Audio Engineering

[Just Float]

Is anyone here currently going to school or has previously been a student at a school for audio engineering? Is this the same thing as music production, like knowing how to produce music in a professional studio?

It seems like knowing the science of how the software and equipment works is somewhat different from just putting them to good use. I'm going to a community college for graphic design and I hate it.

I want to get into sound, wether its sound design or producing. Are there many different fields of expertise in this subject or will it be simple to branch out in the business as you go along?

I will always be making my own sounds, but I don't expect to be #1 on any chart any time soon (and I don't really hope to be), so I want to provide my understanding of computers and technology to others as a way of paying bills and all that.

I don't have any job in mind: television, radio, recording, movies anything as long as I can put my mind to good use. Any reccomendations as far as schooling goes? Are they a waste of time (and money)?

[koolkeys]

I am currently enrolled in SAE Institute of Technology in Nashville.

And yes, audio engineering is the same as music production, although, of course, it's not refined to just music. And music production doesn't have to include everything that you may learn at these schools. They are kind of like a technology program, where you learn what's being used RIGHT NOW in the industry. But as I said, it's not always music related. Many people make their living recording things like books on tape. Hey, it pays the bills.

Anyway, at SAE, it's very hands on. There is alot of classroom time, but alot of these times are with the equipment in front of the class. Then, on the equipment that you really just need to touch, there will be a week in the studio with it after that. So you learn the theory behind the gear(and a ton of other things involved with audio engineering), then you get to work with it, almost from day one.

But the staple of the program is the several hours of lab time every single week, ALL of which is getting your hands on the gear, from the first week you are there, you are working with gear, plug-ins, consoles, etc.

There are hundreds of jobs available in the music industry. And you may not always enjoy your job, but it may be necessary to get where you want to go. You can branch out into the business, it's really up to how hard you want to work.

I, too, am a songwriter and musician, and would like to get my songs out there. But I'm going to school for the reason that I may never get where I want with my music. And who knows, whatever place I work may be my ticket in.

I think in the long run school is very worth it. It's been said in many publications lately, as well as stated by many engineers and producers I've talked to here in Nashville, that it's incredibly hard to get a job in the "industry" without education any more. That's not saying you can't make money without school, but there is so much technology out there right now that you really need to know what you're working with. And school does that. Never anywhere else will I get a chance to learn and work on an SSL or Neve console unless I went to school. And that is what is used here in Nashville. If you can't run one, don't bother trying to get a job.

There are several other advantages to my particular school. We get laptops, a ProTools system as well as other software, and we get certified by Digidesign in ProTools, which is $1000 for the first level if you do it on your own.

Another advantage to most schools, especially SAE, is that there are people there whose job is to place you with employers for internships and more. These are resources that you normally won't find on your own. As a matter of fact, it's near impossible if you don't know the right people.

I hope this helps with your decision. Good luck!

Koolkeys

[tkmattson]

MA or MS in Mass Communications. Take as many audio/video/other classes as you want. Where you wind up will be fully determined in your professional career. I wound up a documentary filmmaker, and I actually make money doing it.

[koolkeys]

MA or MS in Mass Communications. Take as many audio/video/other classes as you want. Where you wind up will be fully determined in your professional career. I wound up a documentary filmmaker, and I actually make money doing it.

I'm not going to say that it's not an option, as obviously you can get where you need by doing this.

However, you will be at school less time by going to an audio engineering school, and it will be focused more on what you need for music and production, especially the gear that is being used in the music industry. And you can learn what you need to do other things besides music.

With Mass Communication, I don't believe that you will get how to EQ a bass drum to fit with the guitar and strings and such. I don't think you will learn how to set the compressor for the band, and learning sampling and mastering and things like that.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not putting down your education or your job, just saying that for what he seems to be interested in, an audio school would probably be better.

