KVR Audio

Funkybot · Post by **Funkybot** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:35 pm

Greendoor, I haven't heard of anyone having any issues with the version of PACE that they've used here. I can understand why you seem to be reluctant, but not all versions of PACE are equal and this is certainly the most mild form (just simple challenge and response). Otherwise I'm entirely with you on the PACE thing, which is the only thing worse than a dongle IMO.

A3ntar · Post by **A3ntar** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:37 pm

Oh, is Pace a software protection that is worst than a dongle one?

kritikon · Post by **kritikon** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:38 pm

The PDF said it is going to be a "challenge/response copy protection". Doesn't that exclude PACE?

That says to me that for sure, they're continuing to use PACE. Which is a real shame, as I love the room verb, and would most definitely like the plate verb, but I'm with Greendoor on this one...no kind of PACE is getting anywhere near my DAW. Another one I'll have to pass over. I'd rather shell out on the more expensive UAD dongle and use the EMT plate verb.

It's a real shame, as now we're starting to get to the stage where native reverb is becoming a seriously viable option. Maybe another year or two and I'll be able to use a native reverb I like without infecting my system.

. Until then it seems like DSP cards or convolution are the inly options for me.

Funkybot · Post by **Funkybot** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:55 pm

Krikiton, I still don't get what the rationale for this is? You know it's just a simple challenge/response system and does not install the dreaded PACE driver that's been the cause of so many issues for so many people. If that were the case, then yes, I'd be with you on that entirely. But the Princeton Digital stuff just uses a simple challenge and response scheme. Now if you don't like C/R protection entirely that's cool too, but you didn't say you have an issue with that, just the fact that this uses a copy protection with the name PACE on it. I don't know that just sounds like a wierd phobia to me. I'd really hate for them to drop this copy protection at the request of so many users, who don't get that this WON'T be infecting your system with anything or cause compatibility issues or BSODs or random shutdowns, and instead have Princeton Digital move in the direction of IK and start using a dongle. That'd be something to complain about. Not this.

Frippertronix · Post by **Frippertronix** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 10:09 pm

Why do they need PACE if it's c/r? Can't they just write their own c/r routine and set it up on their own website?

kritikon · Post by **kritikon** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 10:19 pm

You're right, I've heard from many users who say the protection is not now a problem (but there are still some who do!). It is a personal grudge for me. In the same way I don't buy anything Sony any more, I won't buy anything that uses PACE - for a long time it was a nightmare protection that buggered up many peoples' PCs and they just refused to put enough effort into getting it right for too long. So I won't support anything with the letters PACE on it. A simple consumer choice. Might be to my detriment, but I won't support a duff company.

The shame is that Princeton don't seem to be a duff company - in fact I get the impression they are the complete opposite. I like their product alot, I like the sound of their support, but for some odd reason they maintain PACE as their copy protection. PACE won't ever get my custom, and if that means I miss out on the odd excellent product, then my loss, but I will not support a company with a proven bad track record. It's the only power I have to promote knockong off of what I see as bad product (PACE) - that of not purchasing anything using it. It's my own little principled foible. And I know it is a foible. There's probably a good chance it will work OK on my DAW, but I'm not about to take that chance, and by doing so, my purchase would say, yeah it's OK you had a destructive protection system for years and years, you're forgiven...well they're not.

I missed out on some good Sony products, such as the M7 modulator - I really wanted one of those. But those bastards will never get my custom ever agian. Maybe one day PACE might, but not yet. I'll just have to live with h/w reverb, or a UAD card or carry on with convolution for now, and personally suffer for it.

But I won't be quiet about about that piece of shit that is PACE. I'd rather have another USB dongle aka Steinberg - I'm considering getting the new Korg Wavestation s/w - which means another dongle - a bit of a hassle, but I never had any trouble with dongles, so I'll put up with it if the product is worth it. I won't put up with even a working PACE system.

