KVR Radio station.

[intel]

I wouldn't invest money in setting up an internet radio station if my life depended on it. there are tens of thousands of internet radio programs out there, all vying for the same 10 listeners. if you're approaching something like this expecting to be hugely popular or make money (or break even, for that matter), then you're fooling yourself.

[jmh]

That's the beauty of it, no revenues to think about. It would ruin everything straight from the start if anything related to making money was involved.

Regards,

JMH

And the less the listeners, the littler the chance that bandwidth issues arise...

And I agree, there is no money to be made, especially in those countries where copyright agencies charge you up the wazoo... especially here in Finland where the local music copyright agency tries to charge you for using bird calls as ringtones (we couldn't help asking them "exactly which types of birds have you negotiated with and signed papers so far?" when dealing with them in my previous job when exploring the possibility of both giving away and selling ringtones) and even try to charge you when you're distributing your own material and aren't their client.

All the more reason to support these kind of activities.

* edit - must be dyslexic, yet again left out a few words here and there *

Regards,

JMH

[Hink]

I wouldn't invest money in setting up an internet radio station if my life depended on it. there are tens of thousands of internet radio programs out there, all vying for the same 10 listeners. if you're approaching something like this expecting to be hugely popular or make money (or break even, for that matter), then you're fooling yourself.

so what you're saying is the fact I never listen to internet radio stations isn't unique...

[Barf]

Hurry up!

Yes, where is it!

[Techbot]

If its a true radio station and the radio actually hosts the files it plays rather than lists direct links, credit and contact the artists too, give some way of announcing each artist before the track and at the end of the track plus where to find them - then it could be a good idea.

:O)

Then and only then, it would be a good idea?

It would be up to each DJ to collate their own playlists. It is then streamed to the server, where it is then disseminated. So linking direct or otherwise is not relevant.

I assume then that the DJ would be soley responsible for the material broadcast, and not KVR.

The name and artists of current track playing can be fed into the KVR website and/or players. Ipersonally, have no intention of announcing any tracks verbally. At least not at the start.

More info about setlists would be available on each dJ's site or we can open a playlist forum thread.

But do we need a logo of sorts to post beside track links to indicate artists wish to put tune up for consideration by DJ's for broadcasting. eg (B)
Or do we just let each DJ try to hunt down the artist of each tune he wishes to broadcast?

As for making money. C'mon guys that doesn't even enter into it.

JMh: Could you let us know how it went with the server guys?

And could we get suggestions as to how DJs are scheduled. Personally I'd prefer Dj's who are consistant getting preference, maybe even with a competitive edge.

[Hink]

If its a true radio station and the radio actually hosts the files it plays rather than lists direct links, credit and contact the artists too, give some way of announcing each artist before the track and at the end of the track plus where to find them - then it could be a good idea.

:O)

Then and only then, it would be a good idea?

It would be up to each DJ to collate their own playlists. It is then streamed to the server, where it is then disseminated. So linking direct or otherwise is not relevant.

I assume then that the DJ would be soley responsible for the material broadcast, and not KVR.

The name and artists of current track playing can be fed into the KVR website and/or players. Ipersonally, have no intention of announcing any tracks verbally. At least not at the start.

More info about setlists would be available on each dJ's site or we can open a playlist forum thread.

But do we need a logo of sorts to post beside track links to indicate artists wish to put tune up for consideration by DJ's for broadcasting. eg (B)
Or do we just let each DJ try to hunt down the artist of each tune he wishes to broadcast?

As for making money. C'mon guys that doesn't even enter into it.

JMh: Could you let us know how it went with the server guys?

And could we get suggestions as to how DJs are scheduled. Personally I'd prefer Dj's who are consistant getting preference, maybe even with a competitive edge.

I dont know, I think there's a lot of holes in your plan...I can see vendettas overflowing to the radio station causing many problems to begin with. As easy as this could be good for KVR, it could even easier shoot KVR in the foot if not handled correctly, I think thE Next order of business should be a talk WITH Ben TBH...