Koolkeys

[No name]

I'm about to begin college fall semester myself. I'm heading down the same road you want to go. As well as the same road your already going down KoolKeys. A dream to me now is just to get into Ohio State haha. The music classes there are exceptional I've heard. It's a big struggle. Had alot thrown my way, stopped messing with music AND SCHOOL, dropped out. Went back and finished, got back into music full force and now i'm trying to get into this school. I've thought thousands of times whether or not i'm doing the right thing going for music. But this is just something i've loved and i felt that, even if it's not the best job in the world, if i can do any sorts of audio in any form as a career, i'm gonna be a happy man. But i'll diminish now, i'm not trying to hi jack the thread; the moral i mean to bring up by this is be sure this is something you want to do! And if you do, look forward to a learning curve, but once you learn (after you work work work at it, dont stop!)the pay off is the greatest thing!

[Just Float]

Thanks koolkeys that was very informative. What lead you to go to the school youre going to? How would you suggest I go about researching what school to go to? After all the praise youve given youre own school I might be looking into it.

J - It's the challange that intrigues me! Im so bored with the career im headed towards. Designing business cards? Making restaurant menus? I still love graphic art and I think advertising is in its own deceptive way a very interesting thing. But I can't be comfortable, I need the thrill of not knowing what I might do the next day. I need to know I have oppurtunities. I KNOW that I have enough creative force and understanding of technology to grab this industry by the balls. The past 1-2 years of boredom has convinced me of it. Sound is the most interesting sense I've experienced.

[koolkeys]

A couple things helped me decide to go to the school I'm at. First of all, I'm in Christian music and Nashville is the place to be for that. And there happened to be an SAE there. I had read alot about the school, and took a tour and decided it was for me. It seemed like the quickest, yet most informative way of getting where I wanted to go.

I know people who went to Middle Tennessee State University, which has a great audio program. It took them seven years to complete, and it was over three years before they ever touched a piece of gear. And over seven years, they spent a whole lot of money also. Not quite the path I'd choose. That's how most university programs are. The nice thing about SAE and others is you get to the meat of it all very quickly and learn what's needed. Between classrooms, labs, seminars, and more, you get plenty of information to make it where you want.

This school is fairly priced. In US dollars, I'm paying about $15,800, which seems like alot. But when you consider other schools, like Full Sail, cost twice as much, it's a no-brainer. Yes, there are schools that are less money. But SAE is the largest audio engineering school in the world, with 43 campuses world-wide, and has one of the best reputations. They work hand-in-hand with companies like Mackie, SSL, and more. They teach a huge variety of topics over 9 months(18 months part time). It's very concentrated, and you get to learn on the newest and greatest gear, as well as learning things such as how to use an analog tape machine, how to solder and courses in electronics, from microphone theory and technique to sampling to live sound to studio setup and interfacing and acoustics to sequencing and sampling to signal flow to mastering to effects processors to developing your ear for different situations to so much more. Whew! And I didn't even cover nearly everything! Plus, at SAE, at least here in the States(not sure about elsewhere), you get a laptop with a ProTools system, plus ProTools certification from Digidesign(level one, which costs $100 if you do it on your own), plus some software to help on your laptop.

For SAE, just go to their website, which is www.sae.edu and find the site for a school near you. The Nashville school is nationally accredited, meaning you can get federal financial aid if needed, as well as Sallie Mae loans. Plus their state accredidation puts high requirements on the school to get a high job placement rate(70% or greater is required to keep their doors open!).

No, I don't work for the school. But I do love what I've been through so far, and would recommend for anyone finding a way to go if they truly want to get into the "industry". I use that term lightly because you can be successful without school if you want. But if you want on the "inside", or just want to learn how to make your own studio or record your own music, your chances are a whole lot greater.

Just do some research. The best place to look to find schools is in magazines such as Electronic Musician, Mix magazine, SOS, Keyboard, and others like that. There are ads all through them, especially in the back where the special ads sections are. Look there and go to their websites. I'm sure you'll find something interesting.

Again, good luck! And let me know if you have any specific questions.

