[RANT] Solo function in Cubase SX

[Sascha Franck]

Nonsense. If there's ONE program constantly forcing you to open and close multiple windows, it's got to be Cubase! Plugin windows don't "chain" with each other (which is just the bees knees in Logic), linked editors are only workin "somwhow" (never use the solo function when working in editors...) and you can place things as freely as in Logic, for instance, editors aren't working as float windows, which means you'll have to resize your main program window to place them on your second monitor - effectively wasting more space with title bars and the likes, let alone this isn't exactly working fine on differently sized monitors.

Seriously, it's Cubase forcing you to permanently deal with Windows. Apart from plugin windows, I NEVER open ANY new window in Logic, regardless whether I'm working on one or two monitors. I just don't have to, it's all there in my screensets (which are completely convoluted in SX, as said, try with a screenset using project, float mixer and editor windows).

[mojkarma]

It's just a good prove that their testers actually don't seem to work enough on some issues. I've been on more than enough beta testing teams where such a thing wouldn't have had the slightest chance to slip through.
So, either their testers just don't hammer the program hard enough or they simply had to rush this release out again, without any final quality control

In logic pro 7 you can create temporary groups by selecting more channels either in the trackmixer or in the environment. After they are selected you could change volume, pan, inserts, sendlevels etc.
This function (well described in the manual) is broken after installing the (paid!) update to 7.1. Only some functions are still working.
I know that I'm loosing the "battle" against diehard logicusers, but that broken function was meaning a lot to me. If Apple sells me an update for 20 dollars (I actually paid 25 euros, that's more than 20 dollars), I can expect even more quality control

BTW, I have never used ctrl+tab in a program

[Sascha Franck]

See, I'm not saying that either the Apple move or Logic 7 have been good deals. That's why we're still using version 6 at the local conservatory.
Things at Emagic have gone all havoc since the Apple buyout. Until the release of 5.5.1 (and actually quite a while after that), Logic, at least from my personal experience, has been the most efficient and stable sequencer on the PC platform (it actually was even running better than 5.5.1/Mac). Plus, it has been the most x-platform compatible one (unless you were using SDII files on the Mac). OK, there's a few VST incompatibility issues, but those could've been fixed if there only was further VST support.

However, after the Apple move, things only got worse. Sure, version 6 is still really solid on the G5s I'm maintaining, and 7.1 doesn't seem to be all too buggy anymore either, but it seems to me that Emapple somewhat lost track... I mean, they still didn't fix some highly annoying things left from version 2-3, such as recklocking, which is just as f**ked up as it could get (and we were promised to get this redone with version 5...). Instead they started adding gizmos. Of course, all the new plugins are nice, of course, Appleloops aren't bad either - but then, can you imagine that their OWN internal plugins have WORSE (almost none) MIDI support than any 3rd party ones? Program changes? NO WAY! MIDI learn/assign? NO WAY! Support of MIDI plugins or reworking of the environment, so you can finally use arpeggiators and the likes with virtual instruments? NO WAY!
Then, add to this that they cancelled VST support, which has ONLY been good for FXpansion, nothing else. The AU format yet hasn't shown any benefits as most companies can't take full advance of it because they need to develop VST versions in parallel anyways. Just imagine, I can't even load a PC-made song using NI plugins on the Mac anymore, simply because it won't automatically do some "Can't find VST plugin, load AU version instead?" job. I'm running NIs Komplete 2 on both my (and the medialabs) PCs and on the G5s. Yet, there's less compatibility than ever before. This just stinks.

There's TONS more of things I could talk about - just wanted to let you know that I'm perfectly aware of a whole bunch of f**ked up things regarding Logic.
So it's not as if I'd actually defend Emapple (they lost me when they made the move...).
Yes, I will get a Mac one day, in case there's no alternatives on the PC platform (and so far there's none, for various reasons I won't describe right now).

However, all that doesn't change anything regarding the totally f**ked up solo functionality in SX. And, as you may remember, that's what this rant was all about. I only used Logic to compare because that's the other sequencer I'm pretty much familiar with. Probably I could've used others to compare as well...

[stag]

BTW, I have never used ctrl+tab in a program

Hello:
i don´t use it either, SX let´s me organize my windows and asign them KC, but mostly i find everything on the track view, but then i´m not into soundtracks, my projects end up with a maximum of 20, average 12 tracks including the drums.
But i know people who have to manage a lot more than 100, that´s crazy, this way i never set a marker or anything, i just keep up with the traffic... still i don´t know what could be the best app to pull out a film sound track with 400+ tracks.

[advaya]

I am sorry to hear that making/sequencing music is such a painful experience for you...

In all seriousness though, you've been bashing steinberg for months-upon-months now for their shoddy implementation of pretty much everything (not to mention the graphics of the interface).

Maybe it really is time to switch!

[Sascha Franck]

I can't switch as I have 12 PCs in the local conservatory's medialab running SX and no other sequencer. So I need to use it. I don't let my own music even halfway near to it anyways.

