half-wave rectifier octave vst?

[scuzzphut]

I don't trust the skill level of anyone who spells 'research' as 'resurch'.

The ability to spell in a language which is not your native tongue is not high up on my list of DSP skill level indicators.......

[shamann]

I am still waiting for your prove... :hihi:

If you're interested, I came across this waveset synthesis class for SuperCollider (not sure if it'll work on the Windows version). Might outline the technique a bit more clearly.

Oddly, waveset synthesis and distortion doesn't seem that common outside academic/complex synthesis tools (Csound, Kyma, SuperCollider, CDP, PD, etc), though according to some Reaktor descriptions, you can do waveset synthesis with it (don't know what the implementation is like though). Wavesets are a lot like using grains, but smaller units as the two main techniques seem to be either using groups of 3 wavesets as a unit, or the more detailed pitch detection approach.

Weren't CDP supposed to release some form of VST plugins a while ago?

[;-)]

I don't trust the skill level of anyone who spells 'research' as 'resurch'.

The ability to spell in a language which is not your native tongue is not high up on my list of DSP skill level indicators.......

He only wanted to mask his own disabilities with that ("wana be smart") phrase. And his only language is probably his mother language...

Anyone actually can see, that he also don't know really something about the topic, nor that he understood the fundamental principles of what a digital audio stream is and how it can be modified successfully.

.

[;-)]

I am still waiting for your prove...

If you're interested, I came across this waveset synthesis class for SuperCollider (not sure if it'll work on the Windows version). Might outline the technique a bit more clearly.

Oddly, waveset synthesis and distortion doesn't seem that common outside academic/complex synthesis tools (Csound, Kyma, SuperCollider, CDP, PD, etc), though according to some Reaktor descriptions, you can do waveset synthesis with it (don't know what the implementation is like though). Wavesets are a lot like using grains, but smaller units as the two main techniques seem to be either using groups of 3 wavesets as a unit, or the more detailed pitch detection approach.

Weren't CDP supposed to release some form of VST plugins a while ago?

I trust you.
Because I know, that you have fundamental knowledgement in the entire area.

Thanls for the tip and I will take a look at that!

I wrote one year ago a class which did try to achieve that principle with (smart) zero crossing detection. But I gave up, because it seemed to have heavy drawbacks. It worked (of course) merely with monophonic input.

But it did work on a sine wave great!

Maybe I should rewrite some parts of the detection algorithm and/or extent or combine it with a pitch detection based on FFT...


There are two fundamental principles: the one is working with phase distorting but formant preversing wavelets and overlapp and add, the other is working with phase continuous but formant shifting wavecycle repeation and voiceless part copy and paste. The latter may therefore only work with solistic material of low complexity.

.

[;-)]

Well, I did a look. Here is what they write:

By Trevor Wishart's definition, a waveset is a segment of
an audio signal between one non-positive to positive zero
crossing and the next. [ see T. Wishart : Audible Design. ]
Please note that this definition only applies to mono signals.

Logically.
And that is exactly, what i telled here all the time. And also basicly the same principle of my "WarpCycle" class pitch shifter.


Whatsoever, that "waveset" thingy on the website has obviously some drawbacks. That especially comes into the game if applied to (tried to) such complex voices like human singers...

Zero Crossing detection has always to be combined with "voiceless parts" detection and special proceeding it. Otherwise it would result in extremely strange sounding on transients and high level noise (silblings) inside the input material.

Also : very complex (overtone rich) waves may have many zero crossings inside a wave cycle. So zero crossing detection is never good for any precise pitch detection therefore. The result may be to more than 50 percent wrong (and useless) with even average input material ...

Wavesets work always good with simple waveforms (like from an oscillator for instance) BUT they don't work that good with most "real world" waveforms because of the complexity (and time variability) of those.

Applying pitch shifting and time stretching (if that principle even would work) is also not very precise and has its drawbacks too. Simply playing the single cycles faster or slower would result in that typical formant stretching and the signal would be shorter or longer then. Time stretching with preserving the pitch or pitch shifting with preserving the length would result in always inprecise final length and missing (skipped) or statically repeated cycles of the input material due to the principle itselfes.

Althought, if it even would work, very good phase stability (best ever) could be achieveble! But only with MONOPHONIC input. And purely theoretically.

Real time processing needs definately a latency of at least the largest wave cycle length to analyze in the source material then. If you consider, how large those cycles on basses for instance are, you would need quite much latency.


The complete alternate of all that is PSOLA.
It at least provides formant preserving and very high quality for complex voices like sungen stuff. But Psola uses not zero crossing for the reasons above but much higher quality pitch detection (looking for the fundamental frequency) and then slicing wavelets regarding the result with adding and overlapping it.
It has its drawbacks too, but it works already.

No need to "invent" something new (once again), which is already existent under many different names (that goes to those academic dudes, who always think they had an idea and starting writing quite good known old things with freshly created buzzwords on "white papers" in hope to get famous anywhen ... )

.

[;-)]

Althought, there is a REALTIME zero crossing detector SE module (for SynthEdit) from David Haupt available. (Can be coded very easy with a few lines of native source code).

So you should be able to try something (and see, that it is only very limited useful for that entire purpose here).

.

[soma]

Althought, there is a REALTIME zero crossing detector SE module (for SynthEdit) from David Haupt available. (Can be coded very easy with a few lines of native source code).

So you should be able to try something (and see, that it is only very limited useful for that entire purpose here).

.

Actions speak louder than words. Give it a try. You seem to think you know alot about it.

Also may I ask you nicely to not be so harsh in your responses? Either you are trolling or you need to be a little more considerate to others. If you can't say something nice, think of a nice way to say what you mean.

[;-)]

Althought, there is a REALTIME zero crossing detector SE module (for SynthEdit) from David Haupt available. (Can be coded very easy with a few lines of native source code).

So you should be able to try something (and see, that it is only very limited useful for that entire purpose here).

.

Actions speak louder than words. Give it a try. You seem to think you know alot about it.

Also may I ask you nicely to not be so harsh in your responses? Either you are trolling or you need to be a little more considerate to others. If you can't say something nice, think of a nice way to say what you mean.

Sorry, I did not claim that it works, so why should I try it then, to f**k ??? Should I make the prove that it not works or what ? Stoopid nonsense.

The person who actually claims that it works must make the prove. Right?

Especially I would like to see a polyphonic version of such opcode (as "promised" by the big thesis). But probably not necessary, because it don't even work with complex mono voices. That is what I am even able to "see" in my mind. Althought I did the practical proove for my own already too.


And yes. I can't say something nice, by the way.
Especially not if some dudes talk bullshit and desperately try to claim the rights of being "right" for not being that. Because thy actually did nothing except a vague thesis without any backend.

.

[greendoor]

Thanks tomg for the plugins. The octave effect is very cool, even though I don't know what method you used. I see now what the others are saying about this only working with monophonic stuff. But it virtually turns a guitar into a synth oscillator, which is very cool.

Shaman and winky face, I never claimed to know anything about DSP. I've dabbled with basic electronics for years, so I know how to use diodes for full or half wave rectification. There was no need for the personal insults, and I apologize for snapping back at you. You've taught me a lot, so this thread has been a good education for me.

I would still like to hear a plugin using the idea I mentioned (whatever the hell it's called). I can see now it would not work with polyphonic stuff, but as an Octaving effect I would love to hear what it sounds like.

Sometimes things that don't work exactly as expected can still be cool musical effects.

Peace out.

[shamann]

I don't recall personally insulting you.