Hey,
just wondering, what the hell do commercial production studios do to their mixes? I mean like in ultra corporate formula mixes I always hear this... very wide stereo, like almost sparkly stereo imaging going on. I just wonder how the hell they do it. When I load some tracks through mda stereo it ALMOST sounds like it... What the hell do they do ?! I think I'd like to floor all my mixes with it, whatever the hell it is. Anyone know? For a good example listen to like stuff in the theater before movies, its AWFUL music but I really like the sparkly imaging going on!
RonC
What do commercial production studios do on stereo imaging?
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- KVRAF
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
No it cant be that. It's an overall, maybe even mastering bus effect... I wanted to buy ozone but ehh. I mean it cant be layered parts. It's some kind of... sweetener panned out thing.. Lol
*update*
I just loaded in some wideboy and yes this is it, man! I definately can hear it. What do you think about using it on the master bus for older recordings that I dont have separated?
RonC
*update*
I just loaded in some wideboy and yes this is it, man! I definately can hear it. What do you think about using it on the master bus for older recordings that I dont have separated?
RonC
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- KVRAF
- 6596 posts since 21 Jun, 2004 from Secret Underground Hideout
Yes, the trick that makes the worst music listenable. I try to get that effect. It's a good thing I've got halfway decent music in the first place.
I'd love to know the answer to this one.
I'd love to know the answer to this one.
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- KVRAF
- 6596 posts since 21 Jun, 2004 from Secret Underground Hideout
I've tried Wideboy...Time has passed. I'm less of an idiot. I'll try again.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
android get wideboy and pop it on the master bus. its freaking crazy cool. Im just worried about mono listeners 
RonC
RonC
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- KVRian
- 1118 posts since 31 Aug, 2001 from Los Angeles, CA
[movie voice]In a time..... and in a place...Anyone know? For a good example listen to like stuff in the theater before movies, its AWFUL music but I really like the sparkly imaging going on!
I think you are hearing 5.1 in the theater...
I've watched a number of albums be mixed, and watched some top-name mastering guys at work.
Theres nothing I've seen done to the entire mix in terms of "stereoizing". I really think what you hear is proper *mixing* (separation).
Without knowing your specific albums in question, most all modern (heavy) guitar parts are double-tracked and hard-panned. This adds a lot of "stereo". So does proper drum recording.
Chorus type effects can add some motion. Any type of stereoizing effect is going to have consequences and should probably be used with care...
Reminds me of a famous artist who was telling me about hearing his song on AM radio (mono).. it got to one part where he used a stereoizer effect on the vocal..... and the vocal was simply gone!!! Another good reason to check your mixes in mono
-Steve
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- KVRAF
- 25035 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia
good advices, Bitcrusher... the most important trick is to get the mix right...
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- KVRian
- 692 posts since 10 Apr, 2004
Isn't the music in movies in surround sound (5.1, 7.1, etc)?rpc9943 wrote: For a good example listen to like stuff in the theater before movies, its AWFUL music but I really like the sparkly imaging going on!
RonC
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
right what do you think about using some of this stereo image effect on old recordings that kind of need some spicing up?
RonC
RonC
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- KVRian
- 1118 posts since 31 Aug, 2001 from Los Angeles, CA
I think it is important to check mono compatibility and bypass/engage this steroizer, to see how it alters the summed mono "sound". If it sounds worse, then the stereoizer will likely also sound worse (to some people or listening environments).rpc9943 wrote:right what do you think about using some of this stereo image effect on old recordings that kind of need some spicing up?
RonC
Stereoizers that affect the overall signal phase (delay) are going to be major problems for this, and can cause some listeners serious discomfort.
Everyone has different ears, we all literally localize sound from different frequency notches. So if you are tweaking an entire mix too much, it might sound wonderful to you/one listening environment but it might sound horrible to someone else/different listening environment.
Also be careful with LF phase, you probably don't want anything too low (< 80 hz or so) to be very stereo.
-Steve
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- KVRian
- 1243 posts since 24 Oct, 2003 from Maine
I seriously doubt it's some kind of post production thing. That would really damage the sound quality. For people who are hopelessly anal about sound quality like "high-end" studio engineers, I'm sure they would do things during the mix phase to get a nice stereo image.
