KVR Audio

the_nihilist · Post by **the_nihilist** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:09 am

Learning music theory started out as something pretty simple... I had been noodling around with music for awhile, and just wanted to make something that was listenable, and didn't sound totally crappy.

I started at the very basics, and learned scales... this was pretty cool, because I could suddenly make songs that sounded like songs instead of random collections of notes. Yup, scales were pretty cool, and I could make some darn good EBM with them.

Just knowing scales did me pretty well for awhile, but I didn't understand these weird "chord" things. I knew what they were, but I had no idea how to use them. It took me a long time to figure out that you had to use them with the idea of a "key" to make "chord progressions". They day I figured this out, it blew my mind.

Around this time, I started becoming very good friends with some people who didn't listen to much music in 4/4 time, and I got verbally abused into learning different time signatures. Like certain other things, it was painful at first, but eventually I learned to relax and enjoy it.

Things are starting to get really out of hand now. I've been learning more and more theory, and I fear I'm starting to get a little obsessed with it. In fact, today I was walking to the grocery store, reflecting on a small musical sketch I wrote earlier. I was suddenly hit with the sickening realization that (No, I didn't leave a burner on. I didn't leave the door unlocked. I didn't even forget to bring the cat in) I had written the entire chord progression without using any suspended chords, and only one inversion. I couldn't believe it, and rushed back home to open up my sequencer and change the progression.

I'm not sure what the moral of this story is. I still have my all-consuming desire to learn more theory, through books, discussion and experimentation. A large part of it is that I just seem to have alot less fun making music when I'm not also trying to learn new things to do with it; the theory drives the willingness to create. Another aspect is the challenge of making something with rules you're not quite sure of.

I realize that in the end, the only person that my music has to satisfy is myself, but I've gotten to that really agonizing point where I keep wondering whether it's me or the theory that's determining how my music sounds. Does anyone here have any thoughts?

PaulSC · Post by **PaulSC** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:13 am

Knowledge is good. But don't let all this new stuff displace the knowledge you already have, that you can write anything you damn please!

Waker · Post by **Waker** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:14 am

Theory is good. It's a handy tool. You just got to know how and when to use it.

Just remember that music also *CAN* be an emotional language. Learn to unlearn.

The Chase · Post by **The Chase** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:18 am

theory ruined my life.

CypherOne · Post by **CypherOne** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:20 am

still, it's good to know that you used to have one...

Col.G · Post by **Col.G** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:31 am

“Master your instrument, Master the music, and then forget all that shit and just play.” - Charlie Parker

flippya2000 · Post by **flippya2000** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:57 am

Hi the_nihilist,

I enjoyed reading your post, it reminds me a bit of myself (I'm still learning theory), but I'm not quite at the level you are by the looks of things..

I know what inversions are, and vaguely remember what suspensions are, but am still confused about how one stays in a single mode - Eg C-Major uses all the white keys, but depending on which notes you play determines the mode?

Also, coz you seem to be more advanced, would you like to share any theory notes you made? (Or any books/other resources you found useful)

Anyways, all the best & keep on learning!

Lord Snarebottom · Post by **Lord Snarebottom** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:02 am

I've never adhered to rules, so why should I learn musical rules? Just to break them?

1 reason would be to translate what is in my head into what other musos might divine meaning from (notation). My host does that for me. I do have a basic understanding of notation and time signatures, but that is all.

Another reason might be to understand complex musical ideas of harmony, suspension, release, etc.. Then I remembered what my classically trained friend told me years ago: that I already know those things naturally. He tried to teach me modes and cycle of fifths, etc., but he conceded that I really had no use for them. He became Allan Holdsworth's drinking buddy. I'm here at KVR waxing philosophistry. Wow, it's almost like a "where are they now" moment....glad I'm not fliippin' burgers, like The Knack.

The one constant that I see, is that we are all different. So what the hell do I know?

Did someone ask a question?

nuffink · Post by **nuffink** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:03 am

Col.G wrote:“Master your instrument, Master the music, and then forget all that shit and just play.” - Charlie Parker

Sound advice from a true genius.
Its a shame so many muso's only hear “Forget all that shit and just play.”

Reverse Engineer · Post by **Reverse Engineer** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:07 am

nuffink wrote:
Col.G wrote:“Master your instrument, Master the music, and then forget all that shit and just play.” - Charlie Parker
Sound advice from a true genius.
Its a shame so many muso's only hear “Forget all that shit and just play.”

What's shameful about it? From interviews i have read from musicians / bands i like, a fair amount of their music has been developed from that principal. The dullest music i've ever heard is the music that follows all the "rules". So play on people, f**k about, make something actually worth listening to instead of just pretty, acceptable compositions.

Lord Snarebottom · Post by **Lord Snarebottom** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:11 am

Reverse Engineer wrote:
nuffink wrote:
Col.G wrote:“Master your instrument, Master the music, and then forget all that shit and just play.” - Charlie Parker
Sound advice from a true genius.
Its a shame so many muso's only hear “Forget all that shit and just play.”
What's shameful about it? From interviews i have read from musicians / bands i like, a fair amount of their music has been developed from that principal. The dullest music i've ever heard is the music that follows all the "rules". So play on people, f**k about, make something actually worth listening to instead of just pretty, acceptable compositions.

Music is an emotional medium. Too much adherence to rules dulls any emotional experience.

Perhaps the best advice would be to learn to channel your emotional energy into the music. Then we'll start hearing some good sh1t.

nuffink · Post by **nuffink** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:12 am

Reverse Engineer wrote:
nuffink wrote:
Col.G wrote:“Master your instrument, Master the music, and then forget all that shit and just play.” - Charlie Parker
Sound advice from a true genius.
Its a shame so many muso's only hear “Forget all that shit and just play.”
What's shameful about it? From interviews i have read from musicians / bands i like, a fair amount of their music has been developed from that principal. The dullest music i've ever heard is the music that follows all the "rules". So play on people, f**k about, make something actually worth listening to instead of just pretty, acceptable compositions.

Proud to be ignorant and boasting about it.

Nowhere else but music.

Lord Snarebottom · Post by **Lord Snarebottom** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:14 am

I have a feeling this topic is going multi-platinum

nuffink · Post by **nuffink** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:16 am

Average musician turns architect.

Reverse Engineer · Post by **Reverse Engineer** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:26 am

nuffink wrote:

Average musician turns architect.

There seems to be something biting your ass....care to share what it is? Who's "good" in your opinion and who's "bad"? Are you a failed musician with a bee in his/her bonnet? somethings eating you to make such pointless sweeping claims.

I am turning into a theory slut