Berkleemusic.com

[dirtnap]

Music Production and Technology Course

http://www.berkleemusic.com/school/cert ... id=3948642

So what do you guys think? I've made a bit of money at dance music, but not anywhere near enough to make a living off of... just enough to pay for my small collection of hardware and software... and it was a long long road too. I think I may actually still be in the hole overall...

Maybe if I put some intensive studying into music, I might be able to improve my abilities enough to make it a career(get work in a studio etc...)? Or maybe at least make better music, and get a few more records pressed/less rejection emails & letters?

Been going to school for awhile and havnt studied anything I'm really all that interested in... so maybe this is a good fit as I can't really move to another city to go to a real audio school. Havn't been able to find anything comparable online. Interning at a studio really isnt an option either, as Im currently living out in f**k knows where. Devoid of electronic music.

[pitchdrifter]

Don't know that course, but berklee in general I can recommend highly. I'd also recommend a music business course or 3, else you'll end up produce good music - but still won't be able to make a living from it because you don't really know how to make money from it.

[angryman]

i've done three courses, two of which are sorta similar. A cert 2 and advanced diploma in audio engineering with SAE and a commercial contemporary course with the university of Darwin and all i can tell you is that ive learnt more from my own outside of school experiences. Not to put you off i actually don't know anything about Berkley as it isn't offered in australia as far as i know but, try this first. Mixing with your mind( Great publication, a little dubious in areas but excellent overall) , traxmusic.org http://www.traxmusic.org/TraXmusic.shtml
Bob Katz book on mastering. Golden Ears training by somefella ....do a google. and also you need undying passion for what you do. I don't know about the rest of you but i can't switch off audio in my thinking process, its worse than smack all day all night going to sleep is the hardest thing to do. Think about it seriously before you dive in . The deep ends a long way down. Best of luck

[dirtnap]

well, the price does seem a bit high. Probably would've jumped on it already if it were about 3,000 cheaper! I will ponder it some more while munching on my thanksgiving dinner!

[pitchdrifter]

Let's just say you can't exactly compare SAE and berklee. I've done both, btw. And I share angryman's view on SAE to a certain degree. It's the total opposite with berklee, though.

[Sepheritoh]

I do not think you can compare a three year full time course with dedicated instructors to reading a book - no matter how good that book may be.

Yes true you might learn as much by self study, but you will have to work so much harder.

They have some good reputation. I have not done any full time courses with these guys, but all the books I have purchased from them were worth the money. Off course the price is much different and there is no way that reading all my books will replace hands-on technical training. If you have the 3 years available and if you have the money I'd say go for it. The price is not bad for that period compared to what I had to pay for my studies (not music related).

[darcyb62]

IMHO... and although I can't comment specifically to the music industry I think getting a solid credential from a well respected an recognized school goes further than pure practucal experience gets you. Ideally you want both but when I hire (I'm in the IT industry) I look at the education 1st, practical experience 2nd, then other training such as Microsoft or Cisco certifications. I think the investment would be well worth it but don't expect it to be a guarantee. There will still be a lot of hard work after, but I would expect the commitement to education should open a few more doors for you. But you still need to take advantage of those open doors.

[pitchdrifter]

That won't get you much in the music world, only the knowledge, skill and ability to put them to use, and the ability to reach your target audience/clients count here, unless it's a desk job you're after at some label. When you're on the creative/production side, only your results count.

[PaulG]

This is a good topic, as it deals with a more foundational level of what "success" really is - AND THE MOST IMPORTANT THING - WHICH IS YOUR ABILITY TO "REPEAT" IT.

There are three components that make up every song/album/whatever that you hear - 1) The writing, 2) The performance, and 3) The production.

This is it - there's nothing else. Every "diamond" selling album has a top-notch "all-three".

The thing that Berklee and the other schools DON'T want you to know, however, is that they don't have special "theirs-only" information, techniques, teaching methods, etc.

This is wonderfully equated to learning a language - in fact, music "has" many times been called the "universal" language so the this is more than simply metaphorical.

Any language that you learn has - vocabulary, grammar, and spelling rules. The key thing to remember is that this "learning" of a language does "NOT" occur in one, single, "simple" herculean, gargantuan, elephantian, well, um, "chunk". The truth is that each time you learn one simple word that word is now part of "what you can do" in that language.

How this applies to the original question(s) is that yes, Berklee will give you the "gramaf, vocabulary, and spelling" rules that make up whatever PART of the WHOLE of "music-writing, performing, production" but the information that they give is probably available in a way that's more convenient to both you and your wallet.

Using the language example, if I wanted to learn Japanese - I could take an expensive $1200 class at Oxford, Yale, Harvard, etc, buy a few pieces of multimedia for a few hundred, or get it free over the internet, and I'd still learn that "Moshi, Moshi" is the standard way to answer a phone in Japan.

This does NOT preclude, or imply, however, that actually GOING to Japan would be of less value to the language learning skills than sitting in front of a DVD on the subject.

However, for someone just learning the expense-to-benefit ratio is way out of line with what is effective.