[mojkarma]

To be honest, really, I had some minor problems with the solobutton in conjunction with vst-channels or fx-tracks, I don't remember, but they haven't stopped my from working and finishing a song.
Sorry, but I neither can't nor I want to talk about Logic 5.5.1. I'm on pro 7 on a mac. That's my version and I don't care about your opinion what apple made right and what wrong.
Fact is: Logic's mixer misses a solo and mute button (even your 5.5. version) and I wont make some screensets just to see the missed buttons on the arrangetrack.
That's life, you have one showstopper and I have another; you are praising Logics quantize function and I'm becoming headache when I have to program drums in the hypereditor.
Why don't you start a rant by saying how f...ing stupid the hypereditor in Logic is for creating drums and that you are happy when you get over to cubase to do it in a great, easy and logical way!

[Sascha Franck]

Why don't you start a rant by saying how f...ing stupid the hypereditor in Logic is for creating drums and that you are happy when you get over to cubase to do it in a great, easy and logical way!

Because I prefer hyperedit. Yeah, it's that easy.

[mojkarma]

Because I prefer hyperedit. Yeah, it's that easy.

For every change of the resolution you have to open a new lane of the same instrument, because you cannot change the resolution once it is set up. That's a great editor. Just my basic drumset covers all the screenspace (20") because I have to open a new lane for every f**king new resolution change.

[Sascha Franck]

For every change of the resolution you have to open a new lane of the same instrument, because you cannot change the resolution once it is set up.

WTF are you talking about? When you select a lane, there's a pulldown on the left, allowing you to change the grids resolution. Plus, you can change multiple resolutions at once, should that be your desire.

[mojkarma]

For every change of the resolution you have to open a new lane of the same instrument, because you cannot change the resolution once it is set up.

WTF are you talking about? When you select a lane, there's a pulldown on the left, allowing you to change the grids resolution. Plus, you can change multiple resolutions at once, should that be your desire.

You have to do that before you put some events. An example: you have a snare-lane and your resolution is set to 1/16. Now, if you have put some events there and you want to create a 1/32 note, it is not possible. You have to create a new lane and set the resolution to 1/32 before using it.
Again, in LogicPro7 you cannot change the resolution once you placed an event on the lane. You have to create a new on. DO YOU GET IT! Jesus, I'm talking about Logic ver. 7. I don't care how it is on a 3 years old version of Logic 5.

[Sascha Franck]

Again, in LogicPro7 you cannot change the resolution once you placed an event on the lane. You have to create a new on. DO YOU GET IT! Jesus, I'm talking about Logic ver. 7. I don't care how it is on a 3 years old version.

Now, if that is true (and I have to believe you, because currently I've got no access to Logic 7), it'd be truly f**ked up. This is such an essential function I'd think about getting my chainsaw out if Emapple had it f**ked up indeed.
It's working fine in version 6 - and as said, I've got no idea why in the world something rather essential like this should be changed.

[mojkarma]

Right now, I'm not in front of my DAW, but I will just explicitely try it out again and - if needed - post the results here.
BTW, it seems to me that more than one thing is f...ed up in ver.7 compared to the previous.
I'm in a different situation than you: I don't have a old version, you don't have anybody to talk about really(on a cubase forum you can report bugs at least and get a confirmation) and for any single problem you have to pay 200 bucks for phone-support, if you have bought logic just one day before a new version is announced, you will stil have to pay for the new version (no grace period).
You have to see the whole picture. It is sometimes hard to get in love with logic these days.

[Sascha Franck]

Really, I know about the Logic situation - and (apart from the high Mac price tag) it's defenitely been something keeping me away from switching allready. I just didn't feel the need to do so yet.

However, isn't it weird that companies are actually leaving out previously included features in new versions? You won't believe HOW much it has been driving me mad when I dound out that you can't extract a MIDI track from an audio track anymore in SX. I'm using that all the time to build drum trigger tracks, and it was perfectly possible in VST, plus, the technical requirements are still there, it's just that you can't extract hitpoint data to MIDI data anymore (which, as said, has been possible in VST). You can extract to groove templates and markers (wtf?), but there´s no option to just have them available as MIDI data.

Similar things might be true for Logic 7. I wouldn't happen to know.

[Midi_Glider]

However, isn't it weird that companies are actually leaving out previously included features in new versions?

It isn`t that weird when you realize that its a completely separate generations of software and a totally different code structure. the fact that both VST and SX are called 'Cubase' is merely for brand continuum purposes. SX was built pretty much from the ground up (well, from the Nuendo foundation, anyways)and there is very little code shared between that and Cubase VST. so its not like you can just copy & paste code elements from one to the other...

If there's ONE program constantly forcing you to open and close multiple windows

odd, I`v done hundreds of projects on Nuendo\Cubase over the years and today I can perform pretty much 90% of my tasks from the project and mixer windows alone. we obviously must be working in very different manners.

Best,
midi.