[Spe3D]

If its a true radio station and the radio actually hosts the files it plays rather than lists direct links, credit and contact the artists too, give some way of announcing each artist before the track and at the end of the track plus where to find them - then it could be a good idea.

:O)

Then and only then, it would be a good idea?

Yep!

It would be up to each DJ to collate their own playlists. It is then streamed to the server, where it is then disseminated. So linking direct or otherwise is not relevant.

If you direct link to files on others servers without their say so - you will find your radio station getting blocked from access to those files and the radio will kind of stop, no? so the right thing to do to ensure a constant stream is for the radio to host the files - or it will be in the class of a leach.

As for making money. C'mon guys that doesn't even enter into it.

If the radio station is using others bandwidth and diskspace by not hosting the files - then money will not be too much of an issue, no?

Most guys have to pay for servers and bandwidth - hosting guys dont give out that kind of bandwidth for free - so who is going to pay for the bandwidth etc, if the radio hosts the files?

In the case of jmh - he says he can host the files for free on one of his many servers - and has masses of bandwidth - so this is super cool for you

Best regards,

Spe3d

:O)

[intel]

so what you're saying is the fact I never listen to internet radio stations isn't unique...

no. I'm saying you're a big fat jerk for not listening to internet radio, you big fat jerk.

[intel]

If you direct link to files on others servers without their say so - you will find your radio station getting blocked from access to those files and the radio will kind of stop, no? so the right thing to do to ensure a constant stream is for the radio to host the files - or it will be in the class of a leach.

perhaps I'm not following the plan here, but in all instances of "internet radio" of which I am aware, the music is "broadcast" from a hosting computer (ie - host or DJ) to the serving computer (ie - server) which handles the relaying to the client computers (ie - listeners). there's no maintaining of files involved by the server, nor need to link or access other sites. I think you've jumped ahead into the realm of 24/7 automated streaming, which no one else has even mentioned as an option. and bandwidth won't become an issue until this thing grows beyond 50 concurrent listeners. and if it does that regularly, you can consider it an unmitigated success, smoke a giant bowl and pat yourself on the back for accomplishing something very few have. so it seems that most of your concerns are unfounded at this point.

[ZEST]

Hi Friends,

I am doing a radio show on a one watt blow torch called CKRG 89.9 FM Community Radio Glendon York University, Toronto, Canada.

I am open to just about everything. This is a commercial free radio station. I host it LIVE !!

www.radioglendon.com

The show starts up in September when the campus re-opens.

No fees, or any B.S. Just pure entertainment.

If any of you want to contribute your music and give permission for air play, I will be glad to discuss.

I have already featured Steven West on many occaisons. I can feature other artists too.

It is accessable to listen to over the web by hitting the listen live icon on the station page. It's closed for the summer now.

Non the less, internet radio can be good if it is hosted live. I would love to host a show on internet radio, and do it live. And no commercials. That's the way I like it. Cheers,

ZEST

[Techbot]

I dont know, I think there's a lot of holes in your plan...I can see vendettas overflowing to the radio station causing many problems to begin with. As easy as this could be good for KVR, it could even easier shoot KVR in the foot if not handled correctly

Please explain.What exactly should we be prepared for. What are your suggestions?

Anything, no, Everything can go wrong, if not handled correctly!
A radio station is no different. Why would a KVR radio station show more problems than any other radio station. I don't get your waryness at all. Vendettas?
If you can see issues, list them now so we can put things in place. But vendettas, I wouldn't mind hearing them broadcast

Speed, I don't think you are reading the posts that you are replying to. There would be
1) no ads
2) no need for linking
3) no bandwidth issues until we have over 50 listeners max at anyone time.
4) No target audience
5) No need for large hard drive


I think given a bit of time, it could really turn interesting. I for one don't intend to simply press play on winamp. I am sure I can plug a mixer into winamp and broadcast my Audio. So there could be chat, disses, mixes etc. I've even been making some phoney ads.

How long would a DJs set be. What penalties occur if a DJ misses his slot. Is it a race to book your slot when the previous DJ is finishing up.

