Note tunable & beat syncing Reverbs
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- KVRAF
- 5350 posts since 8 Aug, 2003 from Berlin Germany
Is there a Reverb that will take midi in to tune the resonant frequencies? Also looking fo reverbs that have beat syncing features. (VST on a PC)
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- KVRian
- 769 posts since 2 Apr, 2005
Why would you want a reverb to 'tune the resonant frequencies?' A reverb pretty much extends whatever frequencies you put into it. Maybe you want a midi controlled filter effect? That's basically a vocoder, so sure you could apply a vocoder to a reverb for a wierd effect.
By beat syncing - do you mean gating? Some reverbs have gates, but I much prefer to use a seperate gate plugin. I do think that reverb should groove, but that's usually best adjusted by ear. I have experimented with things like Kjaerhus GMO-1 - which is a modulator that can sync to host, and has phase adjustment too. So you could for example, apply a triangle wave to modulate the amplitude of a reverb tail. If the tempo changed, the reverb would still rise and fall in sync.
I would like to see reverbs that could sync to tempo directly - but at the moment it's hard just to find a reverb that sounds good. The last thing we need is more reverbs that have a million parameters but still sound like shyte.
By beat syncing - do you mean gating? Some reverbs have gates, but I much prefer to use a seperate gate plugin. I do think that reverb should groove, but that's usually best adjusted by ear. I have experimented with things like Kjaerhus GMO-1 - which is a modulator that can sync to host, and has phase adjustment too. So you could for example, apply a triangle wave to modulate the amplitude of a reverb tail. If the tempo changed, the reverb would still rise and fall in sync.
I would like to see reverbs that could sync to tempo directly - but at the moment it's hard just to find a reverb that sounds good. The last thing we need is more reverbs that have a million parameters but still sound like shyte.
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- KVRian
- 886 posts since 2 Jun, 2005 from Hawaii
dfx has rezsynth, which allows you to "play" resonant bands with your keyboard. http://destroyfx.smartelectronix.com/
i haven't used it much yet, but i'm hoping to find the opportunity soon.
i haven't used it much yet, but i'm hoping to find the opportunity soon.
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- KVRian
- 1119 posts since 29 Jun, 2004 from within you without you
Divide your bpm by 60,000. Then adjust your times (decay and/or predelay) to multiples of the total.
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- KVRian
- 1008 posts since 9 Aug, 2004 from helsinki rock city
what about trancegate or midi gate?
the problem with gates tho is that the reverb is still ringing there even when it's gated out, and will prolly "bleed" into the next note, too.
that is, if you want to have the reverb decay pretty long for lush and strong reverbation until it's gated, and you don't want to use a compressor ..
does any reverb allow just cutting it completely in the middle of the reverbation?
the problem with gates tho is that the reverb is still ringing there even when it's gated out, and will prolly "bleed" into the next note, too.
that is, if you want to have the reverb decay pretty long for lush and strong reverbation until it's gated, and you don't want to use a compressor ..
does any reverb allow just cutting it completely in the middle of the reverbation?
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- KVRian
- 1008 posts since 9 Aug, 2004 from helsinki rock city
tried that .. didn't work out .. there's just so many sounds you can get out of those skinny flaps. gets quite boring quite fast ..greendoor wrote:Or better yet - make music with your ears.
what's that gotta do with reverbs anyway? don't tell me you're using your skull as a reverb chamber.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 5350 posts since 8 Aug, 2003 from Berlin Germany
guys a resonator is good but reverbs are based on comb filters and delays all of which are "pitchable"
Have you ever been in a tunnel and noticed that if you sweep a whistle that one pitch will ring out and the others not so much?
As for tempo sync I will be adjusting the host tempo and want a very rhythmic efect with the predelay and tail. Currently I program these parameter changes in MS but it gets tedious. Maybe I'll make the effect I'm talking about.
Have you ever been in a tunnel and noticed that if you sweep a whistle that one pitch will ring out and the others not so much?
As for tempo sync I will be adjusting the host tempo and want a very rhythmic efect with the predelay and tail. Currently I program these parameter changes in MS but it gets tedious. Maybe I'll make the effect I'm talking about.
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- KVRAF
- 12235 posts since 18 Aug, 2003
Craig Bannister's RoomMaker lets you adjust the tuning of each reverberant, but it doesn't accept midi notes to do it. 12th Floor's Reverb Assistant did too, but its site seems to be gone.
Audio Damage's Deverb allows MIDI notes to gate the reverb or extend the length to infinity on and off (I think that's how it works), and lets you adjust room size with the modwheel. Probably the closest you'll get unless you make it yourself.
Audio Damage's Deverb allows MIDI notes to gate the reverb or extend the length to infinity on and off (I think that's how it works), and lets you adjust room size with the modwheel. Probably the closest you'll get unless you make it yourself.
