Waves Over Priced? Maybe - Maybe not...

[sounddesigner]

I hear a lot about Waves being so high priced. I'm just a hobbyist at best. I looked at all that was out there and compared prices. For the small guy I see Waves as being reasonable.

Yes, I understand the Ilok issues.
Yes, I understand their individual plugs are high.
Yes, I understand their WUP is weird.
Yes, I understand some of their plugs are outdated.
Yes, I understand in the larger bundles there are some not-needed plugs

But…look below. I sought to compare comparable products for a small home studio to get by with the basic essentials. I understand you can do similar comparisons and I am not trying to wave the Waves banner or start any arguments here.

Kjaerhus has a nice full package - sounds are great but… no verb.
Gold Bundle - no verb
$427.00

Voxengo has many great plugs and variations in packages but to get all the essentials (EQ, comp, chorus/delay, limiter, verb, etc.) you could spend close to $450 or more - for example…

Pristine Space $118.00
The CurveEQ, Elephant, Soniform, Transmodder package $ 209.00
Analogflux $ 79.00
Marquis Comp $ 89.00
$ 495.00

Now look at a Waves combo package...

Waves Musicians Bundle II
Super Tap, Ren EQ, Ren Comp, RenVox, Doubler = $150.00
Waves Native Power Pack
Trueverb, Q10 EQ, DeEsser, L1 Ultramximizer+, S1 Stereo Imager, C1 Para Compander, IR-1 Verb, Raxx = $350.00
Ilok - $ 40.00

Total for Bundle II and Power Pack and Ilok is $540.00

Now - here Waves is reasonable - you get 13 useable plugs for just $100 more than the other 2 (depending on the variations).

And yes, I understand all ears are different.

Later

the information you posted is not all the way accurate, you wrote that the voxengo bundle of comparable plugs would be $495 and this is not necessarily true.You can email Aleksey for custome bundles and the more of his plugs you buy usually the better the deal.you would not be paying individual plugin prices (to my knowledge). you could never get a custome bundle from waves wich is one of their big flaws, your forced to buy a big bundle with many plugs you don't want at a high price to get the ones you do want. And the plugs that are cheap of waves that you do your comparison with (musicians bundles) are plugs i would'nt want.the plugs of waves that i like are C4 ($400),And the 3 plugs that are in the mastering bundle-linear phase equalizer,linear phase multi band,l2 for total of $599.instead of c4 (for $400)or mastering bundle ($599) i can get soniformer($50),harmonieq($89)Elephant ($69) for a total of about $210, but once i email Aleksey its possibly less.and i have more flexibility with those three voxengo's.Looking at it in that light voxengo's is by faaaar the better buy. i'm not interested in waves cheaper rcomp,req etc and really don't believe their comparable to voxengo's (imho).i do like however waves more expensive plugs but feel i can get a better buy with voxengo's and elsewhere, plus i just love the voxengo sound!

[RaelDWTW]

I can't even be bothered to read all the b.s. above. Waves is still the best. Nothing comes close. Nothing. But this is KVR. And whatever you ask, Voxengo and Kjaerhus will be the answer.

[sounddesigner]

I can't even be bothered to read all the b.s. above. Waves is still the best. Nothing comes close. Nothing. But this is KVR. And whatever you ask, Voxengo and Kjaerhus will be the answer.

I really don't see how pointing out c4 $400 cost compared to harmonieq,elephant,soniformer $210 is BS.That is if where looking at price, now if i made a statement like yours and said voxengo's is best period (as if all should agree) then it would be BS because any one with common sense knows much of sound quality judgement is subjective, some will prefer uad,some waves,some voxengo's etc.If your going to declare something best for everyone then give some good reasons why!

[RaelDWTW]

Price is never an issue. Waves still represents flawless sound quality. And - most importantly - simple operation. What else could anyone ask for?

[Killvehicle]

Price is never an issue. Waves still represents flawless sound quality. And - most importantly - simple operation. What else could anyone ask for?

