How do YOU feel about your music being pirated?

[Quaternion]

Have you ever released music (other than mp3s)? If not, stop posting to this thread, because you are not even able answer the question in the topic.

also, just to avoid this one before someone actually posts it, yeah I have

I got pissed off a bit by Kaden and his constant "adapt or die" posts, and this was directed to him exclusively. Didn't want to offend anybody else, sorry.

[whyterabbyt]

shamann quoth

But you just did again. You're saying that the reasons used to justify slavery by those who commited it can be likened morally to the reasons people use to justify copyright violation.

No I am not. I am saying that some people can find moral justifications for any behaviour, and that some perceived 'change in the way things are' isnt actually an acceptable justification for anything. Kaden was stating that people just had to get used to the way things are changing. "Or die."

You do recall that slavery was once considered ethically acceptable dont you? And yet it no longer is. Thus mentioning it serves as a fairly good example of the fact that a societal or cultural attitude is not necessarily an adequate justification, and hence kaden's mention of 'change in the way things are' was not automatically an adequate justification or rationale.

You might not be able to extricate an example used to illustrate something from the point itself. But its your mistake for conflating the example and the point into one thing. Not mine. And Im getting fed up of saying to you that you're trying to put words in my mouth. So give it a rest, huh. You're misrepresenting what I said, plain and simple.

I've re-read both posts and it is plain as day.

Only because of your predisposition as to how you prefer to read it, I suspect.

Debate rhetoric is well and fine, but scale is a factor of concern when dealing with these issues.

Only if you have any interest in trying to compare them as issues. I, within this thread, do not.

Slavery is about the exploitation through force/hostility of other living beings. Copyright violation in no way results in the exploitation of another being, because at any time they can choose to stop. That's a big difference. Especially when copyright only protects one's freedom to profit. Profit isn't the stuff human rights are made of. Being able to profit is a nice thing to have when you live in a world such ours, but it just isn't the same thing as the right to live your life as yours.

Still completely irrelevant to my point.

[Lady J]

Debate rhetoric is well and fine, but scale is a factor of concern when dealing with these issues. Slavery is about the exploitation through force/hostility of other living beings. Copyright violation in no way results in the exploitation of another being, because at any time they can choose to stop. That's a big difference. Especially when copyright only protects one's freedom to profit. Profit isn't the stuff human rights are made of. Being able to profit is a nice thing to have when you live in a world such ours, but it just isn't the same thing as the right to live your life as yours.

Finally some more sense in this debate. That said, I love how comparisons to slavery are seldom anything like slavery......Slavery was a holocaust and you dont see people comparing Kazaa to Hitler do you?

[Barf]

i apologise, i realise i am underestimating your intelligence..

of course you didn't BUY the paper, you just read it! LOL silly me

you keep READING that paper!

there! got it right

Its about the OESO-report, not the newspaper. My point is that even a capitalist organisation like the OESO cant prove the music-industry is losing money over downloading.

[donkey tugger]

I read in a newspaper today that according to a new report by the OESO there is no evidence for a link between illegal downloading music and declining sales in the music-industry.

hey bro, WOW!!! it sounds like that paper is telling you the TRUTH

unelievable how in a capitalist society, sometimes they'll jsut come right out and tell you! "hey, they're skank"

dude, i suggest you keep buying that newspaper!!!!!


("but he just doesnt listen..")

So what IS your point?

that it isn't true unless a little bird told you?

[xoxos]

I read in a newspaper today that according to a new report by the OESO there is no evidence for a link between illegal downloading music and declining sales in the music-industry.

hey bro, WOW!!! it sounds like that paper is telling you the TRUTH

unelievable how in a capitalist society, sometimes they'll jsut come right out and tell you! "hey, they're skank"

dude, i suggest you keep buying that newspaper!!!!!


("but he just doesnt listen..")

So what IS your point?

why dont you check back tomorrow, and then twice on sundays, for about fifteen years and after a bit you'll stop worrying and just accept that whatever i generate is a constant in your noosphere.