[ross g]

i know nothing about internet radio, one question.... earlier it was mentioned that there could be 50 listeners..is that true, only 50? is there a way to have someting closer to broadcast? can't the signal be relayed, so to speak? this is something i've been thinking about, i've been thinking about pirate also, but it might be too expensive with the hope of zero listeners.....
(edit)

i have to add i knew some people doing a pirate in chicago, (actually spun as a dj for the first and only time, fun as hell, didn't really play songs at all, i think you know what i mean,NOISEY) they also broadcasted on the net, i thought it would be cool to "relay" the signal (a network of like minded folks), i have a big flagpole and the opportunity to make it higher, just an idea, it's near I-80 so USA cross country travelers could get the signal, i listen to truckers on ocassion, crazy bunch sometimes....

from, for, and by the people,
rg

[kevink]

Here's a straw-man model for RadioKVR.

The www.radiokvr.com server is sitting somewhere running audio webcast software.

Registered KVR members - and only registered KVR members - could submit their music by filling out a web form (email would be too easy to spam) providing the URL or FTP address of an MP3 file and optionally an associated URL with information about the composer/musicians/song, graphics, etc.

The KVR RoboJock - a script running on the server - would select *at random* from the available submissions, and send the music down the line, while displaying the associated info/graphics for the web browsers of whoever is interested.

The random selection process would be modified by providing some TBD weight to several parameters:

KVR members who really like (or dislike) a song can use a simple web-based (again, no email) interface to give positive or negative feedback. Songs with postive feedback would become more likely than those with negative feedback to be selected - but even those with negative feedback would have some chance of being played.

Songs which have recently been played would have their probability of selection reduced in some way that would "decay" over the following hour or two.

I'm an OS kernel hacker type in my "day job", not a web content programmer, but I know that what I've described is actually pretty simple, and once it's done, there would be very little work that anyone would have to do on a day-to-day basis to keep the thing running. There wouldn't be a requirement to keep a massive amount of content on the server at the same time, because the RoboJock can pre-load a few tunes ahead and delete the local copies after they've been played (it would have to keep several pre-loads ahead, because some member sites will be off-line or badly connected at least some of the time).

Easier to propose than to dispose, I know, but does this seem unreasonable?

And if it helps motivate some member with the right skill-set, once it works, RoboJock should be resellable. The KVR community is, if nothing else, a very seasoned bunch of beta-testers.

[jmh]

Kevink Great post. This is close to one of the two systems we have available - one of our 'server guys' has been running web radios here for years, used to be somewhat of a pioneer for that stuff in this country, and hos concocted systems for this, some still in use after the rapid death of most web radios here (the damn copyright agency got carried away with their agenda) and some just waiting to be utilized.

About the only thing I "disagree" is having the content on the server. As it's a non-issue spacewise and makes the system robust if all the content for automated playback is there, I see that as the preferred way.

As for DJs and their responsibilities etc., keep suggestions coming Some kind of a penalty system would perhaps be tolerable, although I'm not really seeing this as a some sort of strict project buried deep in rules and such... It's meant to be fun for both sides

I'm talking to our server people about this tonight, so I'll get a clear picture on what exactly is available and how much work it takes to get everything else implemented. I do know that the whole streaming system was set up when we were doing Kingston's drum pages, and I do know that the relay system for DJing is there, can't remember which of the *cast systems it is though.

Regards,

JMH

[Spe3D]

About the only thing I "disagree" is having the content on the server. As it's a non-issue spacewise and makes the system robust if all the content for automated playback is there, I see that as the preferred way.

Does this mean you DO put the files on your server or DONT and link via other sites?

There wouldn't be a requirement to keep a massive amount of content on the server at the same time, because the RoboJock can pre-load a few tunes ahead and delete the local copies after they've been played (it would have to keep several pre-loads ahead, because some member sites will be off-line or badly connected at least some of the time).

It's not clear as the post above sates placing the content on to the streamer server first.

Best regards,

Spe3d

:O)