How is Tracktion working out for you? My decision tomm

[pHz]

but a showstopper ??? ... no more than live not playing clips in the arrangement view when i dragged them there from the session view and instead having to always remember to record them across instead ...

That's very odd Rob - I have never had that problem. To make sure I wasn't imagining it I just tested this with my machine, and I successfully dragged some audio and MIDI loops into the arrangement view while playing another project. Not only did it work, there were no audio dropouts at all even though I was adding new material to the timeline while the track was playing. Another example of Ableton's truly phenomenal gapless audio engine at work
Did you have this problem as a one-off? Please do a double check and either:
A. send your system specs to Ableton if you've not previously done so, or
B. confirm back here that it was an honest mistake and it does actually work

dragging clips from session view onto the arrangement view has NEVER worked for me on my current system (live 3 through 5) ... i can see the clips in arrangement view and manipulate them as expected but dont get any sound when playing back - to get that working i HAVE to record from session view (even if its only 1 or 2 beats of a clip) into the arrangement ...

... never been more than an annoyance to my live workflow (but i guess could be another users 'showstopper') since i always pretty much ending up assuming that was the way it worked and i was misunderstanding the documentation ...

... and to my shame ive never reported it on the ableton forum ...

... having said that i guess i always also recognised it as something system-specific - maybe to do with one of my system tweaks ???

slainte rob

[Lunch Money]

The point is that when I raised this issue on the forum I was consistently told by people (including some who have contributed to this thread) that it must be system specific because other's weren't having the issue.

Exactly. That's the ONLY conclusion that can be reached logically! It's not saying that Tracktion has nothing to do with it, it's saying there's something about your system that made it not want to cooperate. The Line6 Toneport won't work well with a certain Pentium chipset, of all things. What's the chipset to do with it? Who knows, but it's what they finally discovered.

Well Synthbuilder, for one, obviously did have that problem. And if, as pHz says, it has been "done to death" on the Tracktion forum I can only assume that quite a few people have experienced this particular showstopper.

OR the actual conclusion that's reasonable to be drawn, "one can only assume that a few people have experienced this particular showstopper," which I'd agree with. Surely not just one man in the entire world with his one computer has run into it. I myself had GUI slowdowns that cleared up either by a) changing video card, which shows system-specific changes made; or b) with a T update. Both happened at the same time, so I've never been sure which it is. Could be both. Who knows?

I just wouldn't want people to hear the words, "quite a few people have GUI slowdowns" when the truth is that I haven't heard ANYONE report one in several months. Perhaps the problem got fixed. Perhaps not. Either way, it's not a pervasive problem, and it's nothing that trying the demo wouldn't reveal to you within moments of testing.

I was well impressed, hq, that you consciously avoided making it seem like a pervasive problem in this and the other thread, though. Good on ya, mate!

Greg

[diverdee]

I came across the screen redraw prob with T2, I know of others who did who ditched Tracktion also.
Dunno how widespread the problem was - I wasn't that interested in conducting a survey TBH, especially considering the ultra-defensive nature of some of the more 'religious' users on the RMS forum, I probably didn't even mention the problem at the time as i'd have likely just been accused of being a 'hater' or something (I kinda stopped bothering posting bugs & problems once the RMS forum started to appear more like the 'church of T2" as I didn't want to be persecuted as an infidel or unbeliever).
It was just one more nail in the coffin for me, being mainly midi based & having probs with looping, the nature of the automation (difficult to rearrange), the reason & cc's thing, probs with the various midi options, overwrite, replace & blend (or whatever the tracktion options were) not working properly for midi clips.
Whatever - I've still got the NFR copy, which I may use for mastering with the mackie final mix in (although the rendering/truncation problem may still be present in the NFR - dunno).
Lunch Money & others are prolly gonna say now that the forum was never like that, well you certainly never really were - but some of the other dudes there had a certain blindspot, it was like reports of bugs & problems were personal attacks on the lineage of their children or something.
Whatever, ancient history.
Short opinion, personal only - Linear Audio work - T2 does what it says on the tin, simply with little fuss extremely well.
Playing with audio loops - ok depending on how deep you want to go, it's no live for looping, but horses for courses.
Extensive midi, with overdubs & looping - T2 starts to get a little flakey, ok for the basics.
Outboard gear, sync etc - problematic (unless it's been sorted out now) - i'd demo it extensively.
Rewiring with reason etc. - problems if your looping etc. & it misses the first note etc. - not a showstopper, but a niggler, the generic CC's showing up in automation rather thatn the actual reason parameters gets fairly old fairly quick also.
Still it's fairly cheap - going for around £110 online in the U.K. now - down from it's original online retail price of around 140-ish (from what I remember) that's definbately better value.

