doubling vocals or guitars???

[jens]

you gotta play VERY tight for this to work.

yes - that's the problem...

[rockstar_not]

Don't know if this is considered 'doubling', but I do it all the time when I wan't to 'widen' the image of a mono recorded track, usually my acoustic guitar or vocals since I have only one mic pre :

1. Make a copy of the original track
2. Hard pan original left, copy right
3. Time shift the copy by a few mS
4. Audition
5. Adjust time shift to taste.

-Scott

[Hink]

Don't know if this is considered 'doubling', but I do it all the time when I wan't to 'widen' the image of a mono recorded track, usually my acoustic guitar or vocals since I have only one mic pre :

1. Make a copy of the original track
2. Hard pan original left, copy right
3. Time shift the copy by a few mS
4. Audition
5. Adjust time shift to taste.

-Scott

add a couple cents pitch shift to each side...one up, one down and it will spread it more (or appear to anyhow) but I mean just a few cents....3-5 tops...

[Sascha Franck]

1. Make a copy of the original track
2. Hard pan original left, copy right
3. Time shift the copy by a few mS
4. Audition
5. Adjust time shift to taste.

Well, some plugins would do the job as well, but of course they'd use up CPU power.
I'm doing such things as well, but it's more like a static chorus effect.
You usually don't get the same fatness as when doing true doublings.

[Hink]

1. Make a copy of the original track
2. Hard pan original left, copy right
3. Time shift the copy by a few mS
4. Audition
5. Adjust time shift to taste.

Well, some plugins would do the job as well, but of course they'd use up CPU power.
I'm doing such things as well, but it's more like a static chorus effect.
You usually don't get the same fatness as when doing true doublings.

by static chorus are you saying you're using a tiny amount of delay time to produce a comb filter effect?

[jens]

You usually don't get the same fatness as when doing true doublings.

I'm convinced that you never get the same fatness - also it tends to sound amatuerish&lifeless - why not simply recording another take? It's hardly more work...

[Sascha Franck]

by static chorus are you saying you're using a tiny amount of delay time to produce a comb filter effect?

Kinda. Sometimes it's making sense, sometimes it isn't.

I'm convinced that you never get the same fatness - also it tends to sound amatuerish&lifeless - why not simply recording another take? It's hardly more work...

Well, as said above, sometimes the effect makes sense.
Add to this that "simply recording another take" could be a very tough thing, especially for vocals.

I prefer real doublings most of the time, but then... it's work!

[jens]

Add to this that "simply recording another take" could be a very tough thing, especially for vocals.

as I'm not the vocalist of my songs it's quite easy for me to record another take - I just need to press record.

[Hink]

by static chorus are you saying you're using a tiny amount of delay time to produce a comb filter effect?

Kinda. Sometimes it's making sense, sometimes it isn't.

I'm convinced that you never get the same fatness - also it tends to sound amatuerish&lifeless - why not simply recording another take? It's hardly more work...

Well, as said above, sometimes the effect makes sense.
Add to this that "simply recording another take" could be a very tough thing, especially for vocals.

I prefer real doublings most of the time, but then... it's work!

let's be honest (because I know we all do it at one time or another)...and not leave out the "I'll never do that again" syndrome....

[jens]

let's be honest

o.k.

(because I know we all do it at one time or another)...

no!

[Sascha Franck]

FWIW, Eddie van Halens live setup is somewhat emulating realtime doubling. From what I remember he's using a 20ms (or a little shorter) slightly modulated delay on one stereo side. Modulation allways is a good trick to avoid stiffness.

[MickGael]

IMO, its the slight imperfections in the double-tracking that make them interesting.

Othewrwise, you can just use a delay line to pan an exact "copy" left or right.

I think the minor variations in real double tracking add texture to are recording, and a "human" feel and character - something I usually have to work to add to predominantly VSTi recordings....

[Hink]

FWIW, Eddie van Halens live setup is somewhat emulating realtime doubling. From what I remember he's using a 20ms (or a little shorter) slightly modulated delay on one stereo side. Modulation allways is a good trick to avoid stiffness.

I somewhat based my rig on his...however I used an article in guitar from like the mid 80's so it might be bull...originaly that's why I bought a super chorus. The super chorus has a direct out and a modultaed out, so as chorus really is time based and a short delay run into two amps would be sweet. I had a Boogie SOB at the time (head) and had a line on another when my axes and stack got ripped off. I replaced it (slowly) with my Marshall Stereo tube pre, now I had no reason to split my input...where eddy started by-passing (according to the mag anyhow) the marshall power stage and running into 400 watt yamahas...I ran my smaller version (I just use 1 4x12 these days) into an old (solid) CS 400, I wired the cab stereo and down to 4 ohms on each side. In other words, plenty of power...way more then I use, as you know. But the rig only uses a midiverb 4 now, which is stereo...I use just a bit of delay (like you say) and a spring sounding reverb. But I've never been one for effects. I run the pre into an Aphex Aurel Exciter between the pre and power amps.


One note about the Marshall I have, the thing has three channels. Rhythm 1, Rhythm 2 and Lead I believe...the rhythm 1 doesn't give as much gain, but it does sound very nice using a GT2 as a pre-amp (it sounds good with my beat to death boss turbo OD too), the Rhythm channel can produce some very nice Marshall sounds...the Lead has two OD's one voice and a master...it's sick...I have never found a sound that isn't just plain overkill...it does have a 5 band active eq, and it has the stereo return...3 level outs and the attentuation of the send and return is very nice too...that's why I like it. But the PSA 1 has been crying my name for years now..and well, that could be oneday if I see a good deal on ebay.

I copped 4 Celestion G35's out of a beat up Fender cab that was in the basement of a store I worked at (dont worry it was garbage bound and know one else cared but me) and put them in a Crate slant cab...I then sold the cab to mu alter ego "Roland Dube"...of course I made my good friend Roland a sweet trade on some used gear he brought in...and it was a crate cab with cheap speakers (at least on paper) so Roland got a real nice deal...

The sad thing is, this is a killer rig...it sounds sweet and it's versatile...but yet the only time I turn it on is when my neighbors ask for it...

[Markleford]

Hyup, I'll double vocals and guitars (and sometimes horns) depending on my mood.

I also like imperfect doubles and agree that it makes things interesting.

Also helps with my out of tune vocals (and horns), as the error makes for a chorusy sound.

- m