'official' okay, america is officially baked out of its mind.

[kaden]

It's painful watching otherwise intelligent people dumb down to such a degree.

First of all, Quat: I've released material as a member of Jazz bands, Rawk bands and Noise bands, as well as composing commissioned scores for film and TV. Can I post now?

Secondly, the reason people don't steal the stuff I make is because I have established my position in the marketplace where people pay me to build them things. If I'm not paid, I don't build it.

I adapted. It was work to reach this point, and it's a different approach than a lot of people use, but it works. It was a constructive solution.

Adapt or die...reality sucks sometimes, but it's still reality. Getting pissed off won't help, not will lamenting the good old days. Like it or not, right or wrong, the system has changed...your response to this change is the issue, not the reason for the change.

K

[Quaternion]

Slavery was a holocaust and you dont see people comparing Kazaa to Hitler do you?

The Holocaust was a unique systematic genocide, you can't compare that to slavery.

[Quaternion]

First of all, Quat: I've released material as a member of Jazz bands, Rawk bands and Noise bands, as well as composing commissioned scores for film and TV. Can I post now?

No, first you need to give me info on the bands' names, so I can download them.

Secondly, the reason people don't steal the stuff I make is because I have established my position in the marketplace where people pay me to build them things. If I'm not paid, I don't build it.

That's not different to my or any other regular job. If I don't get paid, I don't work.

And as I said before, my concern is NOT money, because even if there was no piracy, I doubt that I would get more royalties (simply because there wouldn't be more DJs, which are the target group). So I don't care about "markets", the "music industry" or "business strategies". I as you can read in my initial post, I was concerned about CD compilations getting pirated as these are more important to a small label than their vinyl releases.

Adapt or die...reality sucks sometimes, but it's still reality.

I will neither adapt, nor die. If the label goes bankcrupt, I will continue doing the same music I do now. I'm not making music in order to make a living or to please a mainstream market.

However I think it's nice to be able to hold the music I did in my hands (i.e. in the form of a record), that's why I care about this issue.

[Barf]

I read in a newspaper today that according to a new report by the OESO there is no evidence for a link between illegal downloading music and declining sales in the music-industry.

hey bro, WOW!!! it sounds like that paper is telling you the TRUTH

unelievable how in a capitalist society, sometimes they'll jsut come right out and tell you! "hey, they're skank"

dude, i suggest you keep buying that newspaper!!!!!


("but he just doesnt listen..")

So what IS your point?

that it isn't true unless a little bird told you?

Exactly what do you mean by 'it' isnt true?

[kaden]

I will neither adapt, nor die. If the label goes bankcrupt, I will continue doing the same music I do now.

With even fewer listeners. Brilliant idea. If that's the size of audience you feel your music merits, then I wholeheartedly endorse your proposal.

K

[Amberience]

I don't mind to a certain extent.

[xoxos]

that it isn't true unless a little bird told you?

gimme a break "just because i've never seen a breakdancing tubeworm before dont mean im going to take what it says for granted now am i"

your boring. your game = 'stuff bak in box'

[Hink]

I will neither adapt, nor die. If the label goes bankcrupt, I will continue doing the same music I do now.

With even fewer listeners. Brilliant idea. If that's the size of audience you feel your music merits, then I wholeheartedly endorse your proposal.

K

uhm...are you trying to say that audience size, fame or financial success define whether one is a successfull artist or a song is good? How can you assune what other's music merits? I'm sorry, I just think that was a shallow post...I'm quite proud of my music, that wont change if a million people hear it or one person hears it...it's the cration that is my kick...

[Quaternion]

I will neither adapt, nor die. If the label goes bankcrupt, I will continue doing the same music I do now.

With even fewer listeners. Brilliant idea.

Yes, doing music the way I want to, is more important to me than adapting to any market (which is to me the same as selling-out to a mainstream audience because of money).

Producing music is not my job, remember? So I can afford not to "adapt or die".