Sonar 5 has arrived...

[Brandon Ryan]

the thing is that a properly written plugin will not use any CPU unless audio is running through it. Open a project with however many plugins......if your CPU meter is reading anything before you push play, you have an ineffecient plugin.........asking Sonar to do something the plug-in manufacturer should've done, is silly.

Allright, then around 90% of all plugin companies fail do get the job done it seems.

Not 90% of the plugs I run on my DAW. Not even close.

[Sascha Franck]

Anyways. Logic does the dynamic plugin allocation job for all plugins.
Of course, it's got no clip based FX (which is something I'd TRULY love to have, btw).

I'm sure I'm gonna give the Sonar 5 demo a serious spin, btw. - even if I really don't seem to like the UI at all.
What are the educational offers at Cakewalk like, btw? IF at all, I'd had to get it for 13 machines.

I'd still prefer something x-platform, btw. Right now I'm using SX for the machines in out local conservatory's media lab, but I'm getting rather sick of it. Anyways, as we're using Macs in the main studio rooms... well.

[Brandon Ryan]

Anyways. Logic does the dynamic plugin allocation job for all plugins.
Of course, it's got no clip based FX (which is something I'd TRULY love to have, btw).

I'm sure I'm gonna give the Sonar 5 demo a serious spin, btw. - even if I really don't seem to like the UI at all.
What are the educational offers at Cakewalk like, btw? IF at all, I'd had to get it for 13 machines.

I'd still prefer something x-platform, btw. Right now I'm using SX for the machines in out local conservatory's media lab, but I'm getting rather sick of it. Anyways, as we're using Macs in the main studio rooms... well.

Sascha, there are academic discounts through Cakewalk's academic distributors, of which there are a number. If you call Cakewalk (1-888-Cakewalk) I'm sure someone can point you in the right direction. Sorry I can't give you more specific information than that.

[kp]

Anyways. Logic does the dynamic plugin allocation job for all plugins.
Of course, it's got no clip based FX (which is something I'd TRULY love to have, btw).

Which seems like a disaster (and I use that word advisably) waiting to happen for much the same reason as Whyterabbyt's "losing audio" issue earlier mentioned:

Suppose I have a project with a number of plug-ins running, but not audio on all tracks at all time - ie. under Logic's dynamic allocation, I'd have potentially widely differing CPU usage as time passes.

I record arm a track and have the guitarist playing a blinding solo.

Then a clip kicks in on an effected track that has had no clip on until now and...it's enough to push the CPU over the limit and - bang - dropout. Lost take. Totally unacceptable in any kind of session.

It's not the theory that's bad, but the unpredictability of it - if I can't know (within limits as we know CPU usage does vary anyway) that I'm not going to have a random dropout like this, then I have to either freeze/bounce all the time in order to ensure predictability or not use it for anything like a live recording. Hell, even playing back a recorded piece and suddenly getting a dropout is going to be a royal PITA (and makes something like SONAR's pre-4.03 so-called gapping problem pale into insiginificance).

[Trancit]

Something I noticed today that I didn't know was possible in SONAR5 (and maybe Samplitude and Traktion do this...I don't know...and am interested if anyone does btw), but Clip FX work with MIDI too. In other words you can drag MFX plugs to MIDI clips (or MIDI Groove Clips) and they work just like the DX/VST FX on audio tracks. Pretty cool. I felt stupid for overlooking this before.

Neither Samplitude nor Tracktion can handle MFX, so they doesn`t have Midiplugins as Clip FX


Trancit

[headquest]

Something I noticed today that I didn't know was possible in SONAR5 (and maybe Samplitude and Traktion do this...I don't know...and am interested if anyone does btw), but Clip FX work with MIDI too. In other words you can drag MFX plugs to MIDI clips (or MIDI Groove Clips) and they work just like the DX/VST FX on audio tracks. Pretty cool. I felt stupid for overlooking this before.

Ableton Live has done this since MIDI was introduced in version 4 last year. It works the same as the Audio Clip effects automation introduced in version 3. (you probably know anyway, but in case you or others here didn't).

Neither Samplitude nor Tracktion can handle MFX, so they doesn`t have Midiplugins as Clip FX

Wow - that is lame!!

I'm particularly amazed Samplitude doesn't handle MFX - are you sure? Crumbs...

[christianmusicmaker]

I'd like to be able to browse projects and files that make up each project within the current project. I think the Live packs are the closest thing to what I'm thinking of.

Hi Munchkin, Live5 does allow you to browse project files from its built in browser, (audio and midi) and both can be dragged to an existing project...(just tried it ).

Can this be done in Sonar5? Well it can be done in Sonar 4 already, but in a slightly different way...

If you want to browse for project files from within a browser like Live5 but in Sonar4, all you need to do is use Sonars Loop explorer view.

You can open this up as a floating view / full screen view in Sonar4 or as it now seems, a docked / tabbed view in Sonar 5.

Using this browser you can browse for any audio files on your hard drive. As you appear to be interested in project files in particular you can simply browse to the location of your project files. If you have used the Use Per Project Audio Folders option in Sonar 4 then they should be neatly stored in a folder for easy browsing.

With this open you can drag your audio files straight to Sonars arrange page if the Loop explorer view is floating in Sonar 4. I imagine if the view is docked in Sonar 5 then a simple drag from there should do the same thing.All this can be done in real time while your project is playing.

As for midi files...Live allows you to drag those into an open project as well from its browser in real time as the project plays, can Sonar pull that off...? Yes it can, and without stopping playback.

