Is freeware powerful enough to make good music?

[Argitoth]

You'll be amazed, I'm sure.

I am also sure. But that just proves how much more amazing libraries are that are worth $500+ as opposed to those worth $0.

[james0tucson]

Freeware what? Hosts? There's a short list of freeware hosts. Recorders? Some free and cheap recorders are great. Instruments? Green Oak Crystal remains one of my favorite synths, and some people get a lot of use out of Synth1, despite having others, even expensive ones. FX? This is one area where a certain level of quality demands a high price, but consider, the quality curve may be logarithmic. Depending on your perception, what you get for $3500 might not be that much better than what you get for $500. And the stuff that comes with your host, or even some of the stuff you can get free, can be pretty damned good.

One thing you do get at the high end of the price scale, is entry into a world of de facto standards where you can more easily hire people to man your rig, instead of having to seek out specialists or set them on a learning curve. The importance of that is lost on most independent artists, and the idea that compatability and vendor relationship might even be more important than sound quality, completely escapes certain types of people. Just because something costs more, doesn't mean it's better *for you*. What you put in a FOH rig that gets a different sound man every night is a world apart from what you want in your own personal rig.

[Armadillo]

Alxndr: Are we talking FREE soundfonts available to the public? For metal?
Guitar soundfonts that beats RealGuitar and LPC? Sorry, I must be blind. I wonder how any developer can make any money

Would somebody please enlighten me. Show me a convincing guitar/strings/brass track done using foundfonts.

Meanwhile here's a track using LPC, which is not free
http://www.prominy-ss.com/demo/LPC/Stay.mp3

And a track using EWQLSO Gold http://www.soundsonline.com/cd_mp3_demos/206206.mp3

You're gonna tell me there's FREE soundfonts sounding as good as this?

[Rellik]

I don't see how anyone, in seriousness, could possibly vote for "it is not possible to make good music with freeware".

Considering the fact that it's possible to make good music with anything at all...

[Amberience]

but guitars, brass and strings don't come near some of the mid/high end sample libraries. Not from what I've heard anyway. I mean, how would the developers sell their $500-1000+ libraries otherwise.

Prove me wrong and show me some jaw dropping sound fonts...

That's not really fair. It's a bit like saying "oh well, Crystal must be a shit synth, otherwise why would Absynth sell so well?"

Samples are just that .. SAMPLES... It doesn't matter how they come, soundfonts, sound players, stuck in a wavetable in the Malstrom, stuck in a patch in Halion... they're all recorded sounds.

So yes, it is very possible to get FREE and really good soundfonts - ever heard of NSKIT to name one of them?

I've the guitars in my sampletank2 collection.. they are pretty shit. I'm just lucky that I play guitar and don't need them. The drums are pretty good though, and I switch between them and freebie soundfonts dependent on my song.

[kangul]

No, I just want to tell you that you should take a close look at some of free sf2. It's not that bad. And the sound is at your fingertips. Cheers.

[Ildon]

Alxndr: Are we talking FREE soundfonts available to the public? For metal?
Guitar soundfonts that beats RealGuitar and LPC? Sorry, I must be blind. I wonder how any developer can make any money

Would somebody please enlighten me. Show me a convincing guitar/strings/brass track done using foundfonts.

Meanwhile here's a track using LPC, which is not free
http://www.prominy-ss.com/demo/LPC/Stay.mp3

And a track using EWQLSO Gold http://www.soundsonline.com/cd_mp3_demos/206206.mp3

You're gonna tell me there's FREE soundfonts sounding as good as this?

Hehe, ever heard the soundtrack to Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children? Nobuo Uematsu used a Roland SC88 for that, but you wouldn't know it by listening to it. Many free soundfonts come from the SC88... I had about 8 of them.

It can be done, it just takes a lot of work. People buy higher end libraries because they want to get their music out faster and/or don't know how to make older stuff sound professional, I guess.

[xander]

@ Armadillo -- It depends on what you are using them for, but of course. There are amazing soundfonts at the core of lots of FREE VSTi. Mini-erhu from Kong Audio was one that I am intimately familiar with.

Real Guitar is something I would NEVER use because IMHO it sounds horrible, but I have used 'guitar chord' soundfonts that have sounded incredible & they are FREE at Hammer Sounds, etc.

