Quite a big disadvantage in Cubase SX3 !!!!!

[jens]

next round :

say you want to render four bars of one certain track: how do you do it in Tracktion?

[SJ_Digriz]

A dedicated MIDI editor and proper dual monitor support.

Tracktion has both <edit> unles I am mis-interpreting the word "dedicated" there..

Normally that would mean that the MIDI editor works without complaint "Man that MIDI editor sure is dedicated"

In this case it means a MIDI editor that works without complaint from Sascha

[jens]

What's a "ghost-clip"? Duplicates that follow changes to the master clip?

yes


eXT has it for everything: midi-clips, audio-clips and envelope-clips (including tempo-/time-signature-clips)

Cool!

eXT's sequencer is already in the current version extremely powerful but still really easy to use (apart from a few flaws/annoyments) - the thing is that many aren't aware of this because when you open eXT it looks rather bland - but there's so much in there, believe me.

[jens]

A dedicated MIDI editor and proper dual monitor support.

Tracktion has both <edit> unles I am mis-interpreting the word "dedicated" there..

Normally that would mean that the MIDI editor works without complaint "Man that MIDI editor sure is dedicated"

In this case it means a MIDI editor that works without complaint from Sascha

the biggest problem with Tracktion's editor is that it doesn't remember the respective zoom-level of individual tracks so you're zooming and zooming and zooming....



...and zooming

[Sascha Franck]

Tracktion has both <edit> unles I am mis-interpreting the word "dedicated" there..

By dedicated MIDI editor I mean an extra window, without inline editing.
And sorry, as much as I understand your appreciation for T2, dual monitor support is just lousy, especially when dealing with differently sized monitors.
Apart from some plugin windows, you can't drag anything out of the main window - and resizing that one is anything else but ideal with two differently sized screen, especially in case you need to use different resolutions.
This is another area where Logic absolutely excels over *anything* else I've ever seen, as you can make *each* window floating (this even includes your arrangement window) and drag it out of the main window. Really, absolutely what the doctor ordered and completely unrivalled by any host there is.

As a result, my main workspace on the dual monitor setup consists of these screensets (just another thing that is great to have, btw):
- Arrange on 1st screen, mixer on 2nd screen. The working space.
- Arrange on 1st screen, small mixer channel strip along with it, Matrix (piano roll) on 2nd screen. The quick edit space.
- Small arrangement (just to select), reduced mixer on 1st screen, Matrix and Hyperedit (kickass for controllers, drums, etc) on 2nd screen. The detailed edit space.
- Mixer channels on 1st screen, busses, groups and whatever on 2nd screen, plus a very, very tiny arrange (just to navigate) floating on top. The mixing space.

These are my default ones, but I do open further ones occasionally.

Fwiw, in case you don't know allready, all these screensets are called up by a single keystroke on the numerical keys. You don't need to save screensets either, call up a number, arrange things and that's it.
In addition, all editors are linked, so whatever I will select in my arrange will be displayed in my editors.

The ability of having such a setup at all is just enough of a reason to not ever change my host. Unless others are implementing it, but so far there's nothing.

[Sascha Franck]

In this case it means a MIDI editor that works without complaint from Sascha

No, it simply means an extra window, instead of being bound to inline editing.

[jens]

In this case it means a MIDI editor that works without complaint from Sascha

No, it simply means an extra window, instead of being bound to inline editing.

even if you'd prefer inline-editing it's still a poor joke in Tracktion...

[stag]

you would need to reload each single plugin

and then save a preset from each plug in and load each one into the new instance.. that sucks big hairy donkey balls!

I dunno what you're up to - I'm still waiting for you answer to my question what you would need it for...

To save and recall mixer states, dumbass, are you using logic too or what??? it seems stupidity is contagious or crossplatform now.



OR IS THIS A FAMILY THING???

[Sascha Franck]

even if you'd prefer inline-editing it's still a poor joke in Tracktion...

I can't tell. In T1 I was failry dissapointed indeed, but I thought there'd been more or less massive improvements in T2.
Can you for instance open two inline editors at once? That wasn't possible in T1 and I knew immediately that it wasn't for me.

