KVR Audio

greendoor · Post by **greendoor** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 1:15 am

Aleksey - looking forward to a better 2 channel convolution reverb than SIR. Would it be possible to have a stereo width control on the Input? Or even just a Mono button for the input? That would allow us the choice of either independant left/right (which I consider true stereo, but admit is 'wrong' when the dry sound is panned hard left or right). If we had the option to sum the input to mono (just for the wet processing of course) that would give use full stereo room sound, even when the dry sound is panned hard left or right. It would also allow true emulation of the many hardware processors that worked exactly that way.

greendoor · Post by **greendoor** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 1:25 am

Sorry to rant - but sort of answering my own question. This has reminded me of some 'true stereo' hardware reverbs I owned, and they did function as dual mono-to-stereo devices. You could, for example, have a stereo reverb on one input, and a stereo delay on the other. Mono feeds into either input would give a stereo output, and they were great for mixers with two sends per channel.

Some of these devices have a 'true stereo' reverb which obviously had seperate algorithmns for each side. This gave a denser reverb, and a hard panned left or right would still yield a stereo output, although skewed to the left of right respectively. This makes some sense when dealing with digital reverb, because there are relatively few delay lines, and it would be possible to design different delay times for each side. With a sampled real room impulse, in theory that is near-infinite delay lines, and I don't see how it would be possible to accurately make different left and right stereo impulses that wouldn't clash and cause phase problems. Maybe i'm talking shyte, so I'll shut up now

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:01 am

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kylen · Post by **kylen** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 5:08 am

greendoor wrote: With a sampled real room impulse, in theory that is near-infinite delay lines, and I don't see how it would be possible to accurately make different left and right stereo impulses that wouldn't clash and cause phase problems.

I'm up the same tree

waiting man · Post by **waiting man** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 7:59 am

greendoor-I think you should do a big fat search at noisevault.com and dig a few tread with the words "true and stereo".

or take ,in the meanwhile, Elevayta convoboy as well as a set of impulses which has a st channel for left and right, and try it. I suggest the ones from David Gauger (nick:Shofarsogood).

Aleksey Vaneev · Post by **Aleksey Vaneev** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:08 pm

'True stereo' is a term currently used in the trade. It means that each channel produces stereo output. This usually creates a better spatialization of sounds that are to be panned, or contain stereo information. When the signal is panned hard center (mixed to mono), this transforms into a common stereo impulse processing. 'True stereo' processing requires 4 convolution channels to work.

greendoor, stereo width is already implemented in Pristine Space: you can adjust impulse file's stereo width by means of a time-dependent envelope.

Sicklecell666 · Post by **Sicklecell666** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:11 pm

ack, my aching brain..

Ok, so in order to have this Holy True Stereo, we need to load two seperate instances of this effect & load the same IR into each plug instance's two IR inserts?

MickGael · Post by **MickGael** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:20 pm

Hi Aleksey.
Will there be an upgrade path from PristineSpace light to PristineSpace full?

Aleksey Vaneev · Post by **Aleksey Vaneev** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:50 pm

Sickle, two separate instances + 2 different stereo IRs. Some advanced routing should be used, too.

Daniel, there probably won't be a possibility to upgrade in the nearest future, but I will try to make this happen - hopefully after webserver software upgrade and switch to another credit card processing company.

MickGael · Post by **MickGael** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:59 pm

Aleksey Vaneev wrote:Sickle, two separate instances + 2 different stereo IRs. Some advanced routing should be used, too.

Daniel, there probably won't be a possibility to upgrade in the nearest future, but I will try to make this happen - hopefully after webserver software upgrade and switch to another credit card processing company.

Thanks for the info. You know I'll be in.

MadGav · Post by **MadGav** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:21 pm

Aleksey - just tried out the PSL alpha, happily for me its exactly what I'm looking for (the bits of full PS I want at a fraction of the price!). Are you planning to implement the Low quality mode found on full PS? Would be handy to cut cpu load if necessary...

Martin

JeffSanders · Post by **JeffSanders** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:29 pm

I've waited patiently for this thing to come out for some time.

wsaidah · Post by **wsaidah** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:38 pm

Aleksey how about adding stretch like sir

greendoor · Post by **greendoor** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:13 pm

Aleksey Vaneev wrote:'True stereo' is a term currently used in the trade. It means that each channel produces stereo output. This usually creates a better spatialization of sounds that are to be panned, or contain stereo information. When the signal is panned hard center (mixed to mono), this transforms into a common stereo impulse processing. 'True stereo' processing requires 4 convolution channels to work.

greendoor, stereo width is already implemented in Pristine Space: you can adjust impulse file's stereo width by means of a time-dependent envelope.

Thank you Aleksey - I believe i've got my head around it now (which means I probably need to save up for the full version of Pristine Space

)

The term "true stereo" is misleading, but it does seem to be the term that everyone in the convolution reverb business is using. From what I can tell, this is because 99% of the impulses being used are taken from high end hardware digital reverbs. Many of them are stereo-to-stereo devices, meaning that sending sound to the left input will create one stereo image, and sending sound to the right input creates a different stereo image. To capture the full sound of these fabulous machines does require two x stereo impulse files. I was naively thinking I was getting most of the effect with just one stereo impulse, but I can see now that I would be missing out on some important stereo imaging. Probably more important over a stereo mix than over an insert channel ...

So thanks Aleksey for helping me to clear that up. I'm sure your 2 channel one will be nice (I have your AF Impulse), but I can now see the big advantage of having a 4 channel (or more). Maybe you should offer a cheap 4 channel unit (you already have a 2 channel and an 8 channel)

Aleksey Vaneev · Post by **Aleksey Vaneev** » Thu Apr 07, 2005 5:17 am

MadGav, there will be no 'low quality' option.

wsaidah, I'll think about implementing such stretch function, but actually I do not really like how it sounds - this strech shifts the frequency response a lot.

Voxengo Pristine Space Light (alpha)