CSR - pants down

[cthmusic]

Most who own CSR have been using it for under 20 days while brok have been using aar for 20 years

this thread is great!

I don't usually use 7 second reverbs with the highs EQed out to test a reverb, but in this case, the AA is surely superior.

i think this is a mayor problem nowadays...people don't use their ears but their eyes...7 seconds sound like a lot and when you look at your gui you don't listen to the output of the setting, you pay too much attention on the numbers. it's the same thing with compressors and eqs, many people don't listen to what the sound might need, but look on their guis and decide because of nice looking curves and nice sounding numbers.

By far its all about using your ears

In my earlier examples, I didn't care about what settings Brok had used initially, I just tried to recreate that soundscape with my ears guiding me.

[sounddesigner]

Also to add to this, in order for a competition to truly be fair one of the competitors can't make the rules and supply the material because the competition is then skewd to his advantage and strenghths of his tool.I can easily go get uad's dreamverb wich is a rich reverb and say to all "match this thickness", and give them a file in wich the material used sounds well with dreamverb.We all know that one reverb is'nt good for all projects. i'd like to atleast see 3 different files used and let one be a slow singing female voice.Let someone who's not competing supply the material, and make rules that all agree on.
Most who own CSR have been using it for under 20 days while brok have been using aar for 20 years.If Brok brought his tweaking ability to csr and thoroughly learned it i'm sure he'll produce many great results with it.And yes uvacom if everyone would have had brok's settings they could've produced better results then they did, even those who used aar like brok did'nt get as good results as brok.

sounddesigner, i don't want to offend in any way, honestly ...
i think you missunderstood my initial intension, also i doubt that you read the whole thread, because then you 'd understood ...
all i wanted is to show a file where i think that this is the reverb i like, please someone top this with the csr, as i cannot demo it cause i don't have a dongle.
no more.
there was no competition, and over the evolving thread i stated this several times.
i have a good reverb.
now someone convince me to get anotherone, which is even better.
i thought that this could be the csr.
then the thread turned out to include other reverb units too.
as i am allways interrested i was happy that so many users posted their results, to give me a picture.
no comptetition ... no unfairness because _no competition_.
so, if you want:
just listen to the reverb i initially posted.
then tweak something (with any vst nonconvolution reverb)with my orginal file that you find better and post that.
no competition, just tastes and opinions for us to learn from each ...
all in peace ...

The last thing i want to do is argue,But the way the whole thing played out spelled competition.If i'm wrong then i apologize but in the future if you make claims aar is best and say things like i proved it then let there be a fair competition.
I don't want to offend anyone, your a great tweaker, and hopefully we have'nt gotten to know each other in a bad way.Did'nt mean to offend just giving my interpretation...Peace!

[brok landers]

i think you guys could dial up something on csr where i'd say "ok, i gotta have thatone", if it would've been that good ... thats how hope breaks into pices ...

Thing is, you're perfectly happy with AAR, right?

well, i for one am an open minded person, there is allways a next step that beats the previous ... i thought that this could be the csr, so i was hoping someone could top my example, then i'd knew ...
seriously, i don't stick with my software ... if there is something that convinces me, i'm with that ...

You might not even need CSR at all.

well, who knows?
i'm not ignorant, so if there comes a file fom somebody using the csr that blows me away i'd be instantly buying it ...

anyway, very interesting thread and involved discussion here. I like it.

yes, i am very happy with how this thread evolved thatfar ... not too natural on kvr these days ...

oh and about that hall sound. That's one end of its capability: too clear and pristine IMO. The other end has this weird wavey movement that I didn't like with your sound at all. Maybe I should've posted that as well, as we seem to have quite the different taste in reverbs.

no problem in any way, taste differs ...
however, thanks for your contribution, you also helped to make this thread very interresting!

[defjamm]

Most who own CSR have been using it for under 20 days while brok have been using aar for 20 years

this thread is great!

I don't usually use 7 second reverbs with the highs EQed out to test a reverb, but in this case, the AA is surely superior.

i think this is a mayor problem nowadays...people don't use their ears but their eyes...7 seconds sound like a lot and when you look at your gui you don't listen to the output of the setting, you pay too much attention on the numbers. it's the same thing with compressors and eqs, many people don't listen to what the sound might need, but look on their guis and decide because of nice looking curves and nice sounding numbers.

