KVR Audio

Jaybez · Post by **Jaybez** » Mon Jul 18, 2005 9:50 pm

Im recording the Clavinet instrument of my Oasys at the moment and wondered what samples people would like in the kit.

I had thought C2-C3, recorded at two levels of velocity: 64 & 127.

I also thought about 2 note lengths, short stabs of around 250ms but not sure about longer lengths, would 500ms be ok?

Please let me know if you're interested and if so, let me know the nuts and bolts of a kit you would like.

androidlove · Post by **androidlove** » Mon Jul 18, 2005 11:12 pm

wow. i use sf and sfz. nice of you to offer. i can convert though

Jaybez · Post by **Jaybez** » Mon Jul 18, 2005 11:22 pm

At the moment I was thinking of making Kontakt and EnergyXT kits as I have those progs. Basically they will be in wavs so you can convert as you like.
I dont use samples much so not really familiar with what people expect from a set.

What do you think of my proposition above (with regards to octaves and velocity), dont be shy

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Mon Jul 18, 2005 11:44 pm

What do you mean with C2-C3? All notes between them or just those notes?
I recommend sampling a somewhat wider range, such as 3 octaves, probably in tritones or even major thirds. This means less CPU when you load the samples into the sampler of your choice as it'll have to do less pitching.

Regarding velocity layers I'd think about more than just two. My personal rule of thumb would be "many or none", many being something around 4 at least, probably even some more. I found velocity switches to be pretty much noticeable on a low number of layers, with velocity x-fades only adding problems (such as phasing) rather than solving them.

yakobb · Post by **yakobb** » Tue Jul 19, 2005 12:11 am

Yeah, two velocity layers tends to be really noticable, because you end up sometimes hitting the lower and sometimes the higher and it sounds really weird. If you have time, more layers would make it much more useful. It think 4 would probably be enough.

Dunno, if you've got time...

hollowsun · Post by **hollowsun** » Tue Jul 19, 2005 1:50 am

Jaybez wrote:Im recording the Clavinet instrument of my Oasys at the moment.......

Without wishing to look/sound like a miserable old bugger.....

What you are doing is technically illegal!!

If you were sampling a real Clav (that was discontinued a long time ago - as I have done), that's another story but to sample samples from a manufacturers' current (and flagship) product could get Korg's attorneys in a frenzy of litigation!

And don't forget that even announcing your intentions here could make KVR implicit in the 'crime'.

We live in a litigious world - be careful and proceed at your peril.

Yes... I know it's silly but in a court of law, they could claim "Unfair trading under state and federal laws"...

And they would probably have a good case - you are giving away their sounds/investment (as they see it) for free.

Think about it and proceed with caution!

Steve

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Tue Jul 19, 2005 2:01 am

Uh!
Seems as if Steve (as so often) is right.
At first I thought you were talking about the Oasys PCI card (in that case I'd think there'd be no problems), but now it seems to me as if you're talking about their Oasys keyboards, which are indeed samplebased - so resampling would bring up legal issues for sure.

Edit: Current common sense seems to be that sampling anything non-samplebased would be OK from a legal point of view (might raise some moral issues though), but sampling anything samplebased could (or would) get you into troubles rather quickly.

I'm still thinking about sampling Emagics EVD6 (and a bunch of other Logic instruments) though - and hell no, I've got no single moral headache about that at all. After all it has been them leaving PC users in the dark.

jmh · Post by **jmh** » Tue Jul 19, 2005 3:21 am

Oasys keyboards? Which aren't available yet?

Quite likely he is talking about the Oasys card, in which case the clavinet in question is not sample based.

And thus, it'll be legal - unless of course the fine print somewhere exclusively forbids such action(s) - or the legal twisting is taken towards the 'is it a preset patch on the instrument' territory which is another nuisance though perfectly clear to everybody (except for those crusaders of course refusing to understand such concepts

)

But still, it's good to give out such advice about the legal sides of things. Now it's up to Jaybez to let us know what the sound source actually is so it's easier to assess the situation.

Regards,

JMH

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Tue Jul 19, 2005 3:30 am

jmh wrote:Oasys keyboards? Which aren't available yet?

Oh, I see. Just had a brief look at Thomann (germany's biggest online retailer) and they came up there - but yeah, they're not available yet.

