IDEA: Universal Project Standard

[.jon]

UPS?

Imagine a future where you could easily swap music projects with anybody, with any host and setup?

Your host would have an option "Export as UPS". It would create a file folder:

1. projectname.ups

General instructions for all ups-compatible hosts, a summary of the project: original host name & version , project name, author & authors comments, export date, total lenght, tempo, time sig and their changes, track count, and per track: track nr, track name, type (midi/audio/automation), track start/end times, instrument used, fx used...etc. This could be an xml-type file, readable with any text editor for those without ups-compliant software? The host should prompt for user to name tracks if not done before export.

2. proprietary project file (.trk, .cpr, .ext etc...)

3. wav/mp3 render of the whole project for reference

4. Track dump folder (wavs), each track as separate render aptly named including time data

5. MIDI dump folder (.mids), standard midi files named per track/whole song?

6. Patch dump folder (.fxp & .fxb) including used presets, named instrument.version.patchname.track#.fxp (quite long?)

7. Option to save used original audio source files into a subfolder "audio_src". Note difference between rendered tracks.

8. what else?

This projectname_ups folder could then be compressed with you favourite archiving utility and burnt on cd or sent over the net for anybody for collaboration or whatever.

I'm sure there are some issues, at least time sigs and automation should somehow be transformed into MIDI, but having "exported" projects from Cubase and Tracktion into eXT, I would love to use the good old computer to do the work for me. That's what they are for, right?

sunny days,

.jon

[.jon]

...got carried away and forgot the import part

Pressing "Import UPS project" would start loading the selected folder. When a missing VST instrument was found, you'd get a dialog:

Missing VST instrument "TriangleII" with patch "n00bass" for track "#3 Square bass line" - what would you like to do:

1. Import MIDI and choose substituting VSTi
2. Import only MIDI and connect with instrument later
3. Substitute with corresponding audio track

With missing fx, you would get an option to substitute with a VST or leave untreated.

Of course any other possible errors would be reported, and you could try to fix them manually by referring to the .ups file. For example time sig & tempo changes.

And the .ups file would include sample rate as well.

.jon

[arke]

i think thats a great idea ... I've been thinking of something similar as well.

[C00kie]

Since all hosts have specific features that would not fit into the generic specs, I think this would not work. Some hosts are linear, some modular, some pattern-based... It just doesn't fit.

[Warmonger]

I can see this working only if it's meant for a least-common-denominator export, and I certainly don't use my hosts in that manner. I've tried to come up with solutions, but I haven't got any real good ideas yet.

[John Vulich]

I'm reminded of a quote that I read, in an interview with some VSTi developer...

"Standards are good. We need more of them."

[.jon]

Oh this naturally a "least-common-denominator" thingy, for the precise reason C00kie expressed.

This would mean basic compatibility between hosts that support VST, MIDI and audio. I think many hosts support MIDI export/import and fxp files and rendering, and this would surely work between Cubase and eXT (which is mucho modular btw!), as I've done the steps manually with several projects. Almost killed me, all that exportimport

Dunno about pattern-bases hosts, never understood the benefits of that concept. Fruity, Orion, is Muzys/Luna one was well? You create patterns and arrange them? Yeah, this would probably not work with those

[Art Evans]

http://www.cuibono-soft.com/ - EDL convert - might be a step along the way?

[NoBrain2k]

Perhaps pattern based could export (perhaps by mixing each pattern down to a seperate loopable wav file and then arranging them in the "ups", or using midi) but not import?

[Angus_FX]

OMF does this already to some extent -- it's typically a feature on higher-end DAWs like Nuendo, PT etc., I think SONAR supports it as well now. It doesn't support plug-in settings at the moment because nobody is even agreed on what "the standard" plugin format is, and settings aren't interchangeable at host-level between different plugin formats even for the same plugin.

Would be nice if the major plugin APIs could support something like this -- wouldn't be difficult for them to do -- but it's one of those things that has more to do with politics than technology.

[jens]

I think SONAR supports it as well now.

since v2


Logic and I think also SX as well b.t.w.

[.jon]

http://www.cuibono-soft.com/ - EDL convert - might be a step along the way?

Yes, that's a similar idea, but I think sticking with basic file formats and native export/import would be more future-proof way of project sharing.

The principal idea here is to make something that stands time better than proprietary formats, make collaboration easier and could also be handy when switching hosts. Archiving your projects as ups would mean that you can re-open your projects even after 5 years, when your host developer has moved to Bahamas, committed platform-change again or Windows Gusto 2018 refuses to install your antiquated host anymore.

OMF does this already to some extent -- it's typically a feature on higher-end DAWs like Nuendo, PT etc., I think SONAR supports it as well now. It doesn't support plug-in settings at the moment because nobody is even agreed on what "the standard" plugin format is, and settings aren't interchangeable at host-level between different plugin formats even for the same plugin.

Yes, I've dealt a little with omfs between Protools and Finalcut, nice time-stamped audio files with non-destructive edits added. Very handy, though, when working with moving pictures (although that at least two years ago the "standard" was very loosely interpreted by dif. hosts), and I would love to see it extend to all hosts - after all the edits included in omf are very simple. Maybe omf could be the audio track part.

The MIDI part could also be OSC.

[Jason Brian Merrill]

time stamping is pretty important, which i love about samplitude

[HHaynes]

http://www.aafassociation.org/html/faq. ... ringFormat

2.3. Can AAF be used as a native file format?

Yes.

[aMUSEd]

I think you might get close to managing this by combining a host specific standard like EDL and OMF with an all inclusive plugin standard like NI's new KORE format.