Truss Rod Adjustment On Guit-Fiddles/Electric-Twangers...

[ross g]

miracle of miracles, i kept a beer out of my hand long enough to actually-gasp-PUT STRINGS ON MY AXES!! (it only took two years )...now it's time to tune & tweek the babies up....

i've tried straightening the neck on my old Epiphone Sheraton and got nowhere (it got so loose i could almost pull it out! not so good...), so i'm a little scared to try it on my newer one...i have a Japanese crap-o plywood acoustic that has a truss adjust, 'twood be a good practice fiddle for the task...

who might help with some solid info/pep-talk on the subject (HINK!!! ) ? i can do the height and harmonic fine, i've read some stuff 'bout the trussy adjusty in the past, obviously it didn't make the proper impression...

and i won't hold anyone accountable for my stupid-headedness, obviously...

so...pointers anyone? (HINK!!!)


thanks,
rg

[Hink]

take it to a luthier...truss rod adjustments are tricky, they are not like tuning...you twist the machine head and hear the results. Truss rods will make a slight difference to start but it's wood (the neck) it will take time to to adjust fully. In other words it might be perfect today and way off next week...truss rod adjustments are rarely radical, usually quite subtle... make pace slowly if doing it yourself...

[ross g]

take it to a luthier...truss rod adjustments are tricky, they are not like tuning...you twist the machine head and hear the results. Truss rods will make a slight difference to start but it's wood (the neck) it will take time to to adjust fully. In other words it might be perfect today and way off next week...truss rod adjustments are rarely radical, usually quite subtle... make pace slowly if doing it yourself...

i actually got a real good dude in chicago, and i may hit him up to tweek my twin, but i thought if i could give my fiddles a little tlc, it would be cool...it's not the dough, and there are other dudes around, i just trust the one guy...he is as you describe a true luthier; as in artist/guit builder/tube electronic zen master, etc...my problem is the location pretty much, and the idea i've got to watch my kids...

now, i was under the impression you did your own neck adjustments, but that may have been an incorrect assumption...also, are you saying that to properly adjust the truss rod, it's better to do it over a few days span?

thanks,
rg

[Hink]

yes I do make my own adjustments...but it's not something I can describe online...it's very "hands on" and feel is quite important... Also there are more then on type of truss rod...warmoth has a section called truss rods explained

http://www.warmoth.com/guitar/necks/nec ... truss_rods

That might be helpful...

[ross g]

yes I do make my own adjustments...but it's not something I can describe online...it's very "hands on" and feel is quite important... Also there are more then on type of truss rod...warmoth has a section called truss rods explained

http://www.warmoth.com/guitar/necks/nec ... truss_rods

That might be helpful...

i understand where you are coming from, you can't feel tension on the neck as you turn the wrench over the net...i'm just looking for some tips and coaching/moral support/general sequence of the tasks, that sort of thing...thanks for the warmoth link

i'm gonna try regardless, if anyone's got some info to share or would help a bit, even via pm's, let me know...i can use the help...


rg

[james0tucson]

i've tried straightening the neck on my old Epiphone Sheraton and got nowhere

If your neck is "not straight" enough that you can tell by looking, you need more than a truss rod adjustment.

I had a guitar for a bunch of years that was the piece I took camping. This thing would get played by anyone and everyone, I'd go all over with it strapped to my back, it's been played close to fires, in the snow, in the desert, in the rain, you name the abuse, it's had it.

Well, after a few years of this, it suddenly became unplayable. I wrote it off, since it was only a cheap guitar to begin with, but for some reason I took it to a guitar tech along with another guitar, to see what could be done for it.

What could be done was nothing short of amazing. Without charging me much, he reset the neck, levelled and burnished the frets, replaced a machine head, carved a bridge saddle and nut himself from bone, and gave the thing a bath inside and out.

