Nativi Instruments Guitar Rig 2 - is awesome!!

[VaiHalen]

no drama...jusy expressing my grief that everyone of these subjective threads turns into the same thing...the original poster likes GR2...that's awesome...unfortunately too many people puff out their chest and have to explain why he is wrong

Not quite, the original poster decided that GR2 is great without testing AT2 and in his words he doesn't need to.
As someone who used both I felt the need to point out that in my opinion he is wrong.

but you didn't fit the profile of what I was speaking about...in fact cudos to you because you tried to start the thread off the way it should go by saying "in your opinion"...you didn't make a proclamation of being infallible...I'm like you, I'm going to try most things...but I wont try AT2 only because I don't want to buy a dongle to do so, especially when I have a preconceived bias...I might go up to GC sometime and try it, or perhaps one day my ilok can be coded...or maybe I will get something one day with the same dongle...but I won't lie...I'm still totally biased against using a pluggin based solution because I want to conserve my cpu and even the slightest latency gets perceived by me as a bad thing...my perception likely is dead wrong, but it's a part of who I am...

It is not about ampsims, but about attitude and knowledge. It would be just the same if someone with nickname "MilesArmstrong" would claim he has a greatest trumpet in the world, even he paid just 300 bucks in a local store for it, and that what he plays with it is soundwise undistinguishable from trumpet Miles Davis played... poor stupid musicians having to spend all this money because of their ignorance. Or that he is using antares mic modeller and there is no need for Neumann because his sm58 sounds EXACTLY like any Neumann with Mic Modeller. His friend also listened to his vocal with mic modeller and to real Neumann and couldn't hear the difference...

So it is about immaturity of a person, and when I see it in real life, sometimes I may ignore it, sometimes not, but I think if someone has wrong idea because of their lack of knowledge and experience, it is not personal attack at them or tools they use if someone comments on that. It does not makes my penis bigger, but it may help other person get more realistic about it if other people tell him the truth.
If it is all great would be much more simple for this guy to post 3 min audio clip with all those amazing presets and make our jaws hit the floor, instead of elaborating on theory that Marty Friedman is retarded because of wasting time on micing amps instead of just using Guitar Rig... I mean, it is all the same right? No one sees the difference
I am giving guitar lessons a lot and I often meet young cocky guitar players coming with all sorts of "innovative" theories without any real knowledge and expertise so maybe it is just me becoming too reactive on this sort of stuff.

Hey damn stupid, I just say I have a preset that sound like Marty Friedman tone in a song. Well, even if the sound is not exactly because my ears are not so good, well, it's very good anyway. I'm getting bored of your attacks.

[Hink]

no drama...jusy expressing my grief that everyone of these subjective threads turns into the same thing...the original poster likes GR2...that's awesome...unfortunately too many people puff out their chest and have to explain why he is wrong

Not quite, the original poster decided that GR2 is great without testing AT2 and in his words he doesn't need to.
As someone who used both I felt the need to point out that in my opinion he is wrong.

but you didn't fit the profile of what I was speaking about...in fact cudos to you because you tried to start the thread off the way it should go by saying "in your opinion"...you didn't make a proclamation of being infallible...I'm like you, I'm going to try most things...but I wont try AT2 only because I don't want to buy a dongle to do so, especially when I have a preconceived bias...I might go up to GC sometime and try it, or perhaps one day my ilok can be coded...or maybe I will get something one day with the same dongle...but I won't lie...I'm still totally biased against using a pluggin based solution because I want to conserve my cpu and even the slightest latency gets perceived by me as a bad thing...my perception likely is dead wrong, but it's a part of who I am...

It is not about ampsims, but about attitude and knowledge. It would be just the same if someone with nickname "MilesArmstrong" would claim he has a greatest trumpet in the world, even he paid just 300 bucks in a local store for it, and that what he plays with it is soundwise undistinguishable from trumpet Miles Davis played... poor stupid musicians having to spend all this money because of their ignorance. Or that he is using antares mic modeller and there is no need for Neumann because his sm58 sounds EXACTLY like any Neumann with Mic Modeller. His friend also listened to his vocal with mic modeller and to real Neumann and couldn't hear the difference...