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- KVRian
- 769 posts since 2 Apr, 2005
For a rythmnic effect predelay, you could set the reverb pre-delay at 0, and preceed the reverb with a host-sync'd delay plugin (plenty to choose from). A midi-gate could shut off the tail right on the note you choose, and being note-based it would follow tempo.
I agree - it would be nice to have these functions built into a reverb, but first the reverb has to sound good. That's the hard part.
By 'using your ears', what I meant is that sometimes the mathematically perfect data doesn't sound good. Especially something like a reverb tail - having it decay based on a note length might be good, but there is a big difference between the calculated RT60, and where - in the context of a mix - your ear thinks the sound actually stops.
I agree - it would be nice to have these functions built into a reverb, but first the reverb has to sound good. That's the hard part.
By 'using your ears', what I meant is that sometimes the mathematically perfect data doesn't sound good. Especially something like a reverb tail - having it decay based on a note length might be good, but there is a big difference between the calculated RT60, and where - in the context of a mix - your ear thinks the sound actually stops.
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- KVRAF
- 8711 posts since 24 May, 2002 from Tutukaka, New Zealand
Yeah, I was going to suggest Pianoverb - that is tunable (as far as I know, only in single notes though...can't play chords with it).
Certainly there are a few h/w reverb units that could do resonating pitched reverb - I vaguely remember the old Alesis Quadraverb could do it. Some of the better Digitech units could do it, and I'm sure I remember Lexicon PCMs having the ability to do it. For anyone that's giving him a bit of flak for the idea - don't knock it until you try it - it has limited uses, but if you've not actually heard a tuned resonant reverb, you likely won't know what he means. It is a known FX and it definitely does have uses, such as chordal reverb on things like drums. You could get something akin to it by using a vocoder then a 100% wet reverb of it and applying it over the original signal, but it rarely sounds the same as a truely tuned resonant reverb...vocoders have too many artifacts in them.
I'm sure I've come across a VST reverb somewhere that had the capability, but for the life of me, I can't remember which one it was. Sorry
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As someone mentioned - I'd also look for some comb filter plugins that might just do a dense enough set of delays to come across as reverb - I vaguely remember one of the GRM Tools FX could make something close to it and still respond to midi for the chord control. ConcreteFX released some kind of comb filter delay that might possibly do it also.
Failing that - you might pick up a Quadraverb1 for next to nothing - they definitely had the facility (although the reverb quality itself won't stand up to many VST reverbs of today.
I rarely used it when I had a Quadraverb, but I remember being blown away the first time I tried it - I think it was upto a maximum of 6 notes you could use simultaneously to control the reverb pitch - which enabled almost any chord progression you wanted. It was a rare but useful FX. Not a silly idea at all.
Certainly there are a few h/w reverb units that could do resonating pitched reverb - I vaguely remember the old Alesis Quadraverb could do it. Some of the better Digitech units could do it, and I'm sure I remember Lexicon PCMs having the ability to do it. For anyone that's giving him a bit of flak for the idea - don't knock it until you try it - it has limited uses, but if you've not actually heard a tuned resonant reverb, you likely won't know what he means. It is a known FX and it definitely does have uses, such as chordal reverb on things like drums. You could get something akin to it by using a vocoder then a 100% wet reverb of it and applying it over the original signal, but it rarely sounds the same as a truely tuned resonant reverb...vocoders have too many artifacts in them.
I'm sure I've come across a VST reverb somewhere that had the capability, but for the life of me, I can't remember which one it was. Sorry
.As someone mentioned - I'd also look for some comb filter plugins that might just do a dense enough set of delays to come across as reverb - I vaguely remember one of the GRM Tools FX could make something close to it and still respond to midi for the chord control. ConcreteFX released some kind of comb filter delay that might possibly do it also.
Failing that - you might pick up a Quadraverb1 for next to nothing - they definitely had the facility (although the reverb quality itself won't stand up to many VST reverbs of today.
I rarely used it when I had a Quadraverb, but I remember being blown away the first time I tried it - I think it was upto a maximum of 6 notes you could use simultaneously to control the reverb pitch - which enabled almost any chord progression you wanted. It was a rare but useful FX. Not a silly idea at all.
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- KVRian
- 769 posts since 2 Apr, 2005
Interesting idea - I guess you could use multiple Pianoverbs on different send channels, and play chords with discrete midi tracks ...
I vaguely remember my old Quadraverb and that resonator setting ...
I vaguely remember my old Quadraverb and that resonator setting ...
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- KVRian
- 1202 posts since 8 May, 2003 from Munich
Why not put a filter after the reverb and adjust a bandpass frequency with the midi input? Not tried it yet, but I think quadfrohmage would let you do that.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 5350 posts since 8 Aug, 2003 from Berlin Germany
Thanks for all the feedback. Guess there is a whole in the market to fill. I'll see what I can do about that.