KVR Audio

Ray Sigmond · Post by **Ray Sigmond** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:04 am

Some time later this month, UA will discontinue support for the DX plug-in platform concurrent with the release of UAD-1 V. 4.1. Most DX applications, like Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Vegas, are already compatible with VST plug-ins, and as a result the industry as a whole is moving away from DX as a plug-in standard. Those of you who use UAD-1 powered plug-ins in Cakewalk or Sony applications have already seen the dual list of VST and DX plug-ins.

“VST plug-in support is simply more compatible, widespread and comprehensive, so UA is focusing its efforts on better VST implementation and testing, instead of splitting its resources in order to prop up DX.”

http://www.uaudio.com/webzine/2005/december/index5.html

jasonsantiago · Post by **jasonsantiago** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 6:42 pm

i think many plugin companies will be doing this... i don't see the point in having both DX and VST now that Sonar 5 has native VST implementation.

fizbin · Post by **fizbin** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:06 pm

Except for compatibility with old mixes which use the DX versions. Some people will feel the pain, but perhaps necessarily so for the good of all.

fizbin

_oswald · Post by **_oswald** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:25 pm

Perhaps this is a step towards getting Space Echo in my grubby little Swedish hands.

dain · Post by **dain** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 7:45 am

I think this is a fine idea, but why can't they do this and still figure out a way to keep the dx plugs running without having to update them. for example, use the dx versions in version 4.0 as a seperate patch that is unaffected by the new versions. also vegas users cannot use vst normally because vegas 6.0 has an issue rendering uad-1 plugs, so most vegas users who are using uad-1 plugs use an older version of vegas which does not support vst plugs. One other problem with vegas 6 is you can't run mixes that were made for previous versions of vegas, so it causes alot of problems if you want to work on or listen to old mixes. I realize this doesn't affect a large portion of uad-1 users, but it would be nice if they gave people a working compromise instead of cutting them off from their new plugs.

Collusion · Post by **Collusion** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 9:02 am

dain wrote:why can't they do this and still figure out a way to keep the dx plugs running without having to update them.

Simple - the time wasted on coding and support for a near-dead architecture would be better spent on their VST versions.

Which is pretty much what the man said. The people you should be complaining about are Vegas' developers.

dirtnap · Post by **dirtnap** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 9:37 am

thank god. I friggin hate DX.

Now somebody tell Waves to friggn code native VST plugs instead of their dx garbage and crappy vst shell.

soulata · Post by **soulata** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 10:42 am

dirtnap wrote:thank god. I friggin hate DX.

Now somebody tell Waves to friggn code native VST plugs instead of their dx garbage and crappy vst shell.

and price them accordingly (voxengo pricerange)

dain · Post by **dain** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 7:14 pm

"Simple - the time wasted on coding and support for a near-dead architecture would be better spent on their VST versions. "

Like I said I'm fine with UA not continuing with DX. I agree that it would be better spent on their future VST versions. However, when I download version 4.1 my current DX versions are gone, and so is years of work. Like I said before, don't spend time updating DX, but let me keep what has already been coded. Every mix that I have done since 2003 will be unusable. So this is crystal clear, I agree with UA's decision not to update or make any new DX plugs, but I feel that because of the issues written in my last post that when I go to download the new vst versions in 4.1. I should be able to download the dx versions of 4.0 (which does support dx) as well.

I'm going to write UA and explain my problem and I encourage anyone else who is in a similiar position to do the same. The age of the dx format is coming to an end and I'm not fighting that, but I hope that developers understand that a gradual tappering off instead of a sudden end will help evryone in the long run.

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 7:20 pm

I don't see how they are going to do this - I don't know about Vegas etc but Cakewalk does not have "native" VST support - it just has the wrapper built into it now but it still converts the VST's into DX effects and instruments.

Funkybot · Post by **Funkybot** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 7:57 pm

aMUSEd wrote:I don't see how they are going to do this - I don't know abot Vegas etc but Cakewalk does not have "native" VST support - it just has the wrapper built into it now but it still converts the VST's into DX effects and instruments.

Well maybe this will get CW to really go native for the next version of Sonar. It's something they should have done a long time ago. The inability of their host to properly handle Mono plug-ins, not record midi output from plug-ins, etc., has really been an unnecessary hinderance for it's users (myself included). Sonar 5 promised native, and didn't deliver, hopefully version 6 finally will.

ew · Post by ew » Sun Dec 11, 2005 9:09 pm

Funkybot wrote:
aMUSEd wrote:I don't see how they are going to do this - I don't know abot Vegas etc but Cakewalk does not have "native" VST support - it just has the wrapper built into it now but it still converts the VST's into DX effects and instruments.
Well maybe this will get CW to really go native for the next version of Sonar. It's something they should have done a long time ago. The inability of their host to properly handle Mono plug-ins, not record midi output from plug-ins, etc., has really been an unnecessary hinderance for it's users (myself included). Sonar 5 promised native, and didn't deliver, hopefully version 6 finally will.

?
You've been able to record MIDI output from plugins since v2... I do it all the time with Reaktor and its sequencers.

ew

Funkybot · Post by **Funkybot** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 9:27 pm

ew, I'm pretty sure you're mistaken. At least in Sonar. Right now the only way to do this in Sonar would be with a loopback device and with DirectXer. Unless I've seriously missed something, and if so, feel free to let me know how (I'm Sonar 4.04 BTW).

dirtnap · Post by **dirtnap** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 2:03 am

Man... just when I thought Cakewalk finally got their shit together... they were always like 10 steps behind Digidesign, Steinberg and Emagic(now apple)... but they're using a wrapper? Ugh. Man... I have to use Sonar in a class next month... I was actually looking forward to learning another app... but now I wish they'd just teach with SX instead.

chaunceyc · Post by **chaunceyc** » Fri Dec 23, 2005 4:02 pm

I can see dropping future support for DirectX, but this is an absolute nightmare. I have literally hundreds of projects that have UAD-1 DX effects built-in to via the default templates and complex aux routings I created to make my life easier. Now they're saying I need to go about Uninstalling 4.1 and reinstalling UAD-1 v.0 software every time I want to open up and work with these. Per Universal Audio: "Segueing back and forth should be no problem." Say what????? Give me a break! Nothing like adding 10 steps to the process of opening, shutting down and re-opening my DAW just to listen to a project. I HIGHLY recommend that they rethink this. Remove future support, as in "you can not add DX plugins using 4.1", but make it backward compatible with existing projects or they are going to have extremely pissed off customers like myself who will not stand for this.

Their suggested workaround of creating presets in DX, porting them across to VST is insane. Think about it...if you've tweaked the settings for every DX plugin for project, you expect those settings to be saved WITH THE PROJECT, and thus don't want or need to make a preset that will be used ONE TIME. Going back into these hundreds of projects, saving presets (unloading and reloading UAD-1 v4.0 and v4.1 between versions so I can access the DX settings) going BACK into these projects recreating all the plugins, reassigning the presets, saving out of them (messing up the project's "modified date" info, by the way). NO. FREAKING. WAY.

This is a ticking time bomb for all plugins. 5 years from now, are you still going to be able to open your DAW's projects? Of the thousands of plugins out there, how many will still be in business and able to be opened up when support for ___ is dropped?

UAD-1 ver 4.1 to discontinue support for DX