[jens]

Can you for instance open two inline editors at once? That wasn't possible in T1 and I knew immediately that it wasn't for me.

that was always possible - b.t.w.: I was also wrong about Tracktion not remembering individual zoom-levels.... - the big annoyment is rather that it always opens with a default editor-height (you can define that height to some small extent)

[IIRs]

And sorry, as much as I understand your appreciation for T2, dual monitor support is just lousy, especially when dealing with differently sized monitors.
Apart from some plugin windows, you can't drag anything out of the main window - and resizing that one is anything else but ideal with two differently sized screen, especially in case you need to use different resolutions.
This is another area where Logic absolutely excels over *anything* else I've ever seen, as you can make *each* window floating (this even includes your arrangement window) and drag it out of the main window. Really, absolutely what the doctor ordered and completely unrivalled by any host there is.

As a result, my main workspace on the dual monitor setup consists of these screensets (just another thing that is great to have, btw):
- Arrange on 1st screen, mixer on 2nd screen. The working space.
- Arrange on 1st screen, small mixer channel strip along with it, Matrix (piano roll) on 2nd screen. The quick edit space.
- Small arrangement (just to select), reduced mixer on 1st screen, Matrix and Hyperedit (kickass for controllers, drums, etc) on 2nd screen. The detailed edit space.
- Mixer channels on 1st screen, busses, groups and whatever on 2nd screen, plus a very, very tiny arrange (just to navigate) floating on top. The mixing space.

These are my default ones, but I do open further ones occasionally.

Fwiw, in case you don't know allready, all these screensets are called up by a single keystroke on the numerical keys. You don't need to save screensets either, call up a number, arrange things and that's it.
In addition, all editors are linked, so whatever I will select in my arrange will be displayed in my editors.

The ability of having such a setup at all is just enough of a reason to not ever change my host. Unless others are implementing it, but so far there's nothing.

I was an avid user of screensets in Cubase VST, and often wished it had proper dual monitor support.. what I really like about Tracktion is that the sensible and logical layout of the one main screen renders all that stuff totally unecessary! I only have one monitor at the moment (since I went LCD) but the only time I ever wish for another is when dealing with plug-in GUIs..

.. sure there are some improvements that need to be made, but they are (IMO) refinements to a fundamentally good paradigm.. no offense, but I regard screensets / linked editors etc. as sticking plasters for the basic problem of a badly designed interface!

I understand your perspective completely: once you have invested the time into learning a complex app like logic or cubase it seems easy and obvious.. however, in my last job I occasionally had to train new programmers; this would mean I either had to translate my working practises to another app like Logic, or teach a VST user some deep features they had not used before.. it soons becomes painfully clear how much stuff there is that is totally counter-intuitive and that you just need to know. Even Cubase SX feels like a different app to Cubase VST.. which is notably not a problem when moving from Tracktion 1 to Tracktion 2: there were some new features, but I was back to work instantly and felt completely at home

[IIRs]

To save and recall mixer states, dumbass,

please f**k off I really don't want you on my side

[jens]

To save and recall mixer states, dumbass,

please f**k off I really don't want you on my side

don't feed the trolls - use the mute button...

[IIRs]

even if you'd prefer inline-editing it's still a poor joke in Tracktion...

I can't tell. In T1 I was failry dissapointed indeed, but I thought there'd been more or less massive improvements in T2.
Can you for instance open two inline editors at once? That wasn't possible in T1 and I knew immediately that it wasn't for me.

[Sascha Franck]

FWIW, I allready said so in another thread, I do indeed believe that T2 is a prime example of a well laid out "one screen" application.
Yet, I just love making full use of both monitors.

But seriously, I will have a look into Tracktion again, once I have all my current issues sorted - workshops starting tomorrow, configuring eXT as a live guitar rig (which even includes aquiring some new hardware, so I'm really unsure...), looking for some funds to get me a MacBook asap, another Abbamania tour (oh yeah... ), and probably even learning either Live or Brainspawns Forte, should I need to expand my live setup. Oh, and then there's XT2...
So expect any further Tracktion experiences to start end of the year