Here's some ways to widen your mix
-Phase Delays: Simply a left or right channel delay of about 10-20ms, very short. This makes things wide without sounding "chorusy" or having an obvious echo. It's wider, but can still sound "dry." It's used all the time on guitars and pads. Nice if you don't want something to be on "one side."
-Stereo Enhancers: Almost all of these work by feeding the left channel into the right and inverting the phase, then the right to the left and doing the same thing. This makes the differences in each channel louder, and the similarities quieter. Tends to sound unnatural if pushed really hard.
-Double tracking: Record the same thing twice, compress, edit timing, pan opposite. It creates that intimate kind of acoustic guitar sound. Like it's really close to you but not "mono." Everyone's heard it at one time or another. You can do a similar thing with a delay.
-Slapback: Pan something one way, have a pretty quick and more subtle delay in the other channel. Do the same with a counter element in the opposite channel. This one's nice if you want things to sound "big and hall-y." It really widens the mix. I like it personally. Not that great if you wanna do the modern ultra dry thing.
-Something else:
Every studio engineer has their own tricks. One of the keys to becoming a good one is to find your own. Learning from others is obviously a big part too. Records in 10 years won't sound like they do today, so just trying to copy someone else's style will only be so rewarding.
hth!
Here's some ways to widen your mix
-Phase Delays: Simply a left or right channel delay of about 10-20ms, very short. This makes things wide without sounding "chorusy" or having an obvious echo. It's wider, but can still sound "dry." It's used all the time on guitars and pads. Nice if you don't want something to be on "one side."
-Stereo Enhancers: Almost all of these work by feeding the left channel into the right and inverting the phase, then the right to the left and doing the same thing. This makes the differences in each channel louder, and the similarities quieter. Tends to sound unnatural if pushed really hard.
-Double tracking: Record the same thing twice, compress, edit timing, pan opposite. It creates that intimate kind of acoustic guitar sound. Like it's really close to you but not "mono." Everyone's heard it at one time or another. You can do a similar thing with a delay.
-Slapback: Pan something one way, have a pretty quick and more subtle delay in the other channel. Do the same with a counter element in the opposite channel. This one's nice if you want things to sound "big and hall-y." It really widens the mix. I like it personally. Not that great if you wanna do the modern ultra dry thing.
-Something else:
Every studio engineer has their own tricks. One of the keys to becoming a good one is to find your own. Learning from others is obviously a big part too. Records in 10 years won't sound like they do today, so just trying to copy someone else's style will only be so rewarding.hth!
♫♪♫♫♪♫
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- Banned
- 4073 posts since 15 Mar, 2004
Some great tips there 3*s3*s wrote:I seriously doubt it's some kind of post production thing. That would really damage the sound quality. For people who are hopelessly anal about sound quality like "high-end" studio engineers, I'm sure they would do things during the mix phase to get a nice stereo image.
Here's some ways to widen your mix
-Phase Delays: Simply a left or right channel delay of about 10-20ms, very short. This makes things wide without sounding "chorusy" or having an obvious echo. It's wider, but can still sound "dry." It's used all the time on guitars and pads. Nice if you don't want something to be on "one side."
-Stereo Enhancers: Almost all of these work by feeding the left channel into the right and inverting the phase, then the right to the left and doing the same thing. This makes the differences in each channel louder, and the similarities quieter. Tends to sound unnatural if pushed really hard.
-Double tracking: Record the same thing twice, compress, edit timing, pan opposite. It creates that intimate kind of acoustic guitar sound. Like it's really close to you but not "mono." Everyone's heard it at one time or another. You can do a similar thing with a delay.
-Slapback: Pan something one way, have a pretty quick and more subtle delay in the other channel. Do the same with a counter element in the opposite channel. This one's nice if you want things to sound "big and hall-y." It really widens the mix. I like it personally. Not that great if you wanna do the modern ultra dry thing.
-Something else:
hth!
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
Well Ive heard things like this in the car as well so its not 5.1 im hearing. It's GOT to be this stereo widening effect, and its applied across the board on a mastering bus. I am familiar with those techniques... But I'm wondering if it would be wise or unwise to apply such an effect on an old recording to spice it up a bit... I mean I applied it and it sounds pretty freaking good... Far better than without it. Any suggestions?
RoNC
RoNC