KVR Audio

julianw · Post by **julianw** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 3:48 pm

Hi all,

I'm looking for a plugin that will allow me to seperate the low frequencies in a stereo mix and sum them in mono so I don't have to worry about inadvertantly panned low frequencies (usually through chorusing/phasing) affecting the vinyl cutting process.

A very transparent 'linear-phase' process of some sort would be preferable, which i could insert into my mastering chain before the multiband compressor.

Can't believe there is not a dedicated plugin for this somewhere as it must be a common issue....If anybody has any ideas, please advise.

Thanks In Advance

Julian

grillo · Post by **grillo** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 4:16 pm

Hi i don't really know of a plugin like that but ozone has something similar. in the multiband stereo widening section you can just as well expand a stereo band or 'shrink' it back till it's practically mono.

Muzik 4 Machines · Post by **Muzik 4 Machines** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 4:31 pm

i use hyperprism more stereo with the stereo at 1.00 and the low freq set so all my bass and kick asre centered
it's usefull too if you want to add a bit of width

csl · Post by **csl** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 4:55 pm

Voxengo's Soniformer could do this couldn't it? With the width envelope closed up for the bass freqs.

The Chase · Post by **The Chase** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 5:00 pm

basslane is made for this but I cant get it to do it

Lesha · Post by **Lesha** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 5:05 pm

how about mid/side processing.. ?

Space Boy · Post by **Space Boy** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 5:20 pm

Try my 'Wider Boy Pro' and do as follows:

First switch to the 'Bass Removal' preset.
Switch on the 'Bass' button.
Switch on the 'Mono Bass' button.
Adjust 'Spectral Pivot' to taste.

You're ready.

Paul

k-bird · Post by **k-bird** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 6:37 pm

c-plugs c_superstereo - also does phase rotation and other such stuff.

csl · Post by **csl** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 6:43 pm

By the way, why do you need to worry about this? Are you the cutting engineer? They ought to take care of this shouldn't they?

jdg · Post by **jdg** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 6:50 pm

csl wrote:By the way, why do you need to worry about this? Are you the cutting engineer? They ought to take care of this shouldn't they?

unless he is the cutting engineer

this is tru tho.. when u go get your reference cut, the engineer deals with this.. as thats why it costs $$ to get your stuff mastered for vinyl.

when i master for vinyl, i master the album for CD, then send it to the vinyl guy.. and he does the rest.

The Chase · Post by **The Chase** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 8:21 pm

csl wrote:By the way, why do you need to worry about this? Are you the cutting engineer? They ought to take care of this shouldn't they?

Every producer should center their bass. If you send it to a label and they center it, it might sound horrible.

kylen · Post by **kylen** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 8:30 pm

I just happened to be fooling around with bass freqs this morning and noticed there is a roll-off associated with each of the plugs mentioned for mono bass (soniformer, c-super-stereo, wider boy pro). If you clone the track you're dealing with, phase invert the 2nd one so it nulls out, then test each mono bass plug you'll hear what I mean - or if you stick an instance of SPAN on the master you can see what the plugin adds. C-superstereo has the sharpest roll off, WiderBoy pro, then soniformer. Not a judgement - just depends what you want or need.

The sharpest rolloff would be to clone a track and insert appropriate High-pass/lowpass filters where you need them and switch the bass track to mono - I've done this in SONAR4 using FreEQ for a really steep filter.

ED: I just tried ozone3 and it has optional digital crossovers that will make a nice steep mono bass slope also. (careful if you null 2 tracks using ozone3 the correlation gets a little confusing - don't listen to it that way in Sonar4 anyway, interesting...)

flex42 · Post by **flex42** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 10:12 pm

this works just fine: http://www.otiumfx.com/basslane.php

martian · Post by **martian** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 10:38 pm

i'd do it on a track by track basis rather than sum mono from the master fader.

the quick way, jus send all the instruments you want to be mono, to a mono group in your sequencer.

or if your sequencer has flexible panning controls use them, for example in SX you can use the combined stereo panner to decrease the width of channels down to summed mono, other plugs will do this too, like waves s1.

really as long as your bass is mono there's no problem. good to roll off the lows on reverbs too (below 100hz).

but for bass with chorus of phasor on, where you still want the effect but also max punch from your bass, jus summing it to mono will most likely cause a lot of phasing of the subsonic freqs, compromising their punch and consistancy. i'd create 2 copies of the track, one with your effect (chorus or whatever) the other without, then filter the sub out of the fxed track and filter everything but the subs out of the unfxed track, combined you'll a have solid bass with your stereo effect.

the ear doesnt use sounds below about 200hz for localisation, so having your low end mono shouldn't cripple the stereo effect you were trying to achieve.

regards,

kritikon · Post by **kritikon** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:01 pm

Wise advice. I always record my basses to mono audio.
If you want stereo FX on the top end of your bass (which is not unreasonable), you can simply use a send and insert a strong LPF or band splitter and mute the bass band before the actual send FX. If you can't find a band splitter, then use something like a multiband comp - most of those have individual band mutes, so you can have it set without any compression, but use it to mute the bass end that gets sent to an FX.

And somebody mentioned Basslane - works fine for me.

Plugin for summing low frequencies in mono for vinyl