Yeah, you were rigth on your other post stating this is KVR and Kjaerhus or Voxengo get a lot of attention, and Hell I give them attentiuon as well since I use their plugs,and I also have the Waves Diamond Bundle. For simplicity of use, you cant argue with Waves, each one of their plugs is superbly designed for effeciency and ease no doubt. But Flawless sound quality? First there is no such thing, but there are plugs easily on par with Waves. Although this copmparison between Waves and everything else has been made a million times. BUt believe it man there are better plugs than Waves. Although Waves isnt as overprices as they used to be expecially now that there bundles are actually containing plugs that are good and one would WANT.

And to some of the comparisons out there, I actually disagree with the George YOung W1 limiter being as good as the original L1 from Waves. At first I liked the W1, but it is just not as powerful, for lack of a better word..

IMO the Renn COmp has no equal, there of course is better comps on the market, but for shear everyday-sounds good on everything comp, the Renn comp. just rules,, I freakin love that comp. Blockfish, not even close, Vanilla Comp. meh its ok, Although I like the Kjarehus Classic comp quite a bit. My second most used comp.. And I will never get the Buzzroom Comps. hype, Maybe its the music I make but they add so much harshness it is not usable for me..

ANd i think the Waves reverbs sound FAR superior to any of those freebies listed. Although I do use and like Glaceverb quite a bit, but I dont find it good for bread and butter reverbs, more for special effect use of reverb..

[ATS]

please point me to the free plugs that are better than waves. Please tell me what plug exactly you are comparing it to so I can compare. TY

Waves spectrum analyzer thingie = Voxengo SPAN
Waves RCL = vanilla comp, blockfish, buzzroom betas etc.
Waves RenEQ = Posihfopit (which is far superior)
Waves L2 = TLS stuff and W1 like brok mentioned and also some buzzroom stuff
Waves Reverbs = Ambience, Kjaerhus Classic, Glace etc.
Waves S1 = Voxengo MSED + MDA stereo thingy

Bottom line:

Waves yadda yadda = Freeware yadda yadda yadda (usually superior)

Cheers!
bManic

I've tried a lot of those already and no way they are better than waves; not that I don't wish they were. But you have your opinion and I have mine and I know neither of us will change so...

[pough]

I must admit that when the Waves plugins I bought were working, I really liked how they sounded. But it wasn't very often that I could get them working, so now they're sitting on my shelf as a fine display of what kind of software not to bother buying. Thanks, Waves, for the crapshell and the PACE and the phone bill.

[ATS]

I must admit that when the Waves plugins I bought were working, I really liked how they sounded. But it wasn't very often that I could get them working, so now they're sitting on my shelf as a fine display of what kind of software not to bother buying. Thanks, Waves, for the crapshell and the PACE and the phone bill.

pough would you be interested in selling them? What is the transfer fee?

Thanks

[pough]

pough would you be interested in selling them? What is the transfer fee?

I'd love to, except they're relatively old versions and the transfer fee is something like $50 AND $100...

I own the 4.x versions of the Native Power Pack and the Ren Collection 2.
L1, C1, S1, Q10, TrueVerb, PAZ, DeEsser, SuperTap 2-Tap, IDR, RenVox, RenBass and RenDeEsser

[sounddesigner]

pough would you be interested in selling them? What is the transfer fee?

I'd love to, except they're relatively old versions and the transfer fee is something like $50 or $100...

Transfer fee is $150 wich is another bad thing about waves.

[Suspended In Dusk]

My 2 cents...

Waves plug-ins just work - they sound great on mostly everything... It's the "One-size fits all" paradigm... Not to mention that when it comes to GUI, they're in a league of their own.

Nevertheless, there are indeed some amazing free and cheap/relatively cheap plug-ins out there that sound even better for very specific task - though usually they won't work on everything the way Waves plugs do.

I rarely ever use Waves anymore these days, because I know that even though I could just use their RenComp on a track and get a great sound, in this particular case, Blockfish will work even better, or then it could be Classic Compressor... Same thing for delays - between the free RetroDelay and the Sonitus Delay that comes w/ Sonar, I get eveything I need. None of them covers as much ground on its own, but in certain specific areas, they are indeed way better than Waves. Considering that they're fairly cheap alternatives, I'd say it worth spending a bit of time learning to work with them and getting to know them.

[ATS]

pough would you be interested in selling them? What is the transfer fee?

I'd love to, except they're relatively old versions and the transfer fee is something like $50 or $100...

Transfer fee is $150 wich is another bad thing about waves.

ouch! anyhow I just got the musicians 2 bundle and I think it is an incredible value.

