Realistic Guitar Tones / Rigs ...

[geekboy]

While I like Amplitube 2 etc., I noticed that many of the signature sounds don't (to my ears) sound like the originals... Stevie Ray, Hendrix, etc.

When I looked at the setups, I noticed that some of these are not at all like the original rigs. Wouldn't it make sense to use the appropriate models and then tweak by ear?

If you like, you can check out documented setups here:

http://www.guitargeek.com/

[ew]

The rig's only half the story (if that)- the player's style, etc. is the other half. Stevie Ray would sound like Stevie Ray no matter what he was playing through. Same with Jimi...

ew

[geekboy]

Nontheless, if we are creating presets, shouldn't we start with appropriate models?

And, there are some people's rigs that I could identify with anyone playing them... John Scofield comes to mind.

[Sascha Franck]

I'm completely with ew on this one.
And then, even *if* you'd start with the same setup as Hendrix, there's some things to consider:

- Software amps don't sound like their hardware counterparts. No matter how you put it, they just don't. I haven't heard a single software amp that would sound like my Plexi Marshall (which I unfortunately sold), regardless whether it was in a rehearsal room, miced up in the control room or on stage. The same goes for my Tube Screamer, my DS1 and my CryBaby.
So, the best thing to say would be that software amps could work like some sort of "role model".

- The "famous" Henrdrix, SRV or whatever sounds were recorded under certain conditions. Worn in tubes, speakers, fancy mics and positionings, tapes used as a recording medium, etc etc.
None of the actual amp sims restores any of those conditions.
Let alone that for almost every great sounding Hendix recording there's a bad sounding one as well.

The funny thing I found out when fooling around with Guitar Rig 2: The "ideal" combinations of amps and speaker cabs usually didn't result in a sound I had in mind. For instance, I seem to prefer the Rectifier amp running through a tweed cabinet - something you clearly (or at least usually) wouldn't do in hardware land.
And fwiw, that's the bad thing about software amp simps. So far I haven't heard a single one that wouldn't require more or less massive tweaking to even halfway please me.

[scottedog]

Who gives a damn about presets? Build your own! Sound like you, not your favourite guitarist. There will only ever be one SRV, there will only ever be one YOU.
If your capable of building a hardware rig & can record it well, all the power to ya. I for one don't have the resources to do it & I REALLY like the convenience of AT2/GR2 or whatever else.
And yes, EVH would still sound like EVH thru SRV's rig. A lot of it is in the fingers...

[ew]

The funny thing I found out when fooling around with Guitar Rig 2: The "ideal" combinations of amps and speaker cabs usually didn't result in a sound I had in mind. For instance, I seem to prefer the Rectifier amp running through a tweed cabinet - something you clearly (or at least usually) wouldn't do in hardware land.

I hear you on that one, Sascha. And, I prefer the Tweedman going through a cutdown Rectifier cab to the tweed cab. In fact, the Tweedman with one of the distortion emus in front of it is a better high gain solution than either the JCM 800 or the Rectifier emu with a distortion front end or not, IMO

ew

[Sascha Franck]

I hear you on that one, Sascha. And, I prefer the Tweedman going through a cutdown Rectifier cab to the tweed cab.

Hah! Maybe I just mixed things up, but I'm, sure I used both combinations.

In fact, the Tweedman with one of the distortion emus in front of it is a better high gain solution than either the JCM 800 or the Rectifier emu with a distortion front end or not, IMO

Yeah, I can highly second that.

Another tip: If you're using the Rectifier for an overdriven sound, use the clean channel, turn the Variac up (to "bold"), Sag down (to "silicon") and turn Bias all the way right.
Then turn up the gain to, say, 2'o clock (careful, it's getting loud there), so it's getting kinda crunchy and add either a Distortion or a Skreamer for additional drive. Works fine for both rhythm and lead patches.

I actually found all the amps to sound and feel more realistic with most of the "vintaging" options (namely Variac and Bias) almost turned off and allready modified the default settings accordingly.

Ah, another one I like is running two Plexis with a splitter, use slightly different speakers, probably even add a 10-20 ms delay to one of them and pan them carefully.
In addition, I may use different boosts on the two (Skreamer for one, Treble Booster for the other seems to be a nice combination).
Makes up for a really fat crunchy to driven rhythm sound, and assuming you turned Variac and Bias close to their neutral settings, it'll react just nicely to your playing, pickup selection and whatever, you can clean the sound up easily by just using your volume pot.

[ew]

Another tip: If you're using the Rectifier for an overdriven sound, use the clean channel, turn the Variac up (to "bold"), Sag down (to "silicon") and turn Bias all the way right.
Then turn up the gain to, say, 2'o clock (careful, it's getting loud there), so it's getting kinda crunchy and add either a Distortion or a Skreamer for additional drive. Works fine for both rhythm and lead patches.

