Presonus Studio One 5.2 vs Cubase 11

[jens]

Nice. Whats wrong with that ?

Everything.

You are still left with numerous clips - instead of just one - that sit on top of each other. Good luck arranging them or slip-editing them.

That is so incredibly stupid and so useless, the mind boggles as to what they were/are thinking. I think you can somehow group them or something (I forgot the specifics) but it's still convoluted and a pain in the arse and completely bizarre that such an expensive DAW in the year 2021 has no proper function for such a basic thing. I feel all dusty just typing this.

[dellboy]

You are still left with numerous clips - instead of just one - that sit on top of each other. Good luck arranging them or slip-editing them.

I am not sure if its a big problem or not. But without consulting the manual I just dragged the top one and it made a new track. I did it again for each of the takes in the pile. You can then edit a chosen take and "bounce to selection". It did not seem that difficult.

I also tried comping in Studio One. It was OK, it did what it said on the tin, but nothing to get exited about.

I then remembered that I had a Reason Lite licence which i have never used and gave that ago. Again, it did what it was supposed to do efficiently and in a simple way. But when I closed all the takes it automatically selected the one being soloed and deleted the rest. Not sure if it was user error or not.

So then I downloaded and installed Reaper. I was pretty blown away by this one. I did not consult a manual, i just right clicked. Wow, that was something else. I think reaper wins for me in the comping stakes.

[oneway]

I think reaper wins for me in the comping stakes.

Give it some time! REAPER was my favorite comping system too initially but it gets really messy overtime. I don’t completely recall the specifics anymore but the longer I worked on a comp or the more edits I did, the more unruly it would get.

All-time I’d say Pro Tools, Studio One, and Logic were the best overall.

[dellboy]

Give it some time! REAPER was my favorite comping system too initially but it gets really messy overtime. I don’t completely recall the specifics anymore but the longer I worked on a comp or the more edits I did, the more unruly it would get.

Yes, I am sure your are right, i only tried it briefly, and only for audio, not midi.

But the first impression was very good. I am so stuck in the old way of just htting delete and then re-recording until i get it right that I have never bothered with takes, but i might give them a go from now on. Probably in Cubase though to see if it is workable. Its hard to imagine that a DAW that is used by top producers does not function to professional standards for something as basic as takes.

[oneway]

Give it some time! REAPER was my favorite comping system too initially but it gets really messy overtime. I don’t completely recall the specifics anymore but the longer I worked on a comp or the more edits I did, the more unruly it would get.

Yes, I am sure your are right, i only tried it briefly, and only for audio, not midi.

But the first impression was very good. I am so stuck in the old way of just htting delete and then re-recording until i get it right that I have never bothered with takes, but i might give them a go from now on. Probably in Cubase though to see if it is workable. Its hard to imagine that a DAW that is used by top producers does not function to professional standards for something as basic as takes.

It's just my opinion but I think Cubase works all right. I could see how someone may not like how it displays the presence of the multiple takes "underneath" the other events with a crosshatch pattern, but in terms of real world use you just open up the lanes and make your edits, or use the right click menu (Cubase is really heavy on right clicking, that menu is massive!).

Personally, I like Studio One a bit better but maybe that's just because I'm used to it. I'd call takes/comping a draw in S1 vs Cubase. Studio One does attach take layers to events by default. Perhaps Cubase doesn't do that by default, though. I find myself using both methods from time to time.

[jens]

You are still left with numerous clips - instead of just one - that sit on top of each other. Good luck arranging them or slip-editing them.

I am not sure if its a big problem or not. But without consulting the manual I just dragged the top one and it made a new track. I did it again for each of the takes in the pile. You can then edit a chosen take and "bounce to selection". It did not seem that difficult.

That is not at all what I meant. I meant just recording multiple takes, then arranging this recording (comping or no comping) - on the SAME track - just as you normally do and as you can easily do in Studio One for example.

I also tried comping in Studio One. It was OK, it did what it said on the tin, but nothing to get exited about.

It doesn't need to be anything to get excited about - all it needs to do is work.

I then remembered that I had a Reason Lite licence which i have never used and gave that ago. Again, it did what it was supposed to do efficiently and in a simple way. But when I closed all the takes it automatically selected the one being soloed and deleted the rest. Not sure if it was user error or not.

It never does that afaik - I think it was user-error in-as-much as you apparently did not realize that you can re-open the editor whenever you like by simply double-clicking on the clip. All your takes you ever recorded to that clip (regardless of whether you did it in the same session or another time) are still there until you delete them manually.

The clip is a single clip that is a container for an unlimited number of takes that you can comp to your heart's desire. Regardless of how many takes you recorded and regardless of how many individual snippets your composite uses, it is just a single clip, unless you split it yourself.

THAT is how I think it should be done.

