After FL6, what?

[Hink]

lol JMC, thanks for your contribution. I was just asking which features you and Gol had planned for FL, I didn't ask for any dates or anything. Just wanted to know what you guys were thinking.

So, a DJ application for FL, what else?

you are aware of course there is no way they would tell you, I mean it's not that they wish to pull one over on the customers...but you never show your cards until you play them...it's a trade, it's competition...loose lips sink ships and all...some may disagree but jmc and gol are far to professional to make such an err...

[soulkraka]

However, I do believe that it is good business practice to never be rude to paying customers - no matter how unreasonable they are. I suspect, however, you are now sO$$$$$$ rich that you don't really care anymore ??

mmh, being nice with customers for money.. sounds like prostitution

yes it does...but, look at the bright side, you get to be the pimp.

[headquest]

mmh, being nice with customers for money.. sounds like prostitution

A world where prostitutes were the only people who were polite to their customers... would be a sad, dark, cynical, unpleasant place . Let's hope you don't really see the world that way Tony .

[arke]

However, I do believe that it is good business practice to never be rude to paying customers - no matter how unreasonable they are. I suspect, however, you are now sO$$$$$$ rich that you don't really care anymore ??

mmh, being nice with customers for money.. sounds like prostitution

LOL!

Waiting for the FL Studio Whore Edition, which includes the brand-new "Insert" Effect called "Rooster". Upon using this, you will hear a bouncing bed and two people that will agree with each other alot.

(if above is too offensive, lemme know and I'll edit it away)

[rbet]

you are aware of course there is no way they would tell you, I mean it's not that they wish to pull one over on the customers...but you never show your cards until you play them...it's a trade, it's competition...loose lips sink ships and all...some may disagree but jmc and gol are far to professional to make such an err...

Dude, that's lame. We're just talking about possible features here, no one is making any commitments... how is just talking about possible new features a strategic error?

[headquest]

you are aware of course there is no way they would tell you, I mean it's not that they wish to pull one over on the customers...but you never show your cards until you play them...it's a trade, it's competition...loose lips sink ships and all...some may disagree but jmc and gol are far to professional to make such an err...

Dude, that's lame. We're just talking about possible features here, no one is making any commitments... how is just talking about possible new features a strategic error?

No, Hink is right. None of the major developers reveal such plans in advance

(the only people who do are small one-man developers with an underground following).

[ianweb123]

..are small one-man developers with an underground following).

Mole-ware

[Stupid American Pig]

you are aware of course there is no way they would tell you, I mean it's not that they wish to pull one over on the customers...but you never show your cards until you play them...it's a trade, it's competition...loose lips sink ships and all...some may disagree but jmc and gol are far to professional to make such an err...

Dude, that's lame. We're just talking about possible features here, no one is making any commitments... how is just talking about possible new features a strategic error?

What if JMC and gol have a great idea, that is either difficult or time consuming for their small staff to implement. say JMC mentions, "I think we are adding the super duper looper wizard 3000 that uses biofeedback to create music" and then another larger dev reads that and gets the idea to make the same feature. if they beat IL to the punch, then potential customers that would buy a product only for that feature now have 2(or more) choices. while that is good for the customer, its bad for the developer...

[rbet]

What if JMC and gol have a great idea, that is either difficult or time consuming for their small staff to implement. say JMC mentions, "I think we are adding the super duper looper wizard 3000 that uses biofeedback to create music" and then another larger dev reads that and gets the idea to make the same feature. if they beat IL to the punch, then potential customers that would buy a product only for that feature now have 2(or more) choices. while that is good for the customer, its bad for the developer...

You make a good point there. Oh well.

[SongMonkey]

Plugin Delay Compensation. Another great reason for starting over.

There are a lot of great ideas, truly great ideas, in FLStudio, but stumbling blocks like this, not to mention their intransigence on this subject (and others), will always keep it on the second tier of audio apps. Such a pity, too! So many things to love about this program, the coding not least. Yes, I'm fully familiar with the workarounds, and if they were accurate for different plugs, and moreover if the tracks printed properly, then it just might've been worth it...but alas, this is not the case.

This makes it unworkable for me, and for anyone else who wants to use convolution...or DSP cards like the UAD-1...or Hydratone...or any of half a dozen great plugins that introduce varying amounts of latency. This is...dated.

IL will get along fine without a rewrite, they have legions of adoring fans, for good reasons, and I support them as well. Some truly innovative, fantastic ideas. But a crippling flaw or two as well. This is just me adding my voice to the "Start Over" chorus.

Cheers all.

[Baniev]

For Express Edition: knobs should go up to 5
For Fruityloops Edition: knobs should go up to 8
For Producer Edition: knobs should go up to 10
For the XXL Edition: knobs should go up to 11
For the OMG-XXL-MEGATARNCE-VIRUZBUNDLE Edition: knobs should go up to 11 AND GUI should also include one red flashing LED for midi activity!!



Just suggestions; after all, you're the developer

[Jason Brian Merrill]

Plugin Delay Compensation. Another great reason for starting over.

There are a lot of great ideas, truly great ideas, in FLStudio, but stumbling blocks like this, not to mention their intransigence on this subject (and others), will always keep it on the second tier of audio apps. Such a pity, too! So many things to love about this program, the coding not least. Yes, I'm fully familiar with the workarounds, and if they were accurate for different plugs, and moreover if the tracks printed properly, then it just might've been worth it...but alas, this is not the case.

This makes it unworkable for me, and for anyone else who wants to use convolution...or DSP cards like the UAD-1...or Hydratone...or any of half a dozen great plugins that introduce varying amounts of latency. This is...dated.