By far its all about using your ears

In my earlier examples, I didn't care about what settings Brok had used initially, I just tried to recreate that soundscape with my ears guiding me.

maybe you look at what i quoted and you'll understand what i mean . i said the same as you(it's all about ears).

[pethu]

i think this is a mayor problem nowadays...people don't use their ears but their eyes...7 seconds sound like a lot and when you look at your gui you don't listen to the output of the setting, you pay too much attention on the numbers. it's the same thing with compressors and eqs, many people don't listen to what the sound might need, but look on their guis and decide because of nice looking curves and nice sounding numbers.

Perhaps some who lack "golden ears" have "golden eyes" instead?

I'm afraid I have neither... Thankfully, I'm my own composer, so I can always claim things turned out exactly the way I intended them to!

[bmanic]

hey bmanic, thanks for the contribution, i'll do some further testing with your files ...
but coud you please try to match up or top my file with a csr reverbed one?
i'd be cery interrested!

Sorry, I don't own CSR nor do I have a dongle to start a demo. I was at Kingston's and did these renders.

I'm a happy AA reverb owner and that will have to do for a while. Personally I don't think CSR can replace AA reverb but neither can AA reverb replace CSR. In fact, they both seem to complement each other. Another interesting reverb seems to be the wizoo W5. It's algorithmic side might be better than I thought at first. Also, the quick quack rayverb could be a real gem if the developer would create a proper modulation section for it and more flexible damping settings (3 separate bands or more). Same goes for AA reverb. If the developers would just add one more "damping band" it would be superbly flexible.

Cheers!
bManic

[brok landers]

The last thing i want to do is argue,But the way the whole thing played out spelled competition.If i'm wrong then i apologize but in the future if you make claims aar is best and say things like i proved it then let there be a fair competition.
I don't want to offend anyone, your a great tweaker, and hopefully we have'nt gotten to know each other in a bad way.Did'nt mean to offend just giving my interpretation...Peace!

sounddesigner, of course i said that imo the artsacoustic reverb is better.
what should've i done, if the files posted did not reach the original reverbed file imo?
should i have left these posts unanswered, just because of the fact that i personally don't think they topped my initial file?
no, i don't think that this is the way.
i requested to top this initial file i posted.
up to now no other file did, allthough some were close.
i rather tried to explain why they did not, in order to make my subjective point more clear.
if you like any other reverb better, it's absolutely fine with me.
i tried to get an insight of other approaches, other opinions, other reverbed files to learn about all this, and to maybe
find an even better product to buy that suits my personal needs (there's allway something better, right? ).
this was the instension of this thread ....
no competition, just testing reverbs , like somebody else stated so fine: no strings attached ...

[bmanic]

Sounddesigner, I don't understand how you can see any of this as a competition. Everybody has just been stating opinions, nothing else. IMHO csr was very impressive indeed but does that make me try to compete somehow?? No. Do you have perhaps something personal to gain here or am I just being paranoid?

Cheers!
bManic

[brok landers]

hey bmanic, thanks for the contribution, i'll do some further testing with your files ...
but coud you please try to match up or top my file with a csr reverbed one?
i'd be cery interrested!

Sorry, I don't own CSR nor do I have a dongle to start a demo. I was at Kingston's and did these renders.

ahhh, that's sad ... i'd really hoped to hear that ... nevertheless, thanks for your files, which were indeed nice in another direction ...

I'm a happy AA reverb owner and that will have to do for a while. Personally I don't think CSR can replace AA reverb but neither can AA reverb replace CSR.

yes, it seems to turn out that they completely compliment each other, allthough i think that the csr has more vst competitors ... roomverb m2 comes to my mind ...
saying that i of course hav to state that i base my knowledge about the csr completely on opinions and userposted files ...
i'd really like to hear them _both_ in one mix ... maybe the csr for the short drumrooms and the aar for pads, vocals, well, everything that needs longer tails or a bigger sized room ...
shit ... i think i have to buy the csr only for this experiance ... well ... what do you expect from a stupid sounddesigner like me ...
however, i'd really again invite everyone again to try around with my original file ...
surprises are welcome, no matter what ...