I actually found all the amps to sound and feel more realistic with most of the "vintaging" options (namely Variac and Bias) almost turned off and allready modified the default settings accordingly.

Yeah, I do that with the raw channel. Same settings in expert mode as you, but my gain's around 1'o clock because of the added gain. Use the Distortion in front of the amp only as a gain booster- distortion all the way down and gain anywhere from 3/4 to all the way up

Ah, another one I like is running two Plexis with a splitter, use slightly different speakers, probably even add a 10-20 ms delay to one of them and pan them carefully.
In addition, I may use different boosts on the two (Skreamer for one, Treble Booster for the other seems to be a nice combination).
Makes up for a really fat crunchy to driven rhythm sound, and assuming you turned Variac and Bias close to their neutral settings, it'll react just nicely to your playing, pickup selection and whatever, you can clean the sound up easily by just using your volume pot.

That one works well. Another that works well are ACs in stereo using the same ideas about distortion, delay and panning.

ew

[jpmarques]

Nice guidelines for GR2!

[Jonny Quest]

The rig's only half the story (if that)- the player's style, etc. is the other half. Stevie Ray would sound like Stevie Ray no matter what he was playing through. Same with Jimi...

And half of that half is the guitar itself.

Try playing a SRV signature riff/song on a Les Paul or an SG.

Try playing a Wes Montgomery tune on a Strat or Tele.

Try tapping Eruption on an ES-175.


I agree the Amplitube 'VIP' settings are as reliable as Radio Shack batteries. Some people crave these sort of prset reference points, which is the reason I imagine they include them. Unfortunately, if they were to use phrases to describe what they really sound like, it might be bad for business. Imagine these settings: "Tommy's Rat plugged into the direct box," "Doug's Roland Super Cube dropped in echo chamber" "Stevie Ray Olsen's Big Muff Project."

[Jason Brian Merrill]

I usually get better results making my own patches. Most all presets of guitar emus suck.

[Killvehicle]

Sascha

And fwiw, that's the bad thing about software amp simps. So far I haven't heard a single one that wouldn't require more or less massive tweaking to even halfway please me

I have been saying this for how long!?? BUt that is clearer,, I completely 200% agree that for a software sim to do any type of justice for me, I need to tweak the damn titties off the thing.,. And people tell me "you just dont understand the endless possibilities of software amp sims" (in my best twangy guitar dork voice)

And I say if the damn thing can't sound good from the box like say my Peavey 5150,, yes many of you might hate it,, but damn if I dont just need to plug in my guitar and go off. Isnt that what an amp is for?? Who wants to endlessly tweak an amp?? Not me anyhow, give me a good sound just by plugging in and thats the amp I want.. Although I have only found one to this date!! BUt a Jcm 800 with a Boss SD-1 before it gets damn close as well.. OK I will rephrase "If I cant get my sound from an amp and maybe an overdrive pedal then I dont want it"

But to the actual post, of course you cant USE the same rigs as so and so artist.. YOU DONT HAVE THE SAME RIG!!!!!! THis is software, they can claim any of their sims is the emulation of a Mesa or Fender or whatver,, that doesnt make it so, now does it??

[Jason Brian Merrill]

Who wants to endlessly tweak an amp??

AMEN BROTHER!!!!

thats what im talkin about!

--although i will say im happy with the sounds i get with my podxt -- but who really wants to sit there and tweak with a mouse forever?

[Sascha Franck]

but who really wants to sit there and tweak with a mouse forever?

Nobody. Especially when playing guitar, mouse tweaking sucks balls. On a real amp I can tweak some settings while a note sustains. Hardly possible with a mouse.
That's why I need some proper controller. Still, no controller on earth will give you that immediate feeling, especially in case the sound isn't right from the start.
And so far, with amp sims, it isn't.

[Cyprus]

Who gives a damn about presets? Build your own! Sound like you, not your favourite guitarist. There will only ever be one SRV, there will only ever be one YOU.
If your capable of building a hardware rig & can record it well, all the power to ya. I for one don't have the resources to do it & I REALLY like the convenience of AT2/GR2 or whatever else.
And yes, EVH would still sound like EVH thru SRV's rig. A lot of it is in the fingers...

In the fingers or in the brain?

Hendrix and SRV were extremely serious about the type of tone they had, don't think that SRV just picked up a vintage strat and a Twin Reverb by accident. TONE MATTERS, and I know of many amazing guitarists that in my opinion are destroyed by bad tone.

I'm a very good guitarist, but I know from personal experience that when I play through bad gear the audience's response to my music is very different than if I was playing through good gear. Yes, fingers, style, vibrato, phrasing, etc.. etc.. all matter, no doubt about it, but so does the equipment you're playing through.

If someone is looking for the tone of SRV doesn't necessarily mean that they're going to copy him musically. His tone was amazing, and would sound good from any good guitarist.