Compensating for a (expletive deleted) mic

[Frippertronix]

Hey,

I've been contemplating the idea that one might be able to use VST magic to make an OK vocal mic sound at least slightly more than just that.

For the time being, I'm stuck with a Rode NT2 beacause Im not Geoff Emerick or Peewee Diddly (that's his name now, isn't it?) and I can't afford a Soundelux unless I get a third job.

Actually, the NT2 was working fine for me for a while because all I used to track with it was electric guitar and bass and it actually sounds okay for those, but I've started trying to sing. I made the mistake of buying an NTK, after first buying the hype that it was a "tube mic" (it is if you discount the transistors and are okay with low voltage tube circuits), which I slowly decided I don't care for that much (though I can't really call it bad, just not my cup o' tea). So, to make a long story a little shorter---I do vocals with an NT2, though I put it through Joemeek comp and eq and through a stereo tube (real with real volts and such) preamp before it goes to my soundcard.

Soooo (cripes, I'm rambling ) if anyone has any of that old plugin magic we all so deeply know and love that they feel helps give human being vocal parts a little of that extra something that usually only comes with $5000 mics (i.e. a certain magical plug or equally magical plug combo) that they are willing to share, I (and we also, probably) would be most grateful to know of it.



Thanks in advance,
Dave

[toine6]

Well there's Antares Microphone Modeler, other than that I don't know. Thing is you want a $5000 mic sound, but sometimes that's not the best mic, sometimes the $100 mic is what is needed. Maybe this sound you are looking for is not going to be made just by using some expensive mic. Maybe you just don't have the right sound going in to the mic to begin with?

I don't know, I'm not a mic expert. I've read a lot about them though, and have experimented with the 5 microphones I have. So just think of my comments as food for thought until the real wizard responds.

[Frippertronix]

Maybe you just don't have the right sound going in to the mic to begin with?

Hey, that's personal.

So just think of my comments as food for thought until the real wizard responds.

Yum!

I understand your point, but the reason I posted this is that I know so many out there are doing what I'm doing---trying to fake a "big studio" sound on a wee little budget, and what I've started discovering (and thus my tendency to hang out here) is that there are a bunch of plugins out there that can help you do that in various ways, if you know the ones and how to use them.

I guess, to make it clearer, I'm trying to get that sweet vocal sound that you tend to hear on good pro recordings. I guess the dreaded "tube" word keeps coming to mind, along with names like Neuman, etc.

So I'm looking for suggestions based on what people have discovered to do to "fatten", "sweeten", "add life", etc. to their vocal tracks. Partly to compensate for a cheaper mic, but also just general vocal sweetening, achieved via plugins.

I want to try my TriTone ValveTone '62 on my vocals because it does such a great job of breathing life into my Giga samples, but until they upgrade it for 96 KHz, I think I'll hold off.

[P.T.]

Different peoples voices work best with different mics. Some pros use dynamic mics because their voice sounds best that way. Studios have lots of mics and try different ones out to see which will work best.

That's why you have to try mics out. Buy from stores with generous return policies.

[toine6]

Maybe you just don't have the right sound going in to the mic to begin with?

Hey, that's personal.

Hey, I figure I can get away with calling your vocals um, sketchy(?) until I actually hear them, at that point I will then tell you that you may want to look into a new $10,000 tube mic and vocal lessons .

Some pros use dynamic mics because their voice sounds best that way

Yup Bono of U2 and Gary Numan both use the Shure 58 dynamic microphone ($90) for their stuff.

[mandolarian]

If you want to do the mic modelling right, get a great impulse of a Soundelux ELUX 251. Then purchase a $5k DPA mic (You want a neutral starting point) and sing into that. Then use the Elux impulse in SIR.

Or you could skip the expensive part and mess around with the Manley VoxBox impulses in SIR. Or try Voxformer. VintageWarmer. Warmifier. HarmoniEQ in the U87 position.

Or try the new Rode NT2A, a much, much better mic. (Not to insult your sensibilities, but the original NT2 is a pretty harsh, gritty sound) Or spend a few bucks on renting a variety of mics until you find the combo that works for you and your 'uncapturable' voice.

Won't bore you with the details on room acoustics, mic technique and the synergy of the signal chain.

Getting a great vocal sound is so personal that it's hard to be objective about it.

[greendoor]

Forget mic modelling. It's a complete rip off, and here is why: microphones differ in noise level, frequency response, directional sensitivity - but most of all, and this isn't well understood, they all have unique resonant spots that create "ringing" - in other words time-based smearing of freqencies. You simply cannot take a noisy mic, that doesn't pickup the full frequencies range, and has multiple nasty resonances, and fix it with software. If the noise is there to start with, the delicate harmonics that a good mic would have picked up are gone. If the mic didn't pickup reflections from the room, a mic model can't put them back in. If a frequency wasn't picked up at all, a model can't create it. And the resonances can't be taken out - all you do is add some more, via convolution. So mic modeling should be sold as something else - it is impossible to do what they claim. This is why a good engineer/producer will have a collection of mics that are important to them - there is no substitute. If you just want some colorful variations on a theme, use your eq - it will do less harm.

[bobby yarrow]

I mixed a record that was recorded in the artist's bedroom with nothing except a Rode NT1, a Pod, a midi controller and an M-Box. Period.

The vocals were the toughest thing. If this guy had wanted a very natural, full-bodied vocal sound, it would have been hard. Thing is, it's rock music, so a little edge (read: distortion) in the vocal was ok.

Typical signal chain: PSP MixTreble (a plugin I rarely use, especially on vocal, but was perfect for making the limits of the mic sound intentional) + UAD 1176 (again, not transparent) + MasterQ to roll off the bottom. With a little ambience, it sounded good. Damn good actually.

The happy and sad news is that the record sounds better, from a pure production point of view, than most records made for less than $50K. No one (who wasn't an engineer) would ever suspect it was homebrew, in my opinion. The happy part of that is that you can make a top-flight record with gear that costs less than dinner in a nice restaurant. The sad part is justifying the X thousands of bucks we've all spent trying to get to the next level . . .

PS: I don't mean to say that great gear doesn't help. It does matter, in my opinion, for everything. And it all matters -- mic, pre, outboards, converters, plugins, all of it. But for 99% of us, I submit that gear isn't the limiting factor. I mean, this guy made a better record than almost anything I hear coming out of smaller studios, with gear that Walmart would sell if they sold gear.

[bobby yarrow]

One more thing: I noticed that the thread's called 'compensating' for a lousy mic. I want to point out that I went with a different approach. Don't compensate. Take what you get and go with it. Like, I happen to think guitars with humbuckers almost never sound as good as a nice rick, tele or strat, but lots of folks want to use humbucker guitars. I don't kill myself trying to making them sound like a good single-coil, and neither would you. I try and make them sound good. So, don't approach your mix trying to make your Rode sound like a U67. Just find what's good about it and make it great.

[Funkybot]

If you read the new issue of Tape Op one of the guys who recorded The Dears and The Arcarde Fire said that he and some people A/B'd a NT2 against a vintage U87 and the NT2 came out on top every time. I've gotten some really good recordings out of my NT1000, so I don't think it's the mic that's at fault. Also why are you EQ'ing the vocal on the way in? I'm thinking that's most likely the problem here.