This is the primary thought that I'd, at least, like to leave you with. Evaluate your own skills in those three areas and do what you can from ALL OF THE VARIOUS RESOURCES that you can find - AND NOT JUST ONE - VERY VERY IMPORTANT!! When I was learning guitar back in the late 80's I used everything that was in my budget and availability - several teachers (one at a time, though), jammed with friends, read books (a tthe library), tried to - and did - figure out all the songs that I attempted to by ear...and this made me be the guitar player in school that everyone wanted to be like.

Don't give up on yourself - I have tremendous faith in you that because you've already seen some modicum (as you say) of success ALREADY without the skills that Berklee, etc promise, that once you "add the pieces of the various vocabulary" one-by-friggin-one as slow or quickly as you are able...that you'll be able to pretty much conquer the world AND IT WILL BE EASY...

....BECAUSE LIKE A VISUAL ARTIST WITH GREAT SKILLS...

EVERYTHING THAT THEY PAINT TURNES OUT GOOD AND THIS IS "NORMAL"...

SO IS MUSIC NO DIFFERENT.

And when I get to the point of knowing enough Japanese where I can speak it fluent enough to ask a pretty Japanese girl if she wants to spend the night with a rock star...then I'll go to Japan...

Until then...I'll keep learning Japanese and whatever through whatever is both convenient, available, and easiest in it's "cost-to-helpfulness" ratio to my wallet.

And I'm not at all concerned at how long this will take because...

...there will ALWAYS be pretty Japanese girls.

And in YOUR case there will ALWAYS be people wanting to buy good music to stink on their iPods...and not only people in Japan...and not only pretty girls, either.

This was hopefully successful at both getting a smile and conveying a mindset over a specific recipe/formula.

The right mindset will bring you success in whatever you have in front of you and not just a once-in-a-while thing under the "special recipe" or "circumstances" that you happen to know but can't transfer to the situation in front of you for a profitable result.

[dirtnap]

Thanks for all the comments.

One thing about the course... it says its 3 years long, but its only 36 credits, 12 classes. They use a 12 week per quarter system. So... that's 1 class, 3 credits per quarter? Not exactly a 3 yr full time education! 36 credits is only 3 quarters full time.

I would not want to spend 3 years only taking 1 class a quarter. At least 3 minimum, preferably 4. That puts it into a different perspective. It's really a full time 1 yr program!

$13.5k, gotta think about this one. 1 yr is ok with me... just whether its worth that much money. Will I get a good return on the investment? I would also likely finance the amount with a loan too, so the cost is actually much greater. Hmm... :/

[splattabreakz]

wouldn't bother meself. why not spend that money on taking a year off to somewhere nice and inspiring with your tools of trade?

has to be said tho that going for it from a money makin perspective you're bound to fail miserably anyway.

[dirtnap]

wouldn't bother meself. why not spend that money on taking a year off to somewhere nice and inspiring with your tools of trade?

Hard convincing a bank to give someone a loan so they can run off for a year and screw around with synthesizers, ain't it? Although maybe if you said you were going to do it through a school it'd work!

has to be said tho that going for it from a money makin perspective you're bound to fail miserably anyway.

The music industry is a business. And it has to be said that there are a number of people who earn their living from it and live rather comfortably. I've been approaching this from purely a part time produce a few 12" a year perspective. Folk I'm talking that I know do that plus other things like run a label, dj, audio engineer work, etc... Heck, one guy I know runs a record/clothing store, dj's, and produces, with his wife in shotgun seat throughout! Unless you're dropping billboard records, its hard making a living off of production alone. Lord knows $300-$500 a 12" every few months isn't going to pay your bills!

Anyway, some of us here are too wrapped up in the production aspect of things... constantly buying new equipment, arguing about what synth/audio card/software is the best etc... to realize that the other side of this industry revolves around cash. It simply does, whether the people involved are profitable or not. Berklee wouldn't even be offering these courses if this were not true. Educational institute or not, they are a money making business.

I mentioned that the end all of it was to "improve my abilities" and "make better music" which as a by product would allow me to better maximize my ability to turn this into a career, one way or the other. I don't doubt I'll become a better producer because of it. However it'll be rough explaining to my girlfriend why I can't afford taco bell, but hey... that's life.

[splattabreakz]

blah

[Mr. Tunes]

Berklee's a really good school but you'll have to evaluate how much it will cost you to live in Boston for three years, and how much can possibly make while being there as a student. Are you an American? Have you looked into their scholarship programs?

You said that interning is out of the question but can't you at least look into those options and see if a studio in NYC or LA might want to take you on? Three Years in audio engineering school is a long time. I found one year to be long enough as it was, but that's just me.

[dirtnap]

Hi Mr Tunes,

Actually, we're talking about Berklee's ONLINE classes. They've only been offering them for a couple years I believe. Same negative points against it would be that you can't use the classes as credits towards a real Berklee degree, which brings the question of whether the quality of education is comparable.

Also, although they advertise the online program as being 3 years long, its actually compsed of twelve 3 credit claseses... which is more like 3 quarters full time. It's only 3 years long if you take 1 class at a time!

I would love to move to LA(for the opportunities only though!), but I'm stuck out in the sticks at the moment. But you can bet if I were out there, I'd be hunting for an intern position right now.