BBE Sonic Maximizer: Still the best exciter?

[chagzuki]

Well, I've said this before and it never got a response, but I guess I'll say it again. When I was testing out the plugin a couple of years ago I was interested in it's potential as part of the mastering chain, as recommended by {cough} CM. The thing about the plugin is that it boosts bass and treble, and if you're mastering you're going to have to accomodate for this. If your material is already spectrally balanced this is an undesirable effect and will have to be compensated with an EQ. If you compare the dry signal to the wet (BBE + EQ) you'll find that there's no significant difference, or 'improvement'. If however, you want a plugin that will boost bass and treble (!?) then BBE does this.

[ew]

I just question people who use them all the time, especially for finalizing their mixes, specifically, I question their overall mixing ability, and would encourage them to spend a few (many) more hours with their eq's.

And I'd question their mixing and sound design ability if they spent as much time with their EQs as you recommend... but each to his own
I very rarely use EQs when I'm recording or mixing, and I NEVER use them when mastering.

A BBE's the first step in my mastering chain. Not much at all- just a very gentle tweak.

ew

[bmanic]

Sure. Then how come they're so popular in professional studios?

I've yet to see any kind of exciter in a mastering studio and I've only seen one in a recording/mixing studio once.

Personally I'm very allergic to exciters. They can come in handy if you have a truly horrible recording or need to do something over the top in a creative way. However, I would never ever never never never ever use one on a full mix.. ever. Never!

If you must use one I would recommend Spectralive as well. I think the BBE plugin adds only problems, nothing else (this goes for the consumer hardware versions too.. not to mention the horrible aphex units).

Cheers!
bManic

[bmanic]

I very rarely use EQs when I'm recording or mixing, and I NEVER use them when mastering.

A BBE's the first step in my mastering chain. Not much at all- just a very gentle tweak.

ew

You need .

.. but hey, if this works for you then good for you!

- bManic

[bduffy]

Sure. Then how come they're so popular in professional studios?

I've yet to see any kind of exciter in a mastering studio and I've only seen one in a recording/mixing studio once.

Personally I'm very allergic to exciters. They can come in handy if you have a truly horrible recording or need to do something over the top in a creative way. However, I would never ever never never never ever use one on a full mix.. ever. Never!

If you must use one I would recommend Spectralive as well. I think the BBE plugin adds only problems, nothing else (this goes for the consumer hardware versions too.. not to mention the horrible aphex units).

Cheers!
bManic

Hmmm. I didn't say mastering studio, and I guess that's where people get their knickers in a twist. I've never seen one in a mastering studio either, but apparently some people like using them in moderation. If other people like using "exciters", I do wish they would be allowed to do so without someone chiding them for their own personal choice. And chances are you've listened to a perfectly good recording where an "exciter" was used somewhere on something. I don't know why we have to get all dogmatic at the mere mention of the device.

To be clear: I'm not trying to pick a fight, and the funny thing is that I hardly ever use Spectralive except for on voice-overs, where I find it to be very effective at getting the 'broadcast sound' quickly (but I still EQ, don't worry!). I never use it on a mix; frankly, I'm scared to! But I think if people get results that hold up from "exciters" - who are we to talk them out of it? Fire away, goddamit! You'll find out soon enough if you've ruined your mix by trying a quick fix-it.

Anyways, peace (hopefully).

[kritikon]

Anybody have both Spectralive and BBE? I've heard Spectralive 2 and REALLY like it. How does it compare to the BBE?

I prefer Spectralive (I don't use the BBE plugin, but have a h/w unit). They both have a different character, but as already opined, Spectralive is just that much more flexible.

I use to see enhancers all over the place in studios. Probably they're not popular in mastering suites, but why would they be? They'd know there's a good chance an enhancer of some sort may have already been used in the studio, so you wouldn't want to risk running one twice over a mix - I've not used any enhancer yet that works well twice.


Exciter/enhancer...pretty well interchangeable nowadays. Most people mean the same thing when they say either. And the BBE most definitely IS an enhancer, Chagzuki...and it doesn't boost the bass unless you use the bass knob. On the h/w, BBE always maintained that the bass was purely a 100Hz Eq boost (presumably parametric rather than shelving) - which is why I never use the bass boost. You can see differences in an analyser, but you must compensate for the fact a BBE boosts the output level as well. That was probably a deliberate design flaw - we all know volume affects the perceived quality (in whichever direction). If you use a h/w BBE, the difference between on and off is 2-3 dB. Never assume an enhancer of any sort does any particular thing until you have EXACTLY matched pre and post output levels.