So it is about immaturity of a person, and when I see it in real life, sometimes I may ignore it, sometimes not, but I think if someone has wrong idea because of their lack of knowledge and experience, it is not personal attack at them or tools they use if someone comments on that. It does not makes my penis bigger, but it may help other person get more realistic about it if other people tell him the truth.
If it is all great would be much more simple for this guy to post 3 min audio clip with all those amazing presets and make our jaws hit the floor, instead of elaborating on theory that Marty Friedman is retarded because of wasting time on micing amps instead of just using Guitar Rig... I mean, it is all the same right? No one sees the difference
I am giving guitar lessons a lot and I often meet young cocky guitar players coming with all sorts of "innovative" theories without any real knowledge and expertise so maybe it is just me becoming too reactive on this sort of stuff.

Again Vervil, you are another one that doesn't fit the profile of what I was talking about...I was venting at the people like you describe as cocky...except these people (and thankfully it's damn few) do have real knowledge and expertise...yet they absolutely refuse to believe that everyone can have something positive to offer...instead they act like we should thank all mighty whatever that they grace our humble forum with their presence.

Take for instance the time we talked about the EMGs...it was clear that you took my comment "put the 85 in the bridge where it belongs" as it was meant..it was a flip comment and not saying that's the only way (I can see how limited minds think it was, but you didn't), but it was designed for the neck and I was sarcastically suggesting you might get better results. Then you explained why you wanted it the bridge and that was all there was to it, it made perfect sense to me...until someone else decided to jump in and make an issue out of it. From that one exchange I could see you weren't the type to make a personal issue about things.

You're right though it's not about sims, that's for sure. Knowledge is the greatest gift, I once asked the question with a thread "would you rather be right or learn something new?"...funny how that thread just disapeared with few responses...but some things are not about right and wrong, some things are about different perspectives...closed minded people tie their own noose when it comes to this, but then if someone wants to share their knowledge with me and not take anything from me it doesn't effect me in any negative way ...so perhaps I'm a little too rigid on on those who always just assume they are right and everyone else is wrong. If I'm wrong I want to know about it, and I have imo proven that I try to recognize my errs and own up to them...if there's another perspective I'm not aware of I want to know about it too...but if I decide that perspective doesn't fit my needs (and it may in the future, I never say never) I think it's a shame that there are few egotistical people that have to turn that into a reason for an attack.

I often think about high school and how everyone was right about how to play songs...myself included...the arguments, the time wasted...friendships that could of been that went down the tubes over nothing fights...for what? As it turns out in many cases none of us were close to right..when I grew and discovered alternate tunings this was repeated often as I discovered the truth about songs...but what was even more important wasn't learning the songs properly, I realized what other important things I learned even if I wasn't playing "Smoke on the Water" right...I did learn what music meant to me.

Then almost 30 years since I graduated high school I come here to have people again telling me I don't play right, my tone is wrong...telling me that because I'm not a professional I could not understand...but my passion is for my art, not money...oh well I could ramble on about this all day because pretentious self appointed experts give artists a black eye, and I find it so sad. If when I put my guitar down if I'm on a natural high and feeling good about life and myself I'm not even sure that it matters how well or how poorly I have played, it's about how I feel.

But alas one person here who is well respected by many actually reduced that to a difference between professionals and people who play just for fun. In fact I do not play "just for fun", I play because it's my passion, part of my being, what makes me, me. I know you understand that point...too bad other people can't, guess it's that maturity thing...because out of everything I've learned from music that is the number one lesson...and though it took me time to learn it was well, when I did life has never been the same and my passion grows everyday and it doesn't just apply to music...even if I'm not an idol..I'm just a rock and roll guitar player who loves what he does, that's good enough for me...

[Jason Brian Merrill]

I'm confused. Why are you relying on another guitarist and not trying out the demos? Is it because of the "dongle" USB thing?

Yes, I'm not going to buy a dongle just 30 AT2 starts or 10 days. A demo that cost you money? come on...

you are right about that one, bro !!!

dongles suck!!!

[Vervil]

Hey damn stupid, I just say I have a preset that sound like Marty Friedman tone in a song. Well, even if the sound is not exactly because my ears are not so good, well, it's very good anyway. I'm getting bored of your attacks.