[ross g]

i've tried straightening the neck on my old Epiphone Sheraton and got nowhere

If your neck is "not straight" enough that you can tell by looking, you need more than a truss rod adjustment.

I had a guitar for a bunch of years that was the piece I took camping. This thing would get played by anyone and everyone, I'd go all over with it strapped to my back, it's been played close to fires, in the snow, in the desert, in the rain, you name the abuse, it's had it.

Well, after a few years of this, it suddenly became unplayable. I wrote it off, since it was only a cheap guitar to begin with, but for some reason I took it to a guitar tech along with another guitar, to see what could be done for it.

What could be done was nothing short of amazing. Without charging me much, he reset the neck, levelled and burnished the frets, replaced a machine head, carved a bridge saddle and nut himself from bone, and gave the thing a bath inside and out.

it's nothing that drastic...it's just that i'm hoping an adjustment will do the trick and make two playable guitars (the plywood acoustic jap crap and electric epi-limpic)sweet and fine...i like to be hands-on with stuff, but i've never seen or learned anything besides a bit of info in a guitar handbook about the procedure...the example i gave on my former epi was awhile back, and rather extreme...

maybe i'm asking a lot, but it's your fault, KVR...you built my computer for me, every problem i had got fixed my asking youse...i guess i'm spoiled...i think if any of y'all know how to adjust the truss rod and would be willing to pm back and forth a bit, i'd be ever so obliged...it's a lot to ask i know, but isn't this what the internet is supposed to be about?

(c'mon Hink, if you help, me i'll teach you the chords to "Blitzkrieg Bop")

forever your dork,
rg

[Hink]

yes I do make my own adjustments...but it's not something I can describe online...it's very "hands on" and feel is quite important... Also there are more then on type of truss rod...warmoth has a section called truss rods explained

http://www.warmoth.com/guitar/necks/nec ... truss_rods

That might be helpful...

i understand where you are coming from, you can't feel tension on the neck as you turn the wrench over the net...i'm just looking for some tips and coaching/moral support/general sequence of the tasks, that sort of thing...thanks for the warmoth link

i'm gonna try regardless, if anyone's got some info to share or would help a bit, even via pm's, let me know...i can use the help...


rg

go to your local music store...ask them if they have a piece of crap that wont sell because it's busted (they all have something)...give them a sawbuck for it and expiriment on it..or just pick up a Hondo or some other useless guitar that wont matter if you trash it...

I'm reminded of a cocky friend named ben, very good luthier but a bit arrogant...okay a lot...he decided he was gonna start his own business, so he went and solicitated local stores...one such store took this guitar out (acoustic) that had the neck ripped right off doing seemingly unrepairable damage to the guitars top. The jerks were messing with him, surely nobody could fix this mess. They said if you can make this sellable we will talk...he did they didn't. I was amazed he fixed it and it was awesome...when Mars lost their luthier at our store I said "I got someone for you"

He told me he learned by just what I said

So dont adjust the neck on your instrument now, get a dummy one, one you don't mind destroying, learn from that, use that to make your mistakes on...

[Hink]

btw yes after an adjustment give it a least 24 hours to set, and make fine adjustments....if you see on the link I posted that most truss rods are 10-32 threads..(here's the machinist in me) the 10 is not important here, but the 32 stands for 32 threads per inch which is pretty fine...that says a lot...fine tuning...take your time, try everything first on something else and I'll answer all I can without actually being there ...tbh I would love to take a trip...but I can't

[AndrewSimon]

I don't dare doing these things.
You know you can crack the neck if you go to far?
I have seen it first hand.

[Hink]

I don't dare doing these things.
You know you can crack the neck if you go to far?
I have seen it first hand.

good point, but mechanics go too far, craftsmen take their time...