So then I downloaded and installed Reaper. I was pretty blown away by this one. I did not consult a manual, i just right clicked. Wow, that was something else. I think reaper wins for me in the comping stakes.

It's certainly okay.

[dellboy]

or use the right click menu (Cubase is really heavy on right clicking, that menu is massive!).

I am on cubase 10.5 and right clicking does not work for some reason, all I get is the toolbar showing up. What am I doing wrong ?

[dellboy]

That is not at all what I meant. I meant just recording multiple takes, then arranging this recording (comping or no comping) - on the SAME track - just as you normally do and as you can easily do in Studio One for example.

Isnt that what "lanes" does in Cubase ? I see no reason why the edited audio cannot be left there for future reference just like in Reason ?

It never does that afaik - I think it was user-error in-as-much as you apparently did not realize that you can re-open the editor whenever you like by simply double-clicking on the clip. All your takes you ever recorded to that clip (regardless of whether you did it in the same session or another time) are still there until you delete them manually.

The clip is a single clip that is a container for an unlimited number of takes that you can comp to your heart's desire. Regardless of how many takes you recorded and regardless of how many individual snippets your composite uses, it is just a single clip, unless you split it yourself.

Yes, it was user error, i was clicking on the little loudspeaker and you should double click on the track to audition. I found double clicking irritating. Just one click would suffice. I looked at the help file but could not find out how to do basic audio editing on the comped audio ?

[EnGee]

or use the right click menu (Cubase is really heavy on right clicking, that menu is massive!).

I am on cubase 10.5 and right clicking does not work for some reason, all I get is the toolbar showing up. What am I doing wrong ?

Ctrl + right click (in Windows)

[jens]

Isnt that what "lanes" does in Cubase ? I see no reason why the edited audio cannot be left there for future reference just like in Reason ?

That is not the issue - the issue is that you end up with numerous clips that sit on top of each other, as I already explained - we are really going in circles here.

[jens]

I found double clicking irritating. Just one click would suffice.

Nope, a single click selects the clip - as is the case with every DAW I know of... how else would you do that then?

I looked at the help file but could not find out how to do basic audio editing on the comped audio ?

What kind of audio-editing do you have in mind?

[dellboy]

That is not the issue - the issue is that you end up with numerous clips that sit on top of each other, as I already explained - we are really going in circles here.

Yes,they do sit on top of each other until you click the "lanes" button,and then they are displayed below in just the same manner as Reason does it after double clicking. I am not sure if you have been doing something wrong in Cubase, but it does not behave as you describe it. Both DAWs do an equal job in this regard.

[dellboy]

Nope, a single click selects the clip - as is the case with every DAW I know of... how else would you do that then?

Not on Reason Lite 11. I have looked in options and preferences, but it needs a double click to hear the take you wish to audition. A single click turns it from light to dark grey, which does not appear to do anything. A double click turns the take yellow, and then the change is heard. In Cubase after displaying the lanes you single click the button at the bottom of the takes to audition them.

What kind of audio-editing do you have in mind?

In Cubase you double click on a lane to bring up a comprehensive audio editor at the bottom of the screen. Reason appears to be limited to a few right click items like turning off stretch and adding slice markers. Nothing serious in the audio editing department unless I am missing something, just basic functions. But as i said, this is just the Lite version, and the full version may be more comprehensive.

[jancivil]

Steinberg's practices at this time are big on new features and small on bug repair, it appears. But one may not notice the bugs, it depends. Lotta 'em I never have to see. I think the plague has impacted the company like everything, to be fair. Historically some things don't get fixed until the next paid cycle.

I'm not sure that's fair. Which bugs do you feel have not been fixed in a given version?

That almost looks like a rhetorical question, starting off coloring the statement as unfair, ie., instead of a good-faith question states it mustn't be true. It's pretty crass IME.

i am certainly not going by feeling or an impression. Here's one, and I'm not going to type more to this kind of "question". In version 5, the parabola tool would not resolve where you end up placing it on the right end. It was way, way off. It was not fixed during the life of the version, 5.5.3 (was fixed some time later certainly but I skipped 6, 7 and 8.0). This is a fact, everybody that has ever worked with that version who used that rather ubiquitous tool knows it.

[oneway]

In regards to Studio One vs Cubase, I’m not sure I’d give either of them the W in terms of bug prioritization. In Studio One (and it sounds like Cubase as well) there are plenty of bug fixes, but they seem to be performed based on expediency or proximity to something else they were working on, not based on how much they affect the standard tools or the average workflow. Your post about the parabola tool brings to mind a handful of features in Studio One with similar histories. With one of them, it had been so long that eventually they thought it always worked like that. Thankfully there was a video from when the feature was released that showed it working differently. It still didn't get them to fix it any faster, it was fixed another 2 years after I pointed that out to them.