IL will get along fine without a rewrite, they have legions of adoring fans, for good reasons, and I support them as well. Some truly innovative, fantastic ideas. But a crippling flaw or two as well. This is just me adding my voice to the "Start Over" chorus.

Cheers all.

Plugin Delay Compensation - PDC
PDC is required when FX plugins introduce unwanted delays between their input and output sound OR plugin instruments are slow to respond to note input (none of the FL Studio plugins require PDC, all operate in real-time).

Delay Pre/Post - Left-click this switch to change between pre delay (used for generators) and post delay (used for effects). The Pre setting delays the audio prior to entering a mixer track, Post delays the audio leaving a mixer track.
Delay entry menu (showing 'none' in the example at C, above) - This is the delay control menu, there are several units in which delays may be entered, left-click to select from:
Reset - Resets the PDC to 'none', the default 'no delay' condition.
Set in ms (milliseconds) - Set the PDC in ms, a value entry box will appear after selecting this setting.
Set in samples - Set the PDC in samples, a value entry box will appear after selecting this setting.
Set in beats - Set the PDC in beats, a value entry box will appear after selecting this setting.
Set from - This will list mixer tracks that have latency caused by plugins. Select a track to automatically adapt the current PDC value to the selected track without the need to manually enter values.
The Delay Panel (C), available on all mixer tracks, allows you to configure the mixer to use plugins that can't process audio in real-time, including compressors with 'look ahead' functions and 'Convolution Reverbs'. Without PDC, affected plugins will sound out of time with the main audio. The PDC control settings allow you to compensate for the unwanted delay so that the non-affected mixer tracks are synchronized with the delayed track. The setup is completed manually, a tutorial is provided in the next section.

Note: When using PDC, FL Studio will no longer respond 'instantly' as the audio output is delayed to sync with the slow plugin.

Guide to using PDC - Effects
If a mixer track contains a plugin that introduces a unwanted delay (delay-affected) then the audio from this track will be out of sync with the other mixer tracks. The PDC technique used in FL Studio is to delay all normal tracks by the same amount as the delay-affected track, bringing the two audio streams back in sync. To facilitate PDC, a highly accurate compensating delay is available through the mixer track Delay Panel (C).

PDC overview - place the delay affected plugin on a mixer track and route any instruments through it that require the effect. Next, set up a mixer channel with the exact same delay (using the Delay Panel, C) and route all other mixer tracks exclusively through this track. That is, disable their individual sends to the Master.



Step-by-step instructions to using PDC -

Load the delay-affected (slow) plugin - Insert delay-affected plugin into any FX slot of any Insert mixer track or Send track. Link the channels you would like to effect with the plugin to this mixer track.
Determine the delay compensation - If you are not using the 'Set from' option you will need to manually record the plugin delay compensation (PDC). This is shown in the hint bar when you hover over a plugin FX slot that contains a plugin causing (and reporting) a delay, as shown below. Take note of this value and the units (usually samples).




Compensating track - Use the 'Set from' PDC 'Delay entry' menu item OR enter the PDC delay value obtained above in the 'Delay entry menu' (C) on a second mixer track that DOES NOT contain the delay affected plugin. It makes sense to re-name this track 'PDC' and change the colour to something bright so you can easily locate it later.
Route all normal tracks to the compensating track, disabling their individual Master sends - All audio (other than that running through the track containing the plugin causing a delay) must be routed through the compensating track. You must DISABLE THE MASTER SEND of each mixer track routed to the compensating track so that the only path for audio from these tracks to the Master is through the compensating track.
Testing - The two audio streams should now be in sync. However, the PDC setting in the hint window is reported by the plugin, so if this is not available you may need to tune the delay setting by ear, if so compare the PDC and non PDC paths using a percussive sound such as a 'hat' sample. Set the step-sequencer to pattern mode and trigger the delay-affected and a normal generators with equivalent steps. Make sure there are no FX on the compensating channel while you test.
Note: If you intend to use a delay-affected plugin on the Master mixer track (and you are not using ASIO outputs), then you do not need to compensate as all audio passes through the Master track and therefore the delay-affected plugin.

Guide to using PDC - Generators
Some instruments/generators also introduce a delay. It is possible to use the Pre delay setting on the Delay Panel (C) to re-sync delayed and normal instrument audio, before either enter the mixer. Pre delaying simplifies the internal routing and set-up requirements. The principle here is to add a pre-delay to each mixer track receiving normal generators while the track receiving a delayed generator is not adjusted.

Step-by-step instructions to using instrument/generator PDC -

Link the delay-affected (slow) plugin to the mixer - Select a mixer track and route the delay-affected generator to this track. This will be the only track that does not receive a delay compensation.
Link normal instruments/generators - All normal generators/instruments may be linked to any other mixer track/s as usual. All tracks used by unaffected instruments/generators must receive a Pre-delay compensation set in the Delay Panel (C).
Determine the delay compensation - The delay caused by the affected instrument/generator will either be noted in the documentation that comes with the plugin OR if this is not available you will need to tune the delay setting by ear. If so compare a normal and delay-affected plugin using a percussive sound with a sharp attack and quick release. Make sure there are no FX on the mixer tracks you are testing. Set the step-sequencer to pattern mode and trigger the delay-affected and a normal generators with equivalent steps.
Delay setting - Select Pre delay and enter the PDC delay value obtained above into the 'Delay entry menu' (C) of each track receiving a normal generator.

[diverdee]

Nice, but a button that turned automatic PDC on or off would be even nicer wot?

[SongMonkey]

Jason, thanks for that! Strange that a search on "latency" doesn't bring this feature up in the Help application.

I'll give it a go.

Cheers!

[The Chase]

(none of the FL Studio plugins require PDC, all operate in real-time)

they wish. Mess with the wet/dry knob on the compressor. It definately causes a bit of delay..