[ross g]

btw yes after an adjustment give it a least 24 hours to set, and make fine adjustments....if you see on the link I posted that most truss rods are 10-32 threads..(here's the machinist in me) the 10 is not important here, but the 32 stands for 32 threads per inch which is pretty fine...that says a lot...fine tuning...take your time, try everything first on something else and I'll answer all I can without actually being there ...tbh I would love to take a trip...but I can't

buddy, you don't want to come here unless you'ld like to buy crack in the peaceful setting of "country living near the city"

actually, the crap-o fiddle is my tester...i'd like to get a real acoustic at some point, this thing ain't recording quality....

here's a simple q: with the truss rod adjustment on the head end, which way do you turn it to bend the neck less bow-like? ie straighter.. it's been a long time, i'm guessing counter-clockwise...


rg

[rogerperrin]

here's a simple q: with the truss rod adjustment on the head end, which way do you turn it to bend the neck less bow-like? ie straighter.. it's been a long time, i'm guessing counter-clockwise...

HONK! Wrong! Go clockwise to tighten the truss rod which will bend the neck backward and make the strings lower to the fretboard. I've adjusted over a dozen and they have always been clockwise to tighten and lower the strings. I would always tighten about 1/8 to 1/4 of a turn and then sort of rap softly on the back of the neck with the back of my fingers, up and down the length to make sure the rod wasn't binding inside. Let it sit for a few minutes and look at it and then do it again.

I learned it trial and error over a span of say 15 years and got pretty good at eyesighting the neck into place. Sometimes on older guitars you may have a slight twist which causes the strings to be too high on the treble or the bass side of the neck. You just get it as close as you can without letting the strings buzz.

Don't be intimidated, but do be careful, and do start on a junker if you have one handy - just any old junker - and you'll get a better feel for what you are doing. If you want to do it the pro way, get a book by (Dan?) Erlewine on guitar repair. He'll talk you through some of the finer points like how to use 12", 18", AND 24" carpenters' squares to lay on the neck, the strings, and the entire length from nut to bridge to get a very accurate picture of all of the adjustments to be made:, neck, nut height, bridge height; string height at the nut, 1st fret, and the 12th fret. It's worth the dollars, whatever it costs now, and your friends will be amazed at your expertise and how nice your guitars play.

[ross g]

thanks Mr. Perrin, that gives me a good starting point, just the info i was looking for...i'll check out the book as well, always coming across guits that need a bit of work...

i'll report the results....

"how tight should i make this?" ..."keep turning it just untill it breaks, it's one less than that"

EDIT- i needed a metric allen set (duh), gave it a good 1/8 - 1/4 turn, it helped quite a bit, especially for these soft fingers of mine....but caps come back quick, i'll give it another soft turn tomorrow, then i'll hit the epi...

i'm back in business baby! (i've been learning "muddy water" from memory, fun to play and sing that one, reminds me of new orleans/katrina...)

thanks again,
rg

[Hink]

"how tight should i make this?" ..."keep turning it just untill it breaks, it's one less than that"

no...like I said it's a fine thread for a reason...for precision..slowly my friend, very slowly...like Roger says (btw one of my best friends last name is Perrin) you'll get a feel for it, but that's the key....the feel...

There are a few golden rules to obey when adjusting a truss rod. First, only use the rod to keep your neck as straight as it needs to be…do not use it to adjust your action! Second, only use the proper adjustment tool. If you do not know what it is, check with the manufacturer or visit a good repairman. Finally, do not force anything; an eighth of a turn can make a drastic change. The first step is to know when or in what way the neck needs to be adjusted. Start by sitting with the guitar in the playing position. Make sure it is in tune, and capo at the first fret. If you do not own a capo, you can simply fret the strings, but this may make things a little more difficult. Next, fret the bass string at the 14th fret. You are using the string as a straight edge to read the curve (referred to as relief) of the neck. Check the height of the string over the 6th fret. Gently taping the string to the fret makes the size of this gap clearer.

just found that here

http://www.athensmusician.net/archive/2 ... mbody1.php

I just googled...that was the first one here's the complete results

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=n ... djustments