Paulie Phonick · Post by **Paulie Phonick** » Sun Oct 09, 2005 10:38 pm

I know what you mean, kritikon. I'd happily see developpers finally realising that copy protections only bring inconvenience to legit users (as they can, are and will be cracked anyway) and PACE itself going out of business. Still, I personally don't take it as far as you do - I wouldn't miss a product as good as the Stereo Room just because of the PACE c/r and I won't probably miss the Plate either. But I admit the PACE copy protection was one of the reasons for me to skip Superwave synths for example.

steffensen · Post by **steffensen** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:01 am

i have REALLy tried to get the Room verb working in my DAW, PACE or not. but it just aint gonna happen..a few minutes after ive tried it, my winXP starts to either get blue screens, suddenly rebooting, explorer closing down without even notifying me first (not IE, but explorer!) and my saved songs have all the volume faders fecked up!

when i use EVERYTHING else BUT the Room verb, everything is fine. so whats goin on there..heh..?
PACE or not, i dont really mind, i just want it to work. because i agree with kritikon:

"It's a real shame, as now we're starting to get to the stage where native reverb is becoming a seriously viable option. Maybe another year or two and I'll be able to use a native reverb I like without infecting my system. Until then it seems like DSP cards or convolution are the inly options for me."

Paulie Phonick · Post by **Paulie Phonick** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:51 am

steffensen wrote:i have REALLy tried to get the Room verb working in my DAW, PACE or not. but it just aint gonna happen..a few minutes after ive tried it, my winXP starts to either get blue screens, suddenly rebooting, explorer closing down without even notifying me first (not IE, but explorer!) and my saved songs have all the volume faders fecked up!

when i use EVERYTHING else BUT the Room verb, everything is fine. so whats goin on there..heh..?

Wow, that sounds like a hard case of PACE allergy

But seriously, are you 100% sure all that was caused by the Stereo Room? Maybe I'm wrong, but I fail to see how SR could actually do such things, not installing the crappy PACE driver. Especially changing your fader settings... Looks more like a virus coincidence.

steffensen · Post by **steffensen** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:00 am

Paulie Phonick wrote:
steffensen wrote:i have REALLy tried to get the Room verb working in my DAW, PACE or not. but it just aint gonna happen..a few minutes after ive tried it, my winXP starts to either get blue screens, suddenly rebooting, explorer closing down without even notifying me first (not IE, but explorer!) and my saved songs have all the volume faders fecked up!

when i use EVERYTHING else BUT the Room verb, everything is fine. so whats goin on there..heh..?
Wow, that sounds like a hard case of PACE allergy But seriously, are you 100% sure all that was caused by the Stereo Room? Maybe I'm wrong, but I fail to see how SR could actually do such things, not installing the crappy PACE driver. Especially changing your fader settings... Looks more like a virus coincidence.

i really do not have any virus, and thats a fact dear sir.

i am 100% sure its caused by SR, ive tried reinstalling windows, same thing happens. ive tried ONLY installing the SR after a reinstall of windows, same thing happens. every other plugin ive tried works fine. and the cause with the fader dettings, is known to many of us Logic users combined with SR.

Paulie Phonick · Post by **Paulie Phonick** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:09 am

Okok, won't argue. It's just beyond my limited imagination, how such a nice little plugin can cause these amounts of damage... Youth these days...

Have you tried to use Stereo Room in any other host?

steffensen · Post by **steffensen** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:41 am

ive tried it in eXT, Logic, CubaseSX, and FLS. same thing all over. it really bugs me u know, coz im deeply in love with SR.

Paulie Phonick · Post by **Paulie Phonick** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:45 am

So what does the Priceton Digital tech support (or Tony Agnello) say to this?

steffensen · Post by **steffensen** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 9:06 am

steffensen wrote:...they told me to get their updated demo, wich i did. same bug tho, and i reported that as well. without any reply tho..

kritikon · Post by **kritikon** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 9:34 pm

Damn...you just confirmed my bias. I was actually hoping to be persuaded otherwise...

Princeton Plate 2016 reverb!!!!