It's not so difficult to understand the technical differences between good and bad soundfonts. If you look at the audio quality of a well-made soundfont -- many of which are FREE, there are no differences in the specs between them and the samples in EWQL, etc.

You're saying ALL FREE SOUNDFONTS SUCK and I am saying that's not true, and it isn't. It's not fair to label ALL FREE SOUNDFONTS SUCK, since many do not and there is a wide range of quality.

It's like saying ALL CARS SUCK because you once had a shitty Ford.

There are *some* free soundfonts I'd stack up against any of the big sample libs on a sample-for-sample quality basis -- loads of Basses for instance including faithfully recorded Acoustic, Jazz & P-basses which were subsequently made into excellent, clean-sounding soundfonts. These can be found at Hammer Sound, for instance.

Ch33rs,
Alex

[Foxglove]

About the whole soundfonts issue;

You've gotta understand that soundfonts is a somewhat dated format. At the time when the Creative Live! cards were popular, which more or less made soundfonts popular, the quality of some free soundfonts were amazingly high quality, and definately on par with commecial sample Cds.

Sadly, those times are gone, technology has moved on, and I'd have to admit that I haven't heard a quality soundfont library that is on par with today's commercial sample CDs. I can say though, that I have heard some of today's commercial products that are NOT ON PAR with those soundfonts from 5 years ago.

[Armadillo]

Alxndr: ok, you don't like RealGuitar, I do. Matter of taste. No point in arguing about that one.

Regarding your "all soundfonts suck" comment. I did not at all say that. Actually if you look at my post on the previous page you will notice that I said I've heard some good drumkit soundfonts, but that strings/guitar and brass are generally disappointing.......

Mini erhu is great btw. I'll probably use it in a tune soon.

[Ildon]

but that strings/guitar and brass are generally disappointing.......

Yeah, I agree with you. Most of the sounds aren't very inspiring when you first work with them (except SC88 sounds... mmm...), but sometimes you just have to make do with what you have.

But I tell you... if I had an SC88, that'd be the only synth I'd ever use for the rest of my life. I'd work hard as hell to get it to sound as top of the line as possible.

[Argitoth]

Here's my take on everything:

-When you pay $600 or $500 or $1000 you'll get something better than if it was for free.
-You don't have to have a million free things scattered everywhere in some huge mess to get what you're looking for.
-Paying big bucks allows for more freedom than would allow for something free. By freedom I mean you don't have to try to make something sound good.
-Free software will train you to get the most out of expensive software.
-When creating Electronic music and you already have expensive synths/samplers/manipulators/effects free samples/wavetables are great.
-Free softsynths create a very broad gray area for quality of music because the quality of electronic music is 80% skill, 20% gear (something around those figures)

[xander]

Alxndr: ok, you don't like RealGuitar, I do. Matter of taste. No point in arguing about that one.

Yeah, maybe it's just what I heard and it wasn't used well -- it's probably better than horrible & to be fair I've never personally tried it.

Regarding your "all soundfonts suck" comment. I did not at all say that. Actually if you look at my post on the previous page you will notice that I said I've heard some good drumkit soundfonts, but that strings/guitar and brass are generally disappointing.......

I wasn't quoting you, just capped that comment as an interpretation of the feelings you expressed about *FREE* soundfonts. There really are some awesome *FREE* sf's out there.

Mini erhu is great btw. I'll probably use it in a tune soon.

Yeah cool innit? I certainly think so.

But in general a soundfont can be as good a sample as as bad a sample as you make it. With the newest formant and other sample-based engines out there, it's hard for the old SF2 standard to hold up in general, but I still have (and use) some really superb quality fonts. Too bad no one has really kept up SF standards development industry-wise, since many samples work extremely well -- especially in the better quality/higher-end sf players.

Ch33rs,
Alex

[Max el Belga]

If you can´t make good music with free software, then you won´t with commercial either !
99% of my software is free, because I didn´t want to spend another lifetime and another fortune on stuff that I already got together in analoge form in my studio ! And I never felt as happy as now ! Amazing quality ! Of course there will be better stuff, but I´m sure it won´t make my music any better !

Holly shite ! I even sound serious, I hope this is only temporal !

[olepro]

The only thing you need is talent nowadays.