Black innovation?

[zck]

I can see how black ppl can be credited with inventing blues, rap, hiphop, and house. I can't see how that applies to electronica, trance and dance music, newage, metal and pop music in general. You could trace the origins of lets say metal to blues but that is a very looooong way to go. The word invent just doesn't apply here. That's not to say that blacks didn't have a great deal of influence on the music of XX century. Whether That was a good or bad influence is a matter of taste entirely

[stale bread]

BTW, If you do a little history you'll probably discovery that the white working classes in England were equally as enslaved as the black captives. They just dont tell you about that in school, I guess its not pc.


not the same thing. were their language, culture,beliefs, and rights to be educated taken from them .

In the case of the Scotts / Celts / Welsh and Irish I would have to say most definately yes.
Even the discrimination my mother and her family experienced having moved to London several years before WWII from Ireland was utterly atrocious.
Verbal abuse , sledging , being denied acces to certain educational services and jobs.
People in the street use too cross the road and refuse to walk on the same footpath as them.
Either that or they where quite often sworn at and spat on etc..
Most people just treated them like dirty lazy scum where they grew up in the UK.

Fax are you saying that your family cannot trace their ancestry?

[freeztar]

Hmmm...this thread does suck, well maybe not originally, but it does now (albiet I haven't, and don't care to, read the whole thing).

Nonetheless I've read some interesting perspectives.
I don't know if this has been mentioned, but Art seems to flourish the most at times of depravity and restrictiveness. At times of extreme trial, creativity blooms to combat the mundane oppressiveness.
This applies universally to all humans, regardless of skin tone.
Progress of any form is generally the same, problems are approached and dealt with through one media or another.

Hmmm....Wouldn't it be nice to see at night like day, I think I'll invent a lightbulb. Or, I hate climbing the stairs, it would be nice if I had an elevator.
Or, shit my life sucks, I'm gonna sing some blues.
Or, my tribe needs connectiveness, let's dance to some drums.

[coldmachine]

They even outlawed our Bagpipes. The only instrument ever to be declared a weapon of war.

[freeztar]

Capoeira was formed because the slaves couldn't practice fighting, so they hid it in dance. Maybe bagpipes should have become waterguns or something.

[stale bread]

i don't think this thread sucks at all, for the most part people have been cordial and courteous, the negative peaks have been tamed.we need to talk about all
of these things, all of these topics that have been touched upon from one post through to another. you know we tell our kids to not hide things, that its wrong and non-beneficial but then we go right ahead and do it when it comes to the most important things such as human
relations, it's obvious that the more we want to hide from it the more we need to discuss it out in the open.

[Cabinfever]

it's so dull. everyone seems to want to show how terribly victimized they were. so what ? everyone can show something in their ancestry that was an example of injustice. in my family the prussians gave us hell. big deal.

as for this black innovation crap, again so what. are blacks so insecure in their achievements that we need to tally up a score of how many great things they've done in music ? surely not.

it's a completely ridiculous notion that just invites other people to make their own little lists based on race.

is that what we want ?

[Cheeso]

I can see how black ppl can be credited with inventing blues, rap, hiphop, and house. I can't see how that applies to electronica, trance and dance music...pop music in general.

Electronica and dance music trace their roots back to soul and rhythm and blues, aka, "black music." And nearly every "pop singer" you can name in the last 50 years is emulating black singers.

[pHz]

They even outlawed our Bagpipes. The only instrument ever to be declared a weapon of war.

but they were ...

slainte rob

[Cheeso]

BLACK: All the enduring, popular ones but none of the good ones.
WHITE: All of the good ones, none of the enduring popular ones.

I can almost guarantee that I will not like anything with any kind of black influence. Its how I divide the rock music I like from the rock I don't like - British rock has far less blues influence in general and American rock [I don't like] is tainted by blues influence.

You've got to be kidding.

Cream, Pink Floyd, The Who, The Beatles, The Stones...the list of British rock bands influenced by the blues goes on and on.

And if you want to say punk was not influenced by the blues, let's take a quick look at some punk bands:
Sex Pistols covered "Johnny B. Goode"
The Clash covered James Booker
The Damned covered The Stones
Don't even think about The Jam.

New Model Army? They are SHITE!

Come on now, Bonesy...

[ericj23]

"Electronica and dance music trace their roots back to soul and rhythm and blues, aka, "black music.""

no they dont - they trace their roots to kraftwerk - who are clearly in the european classical tradition - no funky beats to be seen anywhere

the fact that black people then merged this with r&b later is really rather irrelevant

but frankly who cares - this is all implies that it is OK to divide achievements up by race - which is just rascism by another name

[nuffink]

"Electronica and dance music trace their roots back to soul and rhythm and blues, aka, "black music.""

no they dont - they trace their roots to kraftwerk - who are clearly in the european classical tradition - no funky beats to be seen anywhere

pfft. I don't know what kind of dance music you're listening to but I guarantee it's the kind where people march up and down rather than acually dance.

[zck]

I can see how black ppl can be credited with inventing blues, rap, hiphop, and house. I can't see how that applies to electronica, trance and dance music...pop music in general.

Electronica and dance music trace their roots back to soul and rhythm and blues, aka, "black music."

I very much doubt that anyone who today produces electronica, trance, ebm etc. is even aware of the styles of music you mentioned. The links and influences that might have been there in the past, presently are nonexistent.

And nearly every "pop singer" you can name in the last 50 years is emulating black singers.

There's too much stuff out there, even on narrow minded radio stations, to point one major influence let alone claim that everyone is emulating black singers. Unless you're talking about US radio soaked with hiphop and hiphop singers emulating other hiphop singers

[RapRogue]

Worthless thread if ever I saw one...

Human's of all colors are one species.


Move along...

Yeah, sometime people might actually agree with you
beside and outside of the borders of your own fantasy world, lol.

The thread is great, a lot of comments like yours show
this for a fact.

To continue following the evolution/technological line
of thought, I guess Lucy or Kenyanthropus (Africa still) gave birth to all scientific
achievements...haha.
Because if not for them, no us. (giving the possibility for invention)
Now I seriously doubt you will use that line of thought again, as you do not
have the mindset to deal with it all.

Last point to make is if musicians who always pride
themselves to be without borders/limitations and what
not, have such a hard time with this. Then you should
be able to imagine reality, that is, if you are not in
a state of denial...of course.

[Pantsdown666]

"Electronica and dance music trace their roots back to soul and rhythm and blues, aka, "black music.""

no they dont - they trace their roots to kraftwerk - who are clearly in the european classical tradition - no funky beats to be seen anywhere

hmmm .... time for you to have another listen to the rhythms on the "Computerworld" album