Koolkeys

[No name]

Hmm, Koolkeys. SAE interests me now

[deastman]

I have a BA in Audio Engineering and Video Production from San Francisco State University (1992). Of course, back then there were no softsynths, and we were mostly using tape. The audio portion of my degree focused on the technology and techniques of music production from the perspective of an engineer in a recording studio. That means that we learned to align a board, use compression and eq, mic placement, etc. It did not cover anything relating to music composition, such as "here is how to make a tarnce song".

While in school, I started working in graphic design, video production, and 3d animation, which has been my career path ever since.

I can relate to the boredom from designing business cards and such, but the reality is that working in a recording studio, being forced to listen to other peoples crappy songs all day is even worse! Recording studios are shutting down all over the place, and the few jobs which are available pay poorly. You're actually better off in graphic design!

[Just Float]

But I here the same about graphic design. Few jobs, bad pay. I hear that about everything actualy. Few anything, few something. How am I supposed to know which is true. It seems like its all a thing of perspective. Why are these studios "shutting down all over the place". Are people just now realizing that they hate their jobs?

[herodotus]

Why are these studios "shutting down all over the place".

Because professional audio production services are just too damn expensive for your average musician.

And it really is kind of amazing what you can do in a home studio.

Put them together and you get a depressed studio economy.

But even if you don't make money at it, you will never regret learning things.

[deastman]

At least in the San Francisco area, almost all of the recording studios have closed their doors. This is partly due to local issues- the insane rent prices caused by the dot-com boom, followed by the economic depression of the dot-com bust, followed by the once again rising rent prices.

Another issue, however, is that digital technology has dramatically tipped the scales of audio production. You don't have to go into a recording studio to make a studio-quality album. You can do it in your bedroom with a laptop computer. Without getting into a big debate about whether that is truly possible, at the very least that is the perception of many musicians. Why spend thousands in a studio when you can just buy ProTools yourself? I find it rather telling that Quantegy, the last manufacturer of analog audio tape, has now closed its doors.

A friend of mine ran a recording studio, and had to close it down a couple of years ago due to lack of business. He had it packed with every vintage synthesizer imaginable, but no one seemed to have any interest in that. His business came mainly from punk rock bands, and from DJs who wanted him to master their mixes. His chief engineer made $12/hour.

[Shane Sanders]

Interesting thread. I spent two years at Middle Tennessee State University in the Recording Industry program, but really spent most of my hands-on time in the 3D lab. 3D was part of my minor there, and I ended up finding work related to that instead of music. I already had a 4-year degree when I started that program and felt no qualms about not finishing the second degree. I was after a job, not more school debt.

I know several people that have gone on to much better things from MTSU and I know just as many who ended up working in video stores or waiting tables. It just comes down to timing and ambition.

One guy I know works at MasterMix.com. That's a smokin' studio if there ever was one.

The market in both audio and graphics is quite competitive and you probably won't make more than 50K a year in either unless you work for yourself (which means you will work 70 hours a week). To make more than that would mean either going into management or ending up in that rare firm where talent is actually valued. In my experience, creative people are viewed as interesting but ultimately discardable pawns. The money and upward mobility will flow into management positions and not the creative positions.

Seems depressing, but there are perks, too. Few jobs allow you to listen to the music you want during the day (like my graphics job does), and a good engineering job is only going to hone your production skills and provide oogles of opportunity for networking.

[koolkeys]

I know some people who are very successful coming out of MTSU, as it's a fantastic school. But for me, I couldn't afford to take that much time. As you know, it can be a lengthy program.

With studios shutting down, it's just the reality of the day. However, there are thousands of prospering studios around also. Although most, if not all, of your big name producers and engineers have their own home studio where they do their mixing.

This can be another advantage to going to school. You can learn how to set up your own place, if that's the road you choose. I do truly believe it's an essential move to get an education in the field.

Well, gotta go!

Koolkeys

[Just Float]

I'm so lost now. I have no idea of what to do with my life. I hate sitting around here taking classes that dont teach me anything. I dont even care that much for design anymore. Im good at it but it doesnt interest me the way music does.