ableton live5 compared to fls6xxl?

[RawTheory]

I have a serious latency problem with Live 5. Anybody else have that problem? I've tried the Latency Compensation tutorial, got 1ms latency, input that into the overall latency in the preferences menu and STILL have latency. What gives?

[headquest]

Raw Theory:

No such problems here. First of all check your audio settings are correct:

Options > Preferences > Audio tab: Driver Type should say ASIO. If not, select ASIO from the dropdown menu and then configure your soundcard settings correctly using the other info in the dialog box. The latency settings should be corrected there first (and on your hardware's setup).

Also check that "Delay Compensation" is ticked/selected from the Options Menu.

Delay Compensation works well for VST and AU instruments/effects, but is not yet fixed for Rewire slave devices (it will be soon). That would only cause a problem if you were using VST and Rewire devices simultaneously, though. This is the only latency issue that I am aware users have discussed in version 5.0.3.

By the way, 1ms latency is generally undetectable . Adding that will have no discernable effect. And also if there is a particular latency issue on one track you can manually adjust latency for that track within the mixer section.

I hope this helps, but if not you should report your problem in more detail in the "Bugs and Problems" section of the Ableton forum, where the Ableton Gurus will give further help to get you sorted

[ModuLR]

groove quantize, a'la logic, acid etc, would be fantastic.

In Live 5 you can actually Groove Quantise AUDIO [by copying and pasting warp markers from one complete audio track to another] - something I am not aware that any other programme can do! (For full information see the recent tutorial on the subject in Sound on Sound - or ask and I'll explain more!)

So for MIDI you could simply bounce to audio and then Groove Quantise.

Once again, this is very much the sort of thing that makes Ableton a unique and very special piece of music software that stands out from not only FL, but from all the rest!

But yes, a direct MIDI groove quantise would also be nice.

uhh... Acid can groove quantize audio AND midi...

[headquest]

uhh... Acid can groove quantize audio AND midi...

Cheers ModuLR, I didn't know that.

Let's hope that as of version 6, Acid will also be able to run without crashing, host VSTs properly, and begin to reverse the quite shocking/appalling fall from glory that it has suffered since Sony bought it.

[RawTheory]

Raw Theory:

No such problems here. First of all check your audio settings are correct:

Options > Preferences > Audio tab: Driver Type should say ASIO. If not, select ASIO from the dropdown menu and then configure your soundcard settings correctly using the other info in the dialog box. The latency settings should be corrected there first (and on your hardware's setup).

Also check that "Delay Compensation" is ticked/selected from the Options Menu.

Delay Compensation works well for VST and AU instruments/effects, but is not yet fixed for Rewire slave devices (it will be soon). That would only cause a problem if you were using VST and Rewire devices simultaneously, though. This is the only latency issue that I am aware users have discussed in version 5.0.3.

By the way, 1ms latency is generally undetectable . Adding that will have no discernable effect. And also if there is a particular latency issue on one track you can manually adjust latency for that track within the mixer section.

I hope this helps, but if not you should report your problem in more detail in the "Bugs and Problems" section of the Ableton forum, where the Ableton Gurus will give further help to get you sorted

Thanks for the response headquest. I don't have a latency problem with rewire, and as of now i don't use vst instruments, only Reason 3. The latency comes when recording external audio like from a mic or from a guitar. I've gone through the Latency compensation tutorial and came out with 1ms. I've been in contact with the Abletons tech support and they just keep telling me to input the setting i recieve into the Overall latency in the preferences. But I've already done that....over and over and over and the latency persists. I've even tryed to set it by ear and it just doesn't work and its driving me f*@#ing crazy!!. I guess the next step is to go the "Bugs and Problems" section you were speaking of....This is so crappy.

[ModuLR]

Let's hope that as of version 6, Acid will also be able to run without crashing, host VSTs properly, and begin to reverse the quite shocking/appalling fall from glory that it has suffered since Sony bought it.

some would argue the same for Live5... touche!

[opia]

2) Live's ability to instantly warp audio to fit the project tempo is unusual if not unique. I have no idea how you could even attempt that in FL.

actually, thats one of FL's strong points IMHO.
You can either:

A) right click an audio file in the browser and select "Open in new slicer channel" or..

