How do you: use multiple orchestral libraries

[Sepheritoh]

Hi folk.

This is our latest edition in our "listen and learn" series, brought to right here on KvR.

This week we will move away a little bit from the "what synth is best for _____________ (fill in your favorite genre" and explore the possibilities of using multiple sample libraries that, at first glance, all do exactly the same thing.

More specifically - orchestral libraries.

Over the years string and orchestral libraries has been the holy grail of sampling. Every keyboard, from the casiotone, to the most expensive Kork keyboards all had at least one patch for STRINGS.

Yeah, that's right. We always wanted to have something that sounds like Mozart, without having to hire 100 musicians.

The good news is - now we have it. EWQL and Vienna has done it, then Garritan made it affordable. After GPO the prices has tumbled and everybody can now afford at least one. BUT. We were not Happy people with that. One library is just not the in thing anymore. Most people has gone a bit further and bought two, three, or even more libraries. Damn we say. Why should we settle for 100 violin players if we can have 200, or 300, or one big mushy noize.

Frankly, there is a limit to what is useful in my view. Just putting another patch from another library over your string part a few times is just not as cool as it seemed at the first time.

OK, so I want to know, why you bought that 2nd or 3rd library and how do you use it. Do you use them for different songs. If so, when do you use which library. Do you use them all on the same song? Do you use the best part of each library each time? If so, which parts do you use? You get the idea, so join the talks and tell us what we should have known in the first place, but never bothered to figure out ourselves.

[ozinexile]

Well I guess the first and most obvious answer to why buy more than one is that there is no definitive sample library. One library will not have the best sounding instruments in each category (subjective) and will not suit all orchestral styles (again subjetive).

I only have a single library at the moment, but will be looking to add to it at some stage. I'll be looking at libraries that will meld together effectively. That may be using the trumpets from one and the horns from another, sections and solo instruments form different libraries. I can't imagine using different articulations for an instrument in the same passage from different libraries, I haven't tried it but I think it would sound strange.

Then there is the case of differing philosophies, i.e recorded dry verses in a hall, and in position or panned centre. This could be overcome with some work, panning , eq-ing and adding reverb, but adds to the complexity.

Most of above is just postulating, it would be good to hear from someone putting into practise.

[Sepheritoh]

Interesting.

I also wonder about using different articulations from different libraries. The listener's ear would surely pick it up. Specialist libraries is something I can understand. Using project sam for trumpets and brass would give one so much more possibilities instead of GPO. I agree with your viewpoint that it would then be best to use that special library for all of the brass parts or else it would sound strange.

Or maybe not. I am speculating. Anybody here who has that kind of experience?

[uselessmind]

I think layering libs can help using articulations from different libs too.
Sometimes it works great out of the box,sometimes insane amounts of work are required.
For me there is no general way,it all depends on the situation and what i can get away with.

I would prefer the one perfect lib tough,but most likely it will never exist anyway.

[chagzuki]

As for articulations I think that there are still improvements to be made in terms of how controls / parameters are organised. EWQLSO gold has an amazing sound, but the choice of patches is rather odd and I'm sure could be improved a hell of a lot. For instance, some string instruments have really limited up/down bowing patches, which are fundamental to achieving a realistic sound.

Anyhow, in terms of a convincing big symphonic sound, Gold/Platinum sets the standard, but doensn't fair so well on solo instruments. None of the cheaper libraries are multisampled to the degree necessary to make intimate passages really convincing. I haven't tried VSL (no way I can afford that), but apparently it excells in this area.

[chagzuki]

Kirk Hunter Emerald Orchestra has a very selective list of articulations. Most instruments have a no vibrato patch, but not all. Some of the woodwind don't. GPO has delayed vibrato on everything I think. . . so you're never going to have a great range of articulations with libraries at this price point.

[chagzuki]

The crossfading of velocity layers in Gold sometimes produces unpleasant effects. For instance, in the middle on non-vibrato and vibrato string patches. Again, this type of artifact gets buried in big compositions, but will rear it's head in intimate passages. Every library has quirks like this; patches that don't sound as good as the rest etc., so more choice is a good thing.