As for Eq...horses for courses - I too would rather use an enhancer at the end, or over a group than using Eq all over the place. Eq is for those who like it; it isn't a right way of doing it by a long shot. Myself, if something doesn't balance well, then I change the patch at source. But I don't do live instruments, which I'm sure makes a difference to how you mix and compose. I can understand using Eq on live instruments.


As for being a gimmick - it's no more a gimmick than Eq. Anything is a gimmick if you personally don't use or like it. TC, BBE, Aphex and others made a decent living out of selling enhancers both to private users and studios. So whether you like them or not, they are used. Personally I love 'em. I not that keen on overused Eq though - I use Coldplay as a reference for over zealous Eqing that generally ruins listenability. I found their 2nd LP horrid (not the songs, just the way every single track sounded exactly the same shade of beige...urrgh! (shivers)).

[Frippertronix]

BBE analog rack unit is always on my master outs. I also use a tube impedance buffer on the outs.

I won't master w/out analog BBE because I believe what they say about phase distortion from speakers and I like to undo it with BBE. It does often require that you bump your mids up with EQ, though.

I don't much care for the BBE plugin, which is a bit harsh sounding to my ears.

[Frippertronix]

I very rarely use EQs when I'm recording or mixing, and I NEVER use them when mastering.

A BBE's the first step in my mastering chain. Not much at all- just a very gentle tweak.

ew

You need .

.. but hey, if this works for you then good for you!

- bManic

Why? Have you heard his masters? I've heard of mastering engineers who only swap tube brands out of tube preamps to change the tonal character of recordings as they master. EQ isn't even supposed to be necessary if you have good enough mics/mic'ing technique, and enough control over your recording environment. For all you know, ew is a better engineer then you. I think you're jumping to conclusions.

[Frippertronix]

And the BBE most definitely IS an enhancer, Chagzuki

By that do you mean that it excites high frequencies by adding distortion?

[bduffy]

BBE analog rack unit is always on my master outs...

Gasp! SINNER!!!

[bmanic]

I very rarely use EQs when I'm recording or mixing, and I NEVER use them when mastering.

A BBE's the first step in my mastering chain. Not much at all- just a very gentle tweak.

ew

You need .

.. but hey, if this works for you then good for you!

- bManic

Why? Have you heard his masters? I've heard of mastering engineers who only swap tube brands out of tube preamps to change the tonal character of recordings as they master. EQ isn't even supposed to be necessary if you have good enough mics/mic'ing technique, and enough control over your recording environment. For all you know, ew is a better engineer then you. I think you're jumping to conclusions.

Like I said, if it works for him then all is fine but don't expect fixing somebodys mediocre mix by not touching EQ at all. Ask any mastering enginer what is the most important tool and they'll most likely say EQ.

Enhancer and eq are NOT the same thing and should be used accordingly. One does not replace the other.

- bManic

[kilroy]

On the h/w, BBE always maintained that the bass was purely a 100Hz Eq boost (presumably parametric rather than shelving) - which is why I never use the bass boost.

Actually you might want to check that. As far as I know the high contour was hinged at 5k and the low contour was always at 50hz...at least that's how I remember it.

[bduffy]

I very rarely use EQs when I'm recording or mixing, and I NEVER use them when mastering.

A BBE's the first step in my mastering chain. Not much at all- just a very gentle tweak.

ew

You need .

.. but hey, if this works for you then good for you!

- bManic

Why? Have you heard his masters? I've heard of mastering engineers who only swap tube brands out of tube preamps to change the tonal character of recordings as they master. EQ isn't even supposed to be necessary if you have good enough mics/mic'ing technique, and enough control over your recording environment. For all you know, ew is a better engineer then you. I think you're jumping to conclusions.

Like I said, if it works for him then all is fine but don't expect fixing somebodys mediocre mix by not touching EQ at all. Ask any mastering enginer what is the most important tool and they'll most likely say EQ.

Enhancer and eq are NOT the same thing and should be used accordingly. One does not replace the other.

- bManic

bmanic, you suck.

[bmanic]

eh?

btw. the comment to Ew was inteded to be very light-hearted, hence the smiley. People need to lighten up a bit when reading forums.

Cheers!
bManic

[c_huelsbeck]

Wow... I didn't know Spectralive yet and the BBE was on my shopping list for a long time (but the price was a bit of a downer). Spectralive seems perfect for breathing some life into older recordings of mine and it's very affordable... great plug!