B) same procedure but choose the granulizer instead of the slicer.
or...

C) drop an audio file in the time line, right click the time knob and select 1 beat, 2 beats, 1 bar , 4 bars etc etc.
or....

D) drop an audio file in the timeline and drag the right edge to stretch/compress.

FL also plays loops in time when you audition from the browser like Live does.

or you could get Live,drop an audio file in it,and warp it in ways you'll never be able to in FL without jumping thru several hoops to get there.


and the pitch will not change when you stretch/compress

unless of course you want it to

Acid makes audio elastic

Live turns it into sculpting clay

[headquest]

Let's hope that as of version 6, Acid will also be able to run without crashing, host VSTs properly, and begin to reverse the quite shocking/appalling fall from glory that it has suffered since Sony bought it.

some would argue the same for Live5... touche!

Dunno really. I don't see lots of people deffecting from Live... it seems to be doing pretty well at present. Let's hope that lasts . But who still uses Acid? Not too many people it seems, although maybe the next version will restore its fortunes.

Personally I have used Live since version 2 and not had a single crash . The only music software that ever gave me serious stability problems was Tracktion 2, but that's a whole other story.

[Jason Brian Merrill]

You can groove quantize audio using the slicer anyway --

as far as Acid vs. Live -- i would say acid is much less stable, but live isnt all that better.

and, 1ms latency can be VERY detectable if you are mixing wet/dry -- and you get phase issues.

[G-Ro124]

christ I mix with 10ms and I can barely hear a thing!


As for the debate:

I am a person who works very much, if not all the time, with MIDI. Audio isn't really there in many of my projects (for drums, I use FXpansion's DR-008 [Highly Recommended]). Therefore, FL really works for me. However, the thing that REALLY REALLY REALLY pisses me off about FL is the reliance on fixed patterns. If you have a melody that goes slightly over the 1 measure mark, FL will push the entire thing to 2 measures, creating a LOT of empty space.

Live is really oriented to live audio, something that I just don't do. It is possibly the best live tool (which is why it's name is "Live") that I can think of.

~Hope this helped

[headquest]

The thing that REALLY REALLY REALLY pisses me off about FL is the reliance on fixed patterns. If you have a melody that goes slightly over the 1 measure mark, FL will push the entire thing to 2 measures, creating a LOT of empty space.

When I last tried FL the same thing really pissed me off too. If you haven't already done so, check out Live. Inidividual patterns can be literally any length you like, and will correctly loop according to the specific length you set them to. Not only that, but you can use mixed time signatures side by side - you can have one loop in 7/16 time, one in 4/4, and one in 15/32... and they'll all loop correctly and stay "in time" with each other!

So for patterns I would say that Live is much more flexible than FL in this regard.

[headquest]

as far as Acid vs. Live -- i would say acid is much less stable, but live isnt all that better.

Nobody should be fooled by ModuLR's nonsense about Live being unstable/buggy. All software has occasional bugs and issues. The real issue is: What support do the developers give and how quickly do they fix problems that occur?

Certainly bugs occur in Ableton. But they release patches roughtly every two-to-three months, all year, every year. Occasionally you do get people having tantrums on their forum and claiming they are leaving for another programme (as with most programmes it seems). But usually you see the same person back a few weeks later saying that Live is, after all, the best thing since sliced bread. I think that is very different from the droves who have completely given up on Acid (or Tracktion) over recent years.

and, 1ms latency can be VERY detectable if you are mixing wet/dry -- and you get phase issues.

So please tell me, what hardware interface do you recommend that can comfortably operate at less than 1ms latency?

[pHz]

I think that is very different from the droves who have completely given up on Acid (or Tracktion) over recent years.

cheap derailing shot with that unnecessary aside ... evidence please ...

slainte rob

[headquest]

There's plenty of eveidence right here at KVR for the fact that there are load of ex-Acid users around. But if that isn't sufficient, check out the Cakewalk and Ableton forums and ask. You'll get a pretty big response

[pHz]

you KNOW im not talking about acid (i agree with on that part of the comment) ... quit stalling ...

slainte rob