And thus, it'll be legal - unless of course the fine print somewhere exclusively forbids such action(s) - or the legal twisting is taken towards the 'is it a preset patch on the instrument' territory which is another nuisance though perfectly clear to everybody (except for those crusaders of course refusing to understand such concepts )

I don't think either remark would hold much legal water.
Of course there'd still be moral issues.

Pantsdown666 · Post by **Pantsdown666** » Tue Jul 19, 2005 3:33 am

androidlove wrote:wow. i use sf and sfz. nice of you to offer. i can convert though

hey, if you do end up making an sf2 from the WAVs , please post here!
thanks,
S

Jaybez · Post by **Jaybez** » Tue Jul 19, 2005 12:19 pm

Hehe, Hollowsun you're not a miserable old bugger, thanks for pointing out the sample issue but I'm talking about the Oasys PCI, the Clav in question is not sample based but synthesised so it should be ok.
Thanks for the info on velocity layers, maybe more work than I orignally thoought but I will get it done.

Also, when I said C2-C3 I meant those 2 complete octaves, each note.

OK, so I could extend that to 3 octaves with 4 velocity layers, Ill have to watch my bandwidth (unless spe3d is feeling generous) so maybe rather than sample each note it will be tritones or major thirds as Sascha Franck suggested.

Thanks to all for your help, any further suggestions, slaggings, etc let me know.

hollowsun · Post by **hollowsun** » Wed Jul 20, 2005 2:19 am

Jaybez wrote:Hehe, Hollowsun you're not a miserable old bugger, thanks for pointing out the sample issue but I'm talking about the Oasys PCI

Ah! IC... my mistake.

Ok... I imagine that this is 'less illegal' but beware using 'out-the-box' presets from the thing because that could be potentially construed as copyright infringement or 'unfair trading', etc., in a court of law (especially in the litigious US of A!). Of course, it would be a tricky case for the copyright holder to argue but you just don't want to go there!

Jaybez wrote:Thanks for the info on velocity layers, maybe more work than I orignally thought

Yep.... it's not easy preparing and making sound library! And yet everyone now expects it for FREE!!! I think it's fair to say that one of THE most common requests here (and elsewhere ) is "Where can I get FREE samples of XYZ?". Here are a few thoughts/analogies....

"Hi! I want to learn to play guitar - where can I get a free guitar, amp and effects pedals?"

Or....

"I love fishing - it's my main hobby. Where can I get free bait and handmade fly-hooks?"

Or....

"I am a professional bricklayer. Any ideas where I can get free bricks, cement and hods?"

No... it doesn't make sense does it? You would just expect to pay for these things without question. And yet in our world, sounds, software synths/samplers/sequencers/effects/whatever are just expected to be a mouse click and a free download away!

Hmmmmm!

Jaybez wrote:Also, when I said C2-C3 I meant those 2 complete octaves, each note.

I think you'd need to cover the Clav's original range. Every minor third would work if you need to economise.

Jaybez wrote:Ill have to watch my bandwidth........

Indeed - the final thorn in the altruist's finger!

Steve

zvon · Post by **zvon** » Wed Jul 20, 2005 5:03 am

hollowsun wrote:
Yep.... it's not easy preparing and making sound library! And yet everyone now expects it for FREE!!! I think it's fair to say that one of THE most common requests here (and elsewhere ) is "Where can I get FREE samples of XYZ?". Here are a few thoughts/analogies....

"I love fishing - it's my main hobby. Where can I get free bait and handmade fly-hooks?"

Steve

You forgot the free transportation (no walking) to the free lake

.

Jaybez · Post by **Jaybez** » Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:51 pm

Hollowsun, many thanks for the extra info. I certainly dont want to infringe any copyrights and to be honest hadn't really given that much thought.
I'll do some further tweaking to take it away from the factory presets, maybe some obssesive listening to Stevie Wonders "Superstition" is in order.
I'll also do some more research into the Clavinet as its just a funky sound that I really like but I guess some poeple would like a more faithful representation of the instrument.

loomchild · Post by **loomchild** » Wed Jul 20, 2005 1:12 pm

And yet everyone now expects it for FREE!!! I think it's fair to say that one of THE most common requests here (and elsewhere ) is "Where can I get FREE samples of XYZ?". Here are a few thoughts/analogies....

Ah... the good old Internet spirit. Such an annoyance. It was so much better when generous people wishing to share their work just for the sake of it and regardless of the amount of time they had put in it, couldn't interract with thousands and thousands of people on a huge network.

Free Clavinet Sample Kit