[sounddesigner]

Sounddesigner, I don't understand how you can see any of this as a competition. Everybody has just been stating opinions, nothing else. IMHO csr was very impressive indeed but does that make me try to compete somehow?? No. Do you have perhaps something personal to gain here or am I just being paranoid?

Cheers!
bManic

I'm sorry but when i read a thread that says "CSR pants down" and then someone loads a file and says top this, my interpretation is he wants us to beat his example and if example is beaten then what ever reverb does it naturally is the better (wich means winner).it's not hard for someone to interpret top this as compete with this. maybe i need to read more posts on this forum to see how people operate but i don't see how my interpretation is so crazy.
maybe i would've thought differently if the statement was "just post some good files of csr so i can hear it" had been made, and not top this aar file" Plus if someone wants to see how good csr is then a fair opportunity has to be given so people can show him and others the strenghths of csr,and if he only wanted to see those particular characteristics that aar displayed it would've helped if settings to aar where originally given, then yes i would thought more along the lines of "he just want to truly hear how CSR sounds" But no settings where given at first then that leads me to believe he did'nt want anyone to match or reveal csr's capability but rather he just wanted to show the strenghths of aar.Then later the comment "aar is more musical and realistic is made" what is a new commer suppose to think?
I understand i might have stepped into a family affair, but i don't understand how my interpretation is seen as crazy, maybe i was wrong but i think there's enough statements made that justifies my assumption.And if i was wrong my apology was written-wich leads me to wonder why i'm still being attacked over this?Again i understand i might have stepped into a family affair but anyone not from around here i'm sure would understand my assumption.

P.S. No i have nothing to gain, i'm just a musician who loves his tools and CSR is one of them.

[uvacom]

the competition wasn't fair.

erm,

what competition? I thought we were just comparing reverbs here, with no strings attached. I know I was.

Just for the record, I don't really consider it a competition - I'm all for empirical evidence and the scientific method. Apparently you do consider it a competition though (irrespective of what you claim your perspective is) since your perspective makes the performance dependent on the programmer which is going to be necessarily adversarial to some degree, unless it's double-blind and nobody knows anybody else's performance. In this case it's not double-blind, so people end up trying to prove their 'verb chops with any plugin they choose instead of trying to use CSR to match the original recording.

[brok landers]

sounddesigner, just leave it, please ... you seem to be the only one who has understood that thread wrong. however, of course you have your right for your personal opinion, which we know now, we got your point.
i was explaining how the thread was meant to be, and i was clear.
i assume you understood. so please just agree with these terms.
thank you.

[sounddesigner]

sounddesigner, just leave it, please ... you seem to be the only one who has understood that thread wrong. however, of course you have your right for your personal opinion, which we know now, we got your point.
i was explaining how the thread was meant to be, and i was clear.
i assume you understood. so please just agree with these terms.
thank you.

It was squashed with me but bmanic replied after i stated "if i was wrong i apologize". What am i to do if others keep referring to me about my past statements and asking me if i have something to gain?Naturrally my assumption is they want me to reply and give a answer.Be fair and ask all to squash it for i have not kept anything going alone. I have no problem with you or anyone else here, and would love for this dispute to die, and hope others truly want the same thing.But to all- don't let this be some brotherhood gang-up because that is becomming my interpretation. I hope we can have great discussions in the future and that no bad blood is gained over this..Peace!

[Mikem]

I'm sorry but when i read a thread that says "CSR pants down" and then someone loads a file and says top this, my interpretation is he wants us to beat his example and if example is beaten then what ever reverb does it naturally is the better (wich means winner).it's not hard for someone to interpret top this as compete with this. maybe i need to read more posts on this forum to see how people operate but i don't see how my interpretation is so crazy.

You have to admit, the thread subject title is pretty inflammatory, regardless of the intent.

[brok landers]

mikem > no, it's just a little bit spikey ...
however, the topic just means that csr now has to let the pants down to show whats underneath ...
thats all ... if it's "big" underneath, great, i'm sold then, if it's not, then not ...
thats what i wanted to know with this thread and thats what the topic says ...
it's the cojones that i wanted to see/hear ...

ohhh ... i'm talking nonsens here now ... time to get some sleep ...