Damnit, I knew Live 5 had to have an achilles heel somewhere

[Gwydi]

Since I bought it, Live 5 has transformed my studio, I've never made so much music or been able to capture so many moments of inspiration with any other sequencer, and I've tried most of them.

Unfortunately, I've just found its achilles heel, and it's a bad one ...

It only sees the first 128 automation parameters in a VST.

That means for software like Arturia CS80, which has WAY more than 128 automatable parameters, you can't automate a significant number of the controls, and unfortunately, many of them are exactly the sorts of things you would want to automate.

Arturia have said it's very unlikely this limit will change, so it's obviously a downside of their controller implementation. They've intimated that they might look at letting you choose which 128 parameters it can "see", which would work too, but I doubt it's a high priority.

Damn, damn, damn. For a while there, I thought it was perfect

If anybody can think of a workaround, I'm all ears!

[vurt]

ext? if you open ext within live(if thats possible) can you use exts midicc assignement to at least be able to choose the 128?

[Gwydi]

Vurt, I can open eXT within Live, and I can see how to specify midi ccs (wow, there are 548 parameters in CS80!), but it seems to be ignoring incoming midi cc data. Do I have to specifically enable it somewhere in ext?

[dougsyo]

It only sees the first 128 automation parameters in a VST.

That means for software like Arturia CS80, which has WAY more than 128 automatable parameters, you can't automate a significant number of the controls, and unfortunately, many of them are exactly the sorts of things you would want to automate.

Arturia have said it's very unlikely this limit will change,

Is this problem Arturia's ? or Live's? I'd think from what you described, the latter.

FLS5 and lower had similar problems, you could only see the first so-many parameters (it showed up with z3ta+ as well). EXT was one suggestion, MIDI learn (if CS-80 supports it) is another.

Doug

[Gwydi]

Got it! Had to 'enable param to cc mapping' inside eXT.

Now I can choose what controls what, and even give them sensible names.

Vurt, if I wasn't the wrong sex and didn't hate kids, I'd have your babies

Thanks,
G.

[vurt]

Vurt, if I wasn't the wrong sex and didn't hate kids, I'd have your babies

Thanks,
G.

damn i was almost bookin my ticket

glad to be of service
specially if it means more gwydi tunage

[G-Ro124]

Got it! Had to 'enable param to cc mapping' inside eXT.

Now I can choose what controls what, and even give them sensible names.

Vurt, if I wasn't the wrong sex and didn't hate kids, I'd have your babies

Thanks,
G.

you are mad sketchy

[Gwydi]

I've also posted this solution at the Ableton forums where this 128-parameter limit is a common complaint.

I can't thank you enough, I was even considering going back to FLstudio

(not to mention the fact that I've been looking for an excuse to buy eXT for the longest time, and now I have one!)

There IS more Gwydi tunage coming, as a matter of fact - two tracks for the new album are done already and more are on their way PM me if you'd like to hear them (very dark ambient).

[diverdee]

Yeah - that is a bummer.
It's the fact that one can't even see any parameters beyond the first 128 that can make it so frustrating.
The abes have mentioned that they are looking into it, so that (although there will still only be 128 automatable parameters for the foreseeable future) one will be able to view & automate past the first 128 parameter limit.

[Gwydi]

I'm completely happy now, Energy XT has solved the problem completely Good thing I'm not on a Mac

[Sascha Franck]

FWIW, MIDI automation probably not being sample accurate and all that... but I'm using this very same method in all my hosts now.
Automation data (at least in Logic and Cubase) is a total nightmare to deal with, especially when you're trying to use it for the "creative" side of things, rather than just doing the occasional leveling while mixing.
MIDI data can be timestretched, transformed, easily copied, etc etc. Something most automation implementations just don't allow for. And I couldn't care less whether something as a filtersweep is a sample or two late. Nobody will ever notice.
Really, this is one of THE key reasons for me to use eXT.

[beej]

Incidentally, in Logic 5+ you can edit track-based automation using the standard automation features, but also open the automation folder and edit/transform/cutpaste/loop it etc like conventional MIDI data as well - *and* you can also use standard midi controlls in the usual way. Pretty flexible.

I'm not convinced Logic's automation is the be-all-and-end-all off all implementations, but I do like it a lot...

[diverdee]

I mosty use midi cc automation within live, I have to in order to control the parameters of reasons instruments.
If vsti's have feely assignable cc automation this allows one to get past the limitation In live (as you can just set whichever cc to control any parameter).
It's not ideal though, as you are then limited to generic cc labels, rather than dexcriptions of the actual synths parameters.

[silicon/silicium]

energyXT is also excellent to record vst automation straight in session view. it's a shame live can't do that without Ext.

[Gwydi]

It's not ideal though, as you are then limited to generic cc labels, rather than dexcriptions of the actual synths parameters.

Using the eXT trick, you can rename the CCs to have any label you want

G.