If you have an existing project open and have followed the steps above then you should have already dragged the audio files you wanted from other projects into your current project.

For midi files even while you project is playing, you can open a second project and drag your midi or audio files from another project straight into your current project *during* playback.

All the steps listed above can be done during playback in Sonar 4, just like Live 5.

You may prefer Live 5's approach to Sonars or vice versa. I think it boils down to how you prefer to work. But you can browse and drag audio and midi files in Sonar as well but just in a slightly different way.

[Trancit]

Something I noticed today that I didn't know was possible in SONAR5 (and maybe Samplitude and Traktion do this...I don't know...and am interested if anyone does btw), but Clip FX work with MIDI too. In other words you can drag MFX plugs to MIDI clips (or MIDI Groove Clips) and they work just like the DX/VST FX on audio tracks. Pretty cool. I felt stupid for overlooking this before.

Ableton Live has done this since MIDI was introduced in version 4 last year. It works the same as the Audio Clip effects automation introduced in version 3. (you probably know anyway, but in case you or others here didn't).

Neither Samplitude nor Tracktion can handle MFX, so they doesn`t have Midiplugins as Clip FX

Wow - that is lame!!

I'm particularly amazed Samplitude doesn't handle MFX - are you sure? Crumbs...

Samplitude is a "newcomer" in point of Midi...

You can do almost everything with audio, but midi implemention is new since V7 I guess...

The guys at magix work hard to work this out and in V9 there will be a few enhancements...if midi fx are one of them...I don`t know...


Trancit

[Brandon Ryan]

Something I noticed today that I didn't know was possible in SONAR5 (and maybe Samplitude and Traktion do this...I don't know...and am interested if anyone does btw), but Clip FX work with MIDI too. In other words you can drag MFX plugs to MIDI clips (or MIDI Groove Clips) and they work just like the DX/VST FX on audio tracks. Pretty cool. I felt stupid for overlooking this before.

Neither Samplitude nor Tracktion can handle MFX, so they doesn`t have Midiplugins as Clip FX


Trancit

Thanks Trancit.

And thanks to Headquest as well.

[whyterabbyt]

Brandon; I asked this at the Cakewalk forums but its not been answered; will S5's VST implementation work with MIDI-processing VSTs, and allow them to record MIDI and/or pass it 'downstream'?

[Brandon Ryan]

Brandon; I asked this at the Cakewalk forums but its not been answered; will S5's VST implementation work with MIDI-processing VSTs, and allow them to record MIDI and/or pass it 'downstream'?

Hey whyterabbyt,

I'm actually not entirely sure, but I think that the answer is "no" at this point (if memory serves). I'll see what I can find out for you in the meantime. Sorry this isn't a very definitive answer.

[_oswald]

First off, excuse me if my typing is ass-tarded, I've been out drinkin' the the mates so grammatical and punctuation errors should be excused in the following post:

I demoed out Sonar 4 today and noticed two really odd things:

1) I could not select my Aardvark LX6 as the audio source. It would allow me to select my NVIDIA motherboard-based audio and the PodXT as sources but not my LX6 (and no other hosts such as Tracktion or Cool Edit 2000 were opened prior to claim any of the LX6 interface ports). Erhm?

2) I couldn't get a MIDI track to recognize the program names of my Evolver that I assigned to it, or to select 'banks' of the Evolver. It would lock at 'Bank ---' and the program names were locked at the default GM names.

Granted I don't have am manual to go with since this is the 4.03 demo from the Cakewalk site, but those are two things I'd really like feedback on because while Sonar is lookin' great (clip based FX and clip-based automation? Sweet!) a good deal for SX popped up and I'm a bit concerned based on those two oddities.

Thanks,
Still recovering from drunken karoke,
Erik

[christianmusicmaker]

Granted I don't have am manual to go with since this is the 4.03 demo from the Cakewalk site

I cannot answer your other questions, Brandon is better placed than me to do that, but if I am not mistaken the full manual is available in the demo version of Sonar...the PDF help file.

In the Sonar demo click on Help then Help Topics then the Contents tab.

[whyterabbyt]

Hey whyterabbyt,

I'm actually not entirely sure, but I think that the answer is "no" at this point (if memory serves). I'll see what I can find out for you in the meantime. Sorry this isn't a very definitive answer.

Much appreciated.

[whyterabbyt]

1) I could not select my Aardvark LX6 as the audio source. It would allow me to select my NVIDIA motherboard-based audio and the PodXT as sources but not my LX6 (and no other hosts such as Tracktion or Cool Edit 2000 were opened prior to claim any of the LX6 interface ports). Erhm?

I cant find the manufacturers website, but I found a review which suggested it might not have WDM drivers. Sonar runs either WDM or ASIO, so you possibly have to switch it to ASIO mode to see the Aardvark.

2) I couldn't get a MIDI track to recognize the program names of my Evolver that I assigned to it, or to select 'banks' of the Evolver. It would lock at 'Bank ---' and the program names were locked at the default GM names.

I tend not to bother with patchnames because Im a lazy bugger, and just change patches from my Evolver's front panel, so I'm not sure if there's any way for Sonar to interrogate patch names from hardware in the first place. However you can manually set up instrument definition files, which set up the patch names. See here for how to make one...

http://www.tweakheadz.com/how_to_build_ ... s_file.htm

I dont know if there's a premade one for the Evolver though, and you'd obviously need to make your own for your own patch sets.