystran wrote:Personally I feel cryptocurrencies are just an absolutely terrible idea, because they waste crazy amounts of electric power on the "mining" and therefore contribute to global environmental warming. We should be looking for ways to make the modern society MORE energy efficient, not less.
Who cares about electricity, especially if civilization goes towards solar. The same critique can be said about just every industry - meat and diary production produces toxic waste, paper production generates deforestation, examples are plenty. We all are just fking consumers of this planet. The idea is not about cryptomining - if implemented correctly, miners get only a small stake of the coins.
Last edited by Aleksey Vaneev on Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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stratum
KVRAF
2118 posts since 29 May, 2012

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:12 am

I think producer "record (name, website)" field needs to be changed to "producers record (names, websites, percent share for each)" to allow colloboration.
~stratum~

User avatar
Aleksey Vaneev
KVRAF
3540 posts since 7 Sep, 2002

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:19 am

stratum wrote:I think producer "record (name, website)" field needs to be changed to "producers record (names, websites, percent share for each)" to allow colloboration.
For blockchain this will complicate things a lot, because it will require authority to distribute share of the income. Product development (which includes marketing and many smaller things as well) income distribution should be off the blockchain.
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svrc
KVRist
203 posts since 12 Sep, 2007

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:53 am

"Russia moving quickly now on ICO legislation".

https://www.icoexaminer.com/ico-news/ru ... -ico-bill/

User avatar
VariKusBrainZ
KVRAF
8712 posts since 16 Dec, 2002

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:59 am

I dont understand why bitmining isnt used to resolve useful problems that can benefit mankind, rather than just resolving a pointless problem to generate coins

User avatar
Aleksey Vaneev
KVRAF
3540 posts since 7 Sep, 2002

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:05 am

VariKusBrainZ wrote:I dont understand why bitmining isnt used to resolve useful problems that can benefit mankind, rather than just resolving a pointless problem to generate coins
I've thought about this, the main obstacle is about not faking the work done. For example, it's possible to solve optimization problems instead of finding hashes. The problem is, who will generate the useful optimization problems, how the complexity of optimization problems will be calculated, etc, how miner effort will be evaluated in a "fair" way.

What I've proposed with my idea is the closest thing I've come up with which can make "mining" economically useful in a general sense.
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Miles1981
KVRian
1366 posts since 26 Apr, 2004 from UK

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:18 am

What would people do with these coins?

User avatar
Aleksey Vaneev
KVRAF
3540 posts since 7 Sep, 2002

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:21 am

Miles1981 wrote:What would people do with these coins?
Exchange to USD.
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dreamvoid
KVRist
214 posts since 8 Jun, 2009

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:55 am

Aleksey Vaneev wrote:
mystran wrote:Personally I feel cryptocurrencies are just an absolutely terrible idea, because they waste crazy amounts of electric power on the "mining" and therefore contribute to global environmental warming. We should be looking for ways to make the modern society MORE energy efficient, not less.
Who cares about electricity, especially if civilization goes towards solar. The same critique can be said about just every industry - meat and diary production produces toxic waste, paper production generates deforestation, examples are plenty. We all are just fking consumers of this planet. The idea is not about cryptomining - if implemented correctly, miners get only a small stake of the coins.
When I'm reading something like that, I loose trust in a one-man-company like yours and think twice the next time I want to buy something from Voxengo. Seriously. BitCoin mining and other generated cryptocurrencies are not only a huge waste of energy, but also a parasitic concept, like financial speculations of all sorts, to exploit hard working people. In the end all this number playing is realised into real goods and services people work for. So you exchange some mathematical, energy wasting drivel with real goods and services. It is the epitome of dumb and greedy capitalism.

User avatar
Aleksey Vaneev
KVRAF
3540 posts since 7 Sep, 2002

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:00 am

dreamvoid wrote:
Aleksey Vaneev wrote:Who cares about electricity, especially if civilization goes towards solar. The same critique can be said about just every industry - meat and diary production produces toxic waste, paper production generates deforestation, examples are plenty. We all are just fking consumers of this planet. The idea is not about cryptomining - if implemented correctly, miners get only a small stake of the coins.
When I'm reading something like that, I loose trust in a one-man-company like yours and think twice the next time I want to buy something from Voxengo. Seriously. BitCoin mining and other generated cryptocurrencies are not only a huge waste of energy, but also a parasitic concept, like financial speculations of all sorts, to exploit hard working people. In the end all this number playing is realised into real goods and services people work for. So you exchange some mathematical, energy wasting drivel with real goods and services. It is the epitome of dumb and greedy capitalism.
Well, I just do not pretend I'm a "holy spirit". I obviously consume a lot of natural resources to produce plugins (I eat, I heat, I buy clothes, housing, I buy industry-heavy electronics, I buy electricity, etc). All of us do. But instead of most existing ICO ideas, I've offered something which at least puts the "greedy capitalism" to a good use of producing something useful. And you'll get good products for free.
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PurpleSunray
KVRian
829 posts since 13 Mar, 2012

Re: Free audio plugins blockchain and coin idea

Post Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:37 am

I still don't get what the point on this.

This would a normal AudioCoin crypto-currency, just like BitCoin, but instead of searching hashes you implement audio plugins on mining?

Well.. besides the fact that I think BitCoin is the biggest scam since a long time, I see various problems.

First and foremost:
Developing plugins doesn't scale. If you need more hashing power you add ore ASICs. If you need to more developer power, you need to find a wife and produce some (will take 18 years of rampup time at least).
Also what is during XMass? When all the devs are on vacation? Is the network on pause then becuase no new blocks produced?

And then all the stuff come on top that I don't like on bitcoin.
BitCoin was supposed to be a "free" anternative, w/o greedy banks involved that take transacation costs. AHAHAHA good joke. Transacation cost on BitCoin is way higher than on a bank transfer, so you have replaced greedy banks with even more greedy minres. congrats.
Transactions without a central authority? So what is the coinbase & co than?

The blockchain technical concept might be good, but building chains of hased blocks is nothing new.
What's new is BitCoin and all the fuzz arround, mainly designed to move money from gullible clueless grandma pocket into the pocket of the miner.

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