[No name]

One more question...

Does Sonar have a piano roll???

[j_T]

One more question...

Does Sonar have a piano roll???

Sure

Regards,

Tommy

[headquest]

One more question...

Does Sonar have a piano roll???

It has a very powerful full screen one. You can also use the paino roll for "inline" editing within the main arrangement view in Sonar (as in Tracktion, etc)

[No name]

One more question...

Does Sonar have a piano roll???

It has a very powerful full screen one. You can also use the paino roll for "inline" editing within the main arrangement view in Sonar (as in Tracktion, etc)

That's a huge plus. The piano roll is an ingenius tool for midi.

Does anyone know whether Tracktion has it or not?

[pHz]

tracktion DOES have a piano roll ... admittedly not as sophisticated as i understand sonars to be (not having actually tried it you understand ... ) but sufficient for my (and many other users) needs ...

... to compare tracktions piano roll with other hosts i know fairly well ... its (for me) as good as lives but not as powerful as those in fl-studio or energyXT ...

... while not COMPLETELY full-screen tracktions pianoroll can currently be expanded to fill about 3/4 of the available screen space (though this is likely to be improved upon soon) which (again for me personally) is plenty big enough ...

(all these comments made from the point of view of someone (UNLIKE many other evangelical tracktion users i think) who DOESNT record a lot of audio and works mainly with samples and MIDI / VST)

slainte rob

[Lunch Money]

<peers around>



Now that I have a brand-spanking new Edirol MIDI keyboard, I may get more up to speed with MIDI stuff.

Of course, you probably weren't talking about me!

I know at one point in time (whether they moved on or not, I can't remember who it was!) there was a Tracktioneer who ONLY did MIDI, with full orchestrations, using Tracktion's piano roll. Whether it's as sophisticated or not, it's certainly up to the task, especially with access and easy editing of the controller lane.

Greg

[jtxx000]

Yup, it's inline and fits beautifully with the workflow.

[christianmusicmaker]

One more question...

Does Sonar have a piano roll???

It has a very powerful full screen one. You can also use the paino roll for "inline" editing within the main arrangement view in Sonar (as in Tracktion, etc)

That's a huge plus. The piano roll is an ingenius tool for midi.

Does anyone know whether Tracktion has it or not?

It does. Hey! When exactly will you demo these products already?

It will be interesting to read your views on the piano roll in Tracktion and Sonar. I think Sonar's has more features but Tracktion may meet your needs.

A piano roll is a pretty standard feature in sequencer's these days. It is how they are implemented that puts people on either side of the fence at times.

I quite like Tracktions implementation as it fits well with the gui, as does Sonar's but crucially in version 5 of Sonar the inline Piano roll gives me Tracktions inline midi editing with a host of other plugs and FX to use in one host and offers me more ways to view my data.

When you do get round to trying out the products you really should give quite a considerable time to doing so if possible. I think someone else said something similar earlier in this thread.

It is very likely you will discover many things we cannot possibly tell you here such has how it feels for you. So many times when I have tried a demo of a product it would take about a month before I will pretty much know how well I can work with a package or not. For some it may be ten minutes others longer than a month. Either way give plenty of time to try them out to avoid surprises after buying it.

I would also read different reviews in magazines especially Sound on Sound as they are known for going into plenty of detail.

I personally will go through the product's own forum and see what their users are saying. Get a feel for support and the future development of the product. For me a host is not a small investment at all. I have no time to migrate from here to there. Too many projects I need to finish!

You have created quite a build up of expectation now. Don't tell us you will now decide to go the Mac route and pick up Logic 7 or post NAMM possibly Logic 8!

No...don't ask so how does Logic compare to X? Thats another ten page thread at least!

[No name]

Interesting. you see, i'm not so concerned as to the size of the piano roll or anything, just so long as it is there i'm coooool.

[rpc9943]

diverdee if you could maybe tell beno in pm all those issues maybe they could implement fixes in the next release or at least when planning t3

RonC

[pHz]

Interesting. you see, i'm not so concerned as to the size of the piano roll or anything, just so long as it is there i'm coooool.

its there ... definitely ...



slainte rob

[diverdee]

S'cool Ronc - the threads are still there in RMS somewhere - i've moved on from T now.
I vaguely remember some of the mods/beta testers mentioning putting them in the database or whatever - but that was a fair while ago.
I don't even have tracktion on my machine now, so I can't replicate the probs & TBH I can't be bothered banging it on just to jog my memory on what exactly the issues were, i'm happy with live & won't even be using the NFR for mastering (rendering/truncation problem).
I'm sure that they will eventually iron out those issues, jules seems cool & beno & other mackie guys & some of the tracktion guys, modulr, Lunch Money, PHZ & others are absolutely stellar.