[sounddesigner]

Price is never an issue. Waves still represents flawless sound quality. And - most importantly - simple operation. What else could anyone ask for?

I did'nt name those three voxengo plugins because they look pretty or just because their cheaper. They are true workhorses and each have serious strenghths that can be labeled as incontrovertable when compared to many other plugs. Soniformer is a 50 band surgically precise compressor that does stereo widening and other special effects.It has a very mild sound that does not go on your audio too strong making it suitable for mixing and mastering.Its flexibility is unmatched by waves compressors and incontrovertably others aswell. flexibility is often key in sound quality.i like to tailor my compression too the needs of my tracks.Most of voxengo's compressor have a great deal of flexibility in some way wich is one of the reason i said they have to be compared with waves more expensive ones (marquis is flexible).
Harmonieq is a eq thats closer to transparency then most vst eq's out here, altho many may love the coloration of various eq's- if we measure transparency i'm quite sure harmonieq will out do most (aswell as has a nice unique sound also depending on mode used).Elephant will allow a few db's more limiting then most limiters without producing ugly pumping,and seriously smashed sound.
I think the best in transparency,flexibility,price etc can be proven as to where sound quality is more subjective.but as far as sound quality i think voxengo's sound great (personal preference and i don't expect all to agree they sound better then their favorite brands).

[ATS]

Price is never an issue. Waves still represents flawless sound quality. And - most importantly - simple operation. What else could anyone ask for?

I did'nt name those three voxengo plugins because they look pretty or just because their cheaper. They are true workhorses and each have serious strenghths that can be labeled as incontrovertable when compared to many other plugs. Soniformer is a 50 band surgically precise compressor that does stereo widening and other special effects.It has a very mild sound that does not go on your audio too strong making it suitable for mixing and mastering.Its flexibility is unmatched by waves compressors. flexibility is often key in sound quality.i like to tailor my compression too the needs of my tracks.Most of voxengo's compressor have a great deal of flexibility in some way wich is one of the reason i said they have to be compared with waves more expensive ones (marquis is flexible).
Harmonieq is a eq thats closer to transparency then most vst eq's out here, altho many may love the coloration of various eq's- if we measure transparency i'm quite sure harmonieq will out do most (aswell as has a nice unique sound also depending on mode used).Elephant will allow a few db's more limiting then most limiters without producing ugly pumping,and seriously smashed sound.
I think the best in transparency,flexibility,price etc can be proven as to where sound quality is more subjective.but as far as sound quality i think voxengo's sound great (personal preference and i don't expect all to agree they sound better then their favorite brands).

I use several voxengo plugs and am very happy with them for the most part. I haven't tried harmonieq yet but will now that I read your post.

[sounddesigner]

Price is never an issue. Waves still represents flawless sound quality. And - most importantly - simple operation. What else could anyone ask for?

I did'nt name those three voxengo plugins because they look pretty or just because their cheaper. They are true workhorses and each have serious strenghths that can be labeled as incontrovertable when compared to many other plugs. Soniformer is a 50 band surgically precise compressor that does stereo widening and other special effects.It has a very mild sound that does not go on your audio too strong making it suitable for mixing and mastering.Its flexibility is unmatched by waves compressors. flexibility is often key in sound quality.i like to tailor my compression too the needs of my tracks.Most of voxengo's compressor have a great deal of flexibility in some way wich is one of the reason i said they have to be compared with waves more expensive ones (marquis is flexible).
Harmonieq is a eq thats closer to transparency then most vst eq's out here, altho many may love the coloration of various eq's- if we measure transparency i'm quite sure harmonieq will out do most (aswell as has a nice unique sound also depending on mode used).Elephant will allow a few db's more limiting then most limiters without producing ugly pumping,and seriously smashed sound.
I think the best in transparency,flexibility,price etc can be proven as to where sound quality is more subjective.but as far as sound quality i think voxengo's sound great (personal preference and i don't expect all to agree they sound better then their favorite brands).

I use several voxengo plugs and am very happy with them for the most part. I haven't tried harmonieq yet but will now that I read your post.

If you do demo harmonieq make sure you check out softp sound in linearphase mode (click the small ? in the upper corner of gui for linear mode).