Black innovation?

[tee boy]

BLACK: All the enduring, popular ones but none of the good ones.
WHITE: All of the good ones, none of the enduring popular ones.

I can almost guarantee that I will not like anything with any kind of black influence. Its how I divide the rock music I like from the rock I don't like - British rock has far less blues influence in general and American rock [I don't like] is tainted by blues influence.

You've got to be kidding.

Cream, Pink Floyd, The Who, The Beatles, The Stones...the list of British rock bands influenced by the blues goes on and on.

And if you want to say punk was not influenced by the blues, let's take a quick look at some punk bands:
Sex Pistols covered "Johnny B. Goode"
The Clash covered James Booker
The Damned covered The Stones
Don't even think about The Jam.

New Model Army? They are SHITE!

Come on now, Bonesy...

Yep, I will not deny the massive influence of blues in Brit rock.

But again, I hate the way other influences seem to be shown the door. The Beetles used progression of 5ths, modulation, diatonic scales, modes etc. These are European principles. They then went on to experiment with musique conrete.

But it seems that these MOBO guys will tell you that the Beetles are 100% in debt to the Afro American slaves or some shite. Who ever puts that rubbish about needs a good kick in the betty swollocks imo. And yes, I know it was probably some rich white dude sat in his record company office.

Just another example of the rich manipulating the poor i guess.

[pHz]

i do care to argue (usually) ...

perhaps its just me though ...

That is you. I do not care to argue things I do not care about, as I feel that is a waste of my time (making music?). However, that is just me.

bloody hell ... we agree (i think) ... there ARE things worth arguing about ... there ARE things not worth arguing about ... shame its all subjective though ...

... i trust you understand though that i WASNT arguing about the subject of this thread ... more debating the NATURE of the argument itself ...

(and that IS sometimes worth discussion IMHO ... particularly in sensitive / contentious contexts like this one)

slainte rob

[hitman8081]

Mal DuFunq wrote:

Junior, you just don't seem to be getting the point which is surprising conidering it right there on the top of your head. Whether you want to face it or not many of the most popular pop styles since the 19th century have been developed/invented by people of African descent. To say 'Just a few talented ones' denies both the pattern that exists and the whole socio-historical context. Art is never created in a vaccuum.

But I think I can help. I have a talent for expanding a narrow mind. Repeat after me:

Ragtime, the blues, gospel, jazz, rhythm n blues, rock n roll, samba, calypso, ska, , salsa, reggae, soul, funk, techno, hip hop were all created by people of African descent.

Now repeat ten more times to yourself, absorb it, assimilate it and then we can end this thread.
thread.


imo its racist through and through. to say that any one music as solely created by any one culture or race is bullshit. music is defined by those who make it not by the way people look. and every musican is influenced by every other musican. no one person and surely no one race has sole claim to any single genre of music. and for you to claim black pride on 15 different styles of music is downright insulting and just plain ignorant.

[tee boy]

Try telling him that. You may get the 'absorb' speech too.

[projectdan]

Let him think what he wants, it just doesnt matter what he thinks.
I would have trouble with the claim anyone invented any type of music, different types are too related to say that they are an invention (especially by one individual), they are all continuous mutations and developed in a much wider context of community/society to be claimed as a single isolated invention/development. Music is a continuous development coming from many different sources, and they all feed off each other, and all the experiences people have.

It could also all be claimed to be discovery rather than invention/development.

[androidlove]

how bout those mexicans?

[tee boy]

Precisely Nine O Nine.

Pay homage to the artist, not his race.

[ericj23]

"Electronica and dance music trace their roots back to soul and rhythm and blues, aka, "black music.""

no they dont - they trace their roots to kraftwerk - who are clearly in the european classical tradition - no funky beats to be seen anywhere

hmmm .... time for you to have another listen to the rhythms on the "Computerworld" album

what that would be 1980's computerworld when everyone and their dog had a drum machine

try finding those funky beats on something like 1974's radioactivity

and all electronic dance music be it in rigid time or funky as a funky thing traces itself to kraftwerk

pfft. I don't know what kind of dance music you're listening to but I guarantee it's the kind where people march up and down rather than acually dance.

errr what - OK i didnt specify electronic dance music (which less face it is what everyone means when they use the term) but i still don't know what kind of reply that is?? - what possible made you think you had any insight into the music i like ?

[tee boy]

how bout those mexicans?

Hey, I resent that. My uncle's best mates wife way half Mexican. Capiche senoir?

[Cheeso]

how bout those mexicans?

Hey, I resent that. My uncle's best mates wife way half Mexican. Capiche senoir?

Hey, I'm Mexican! And a chunk of Mexican music is influenced by German polka music, believe it or not!

[androidlove]

oh i believe it. there's plenty of oompa around here

[Cheeso]

I can see how black ppl can be credited with inventing blues, rap, hiphop, and house. I can't see how that applies to electronica, trance and dance music...pop music in general.

Electronica and dance music trace their roots back to soul and rhythm and blues, aka, "black music."

I very much doubt that anyone who today produces electronica, trance, ebm etc. is even aware of the styles of music you mentioned.

That's presumptive, and quite frankly, naive to even think that.

[androidlove]

i weep for this thread

[herodotus]

how bout those mexicans?

Cafe Tacuba are the most under rated pop band I know.

Victimas del Doctor Cerebro, Caifanes, Animal, and Molotov are also very good.

[bobbyblank]

you're making baby jesus cry. because jesus- who as you all know is black, is ALSO waiting for more black innovation. black baby jesus is hurt that you would shun, or ignore, or minimize black music's contribution to the world; or diminish and demean african influence with dry post-collegiate summations. black baby jesus understands that rational points must be made for the sake of debate, but baby jesus knows that capturing black music's essence with words is tricky. black baby jesus would like to thank a few of you for truly being humble servants of the Funk, and wants a few of you to keel over dead in a couple of weeks. black baby jesus also understands that BONES isn't really a black-hating-nazi like his post makes him out to be, he's just really into industrial. black baby jesus respects his contributions to the industrial scene, but is working on a theory that skinny puppy and ministry are influenced by black music...and something about Al Jourgenson selling his soul to Papa Legba at the crossroads...
black baby jesus would nuke this thread if he could just.
stop.
crying.