Well you may feel attacked because of what I have said or you may reconsider your cocky attitude. As I have said if you have posted few great sounding clips sounding BETTER than what people usualy do with guitar sims, including your incredible Marty Friedman lead preset than there would be no need for me to comment. Or I would comment how great your clips are!
Even if I am posting rarely I am reading KVR forum on regular basis, and I can recall you posting one audio clip, claiming it sounds just like Van Halen, and becoming very defensive when some people commented it does not sounds like VH in a lot of ways. So I have reacted knowing that you don't have realistic picture of what you can really do, and knowing that you are have high opinion about yourself. I am not that sure that you have needed knowledge and experience to say that this tone is similar to that tone... At least you are the one that makes yourself look like a cocky teenager. So as I am (probably, I may be also making mistake) older than you, and being where you are at your age, I am speaking not as an enemy, but as someone that knows when to talk, and when to shut up and listen. If you want to be taken seriously, be sure that you know really enough about the matter that interests you. This may look like I have "Hollier than thou" attitude and you may even take it as one more attack and use more bad words, but actually I am just giving you a pice of advice, as I have few guys a week coming on class with similar attitude as yours, stating facts they do not know enough about.

Again I am not bashing GR2 as a tool, if it works for you great, if you have made presets you like, great, but man, "I have same sound as guitarist xxx on my guitar processor"... It is so boring, I have heard that so many times.

On the other hand I am still interested to hear Sascha Franck mp3's of GR2 presets when he gets some spare time

Take for instance the time we talked about the EMGs...it was clear that you took my comment "put the 85 in the bridge where it belongs" as it was meant..it was a flip comment and not saying that's the only way (I can see how limited minds think it was, but you didn't), but it was designed for the neck and I was sarcastically suggesting you might get better results. Then you explained why you wanted it the bridge and that was all there was to it, it made perfect sense to me...until someone else decided to jump in and make an issue out of it. From that one exchange I could see you weren't the type to make a personal issue about things.

No I am not... Most of the times. And you look like a nice guy to me. On the other hand some people just don't click together, and words look different on screen, without chance to hear intonation of voice, and see gestures. I know at what person you are pointing at. It is fact that atmosphere at KVR is not that nice like it used to be before, but even if person you are talking about has a more of "aggressive style" of expressing itself, it does not means in turn that his intentions are bad.

You're right though it's not about sims, that's for sure. Knowledge is the greatest gift, I once asked the question with a thread "would you rather be right or learn something new?

Well said. I guess anyone can become rigid and closed for other opinions in his own field of expertise, so it may be a part of the problem. We get used to that we know better than anyone else in one field, people het used to us as "experts", but on internet, people are more anonymous. For instance I may be amking great mistake and Vaihalen is 45 years old shred metal veteran and will post few clips that will sound just great... Not that it can't happen. It is just important that people stay open to admit mistake and update their opinions.

Although, Hink you still are kind of same like in your high school years and you do love to argue about lot of stuff, at least here There is no need to take someones opinion so close to your heart, and it seems that this few things said here to you, you keep dragging from thread to thread... it is not that important. If you have your integrity and if you know why you play than it is all that matters, opinions of other people are not something that can define your being.

Cheers!

[Hink]

Although, Hink you still are kind of same like in your high school years and you do love to argue about lot of stuff, at least here There is no need to take someones opinion so close to your heart, and it seems that this few things said here to you, you keep dragging from thread to thread... it is not that important. If you have your integrity and if you know why you play than it is all that matters, opinions of other people are not something that can define your being.

I have to disagree some there...first maybe I do carry an issue from one thread to another, but not even half as often as it's thrown back up at me and it's someone else carrying it over. I do not argue, I debate...I believe debates are fantastic tools for learning and discovery...an argument would likely mean I was not making room for the chance I might be wrong and I'm taking a firm stance. Where as with a debate I express my opinion (sometimes strongly) and actually listen to the other side...when all is said and done being right or wrong pales in comparison to the possible knowledge gained by all.

Similarly, having decided years ago that the best focus for me and my artistic direction is a road probably best traveled alone due to other commitments in my life (that's not say completely alone, kvr bears witness to that). That's a tough road because objectivity is quickly sacrificed. So when receiving criticism I do take it to heart, that doesn't mean badly, but I do have to consider that negative criticism may in fact be correct. It's harder for one to see the flaws in themselves than in others.

That brings in a whole new consideration, motivation. If it's criticism from someone I really respect, it's easy to spot that it's likely wise to give that criticism merit. If it comes from someone who is attacking with swears, insults and anger often you will find the criticism may not have much merit (though it's still worthy of some consideration)...then there's the criticism that falls in the grey area, thoughtful suggestions from people you are reasonably sure don't care much for you, criticisms from people you respect but throw in an "out of place" hurtful comment. Those all create confusion and yes growing may mean taking things to heart. In order to grow I need to examine all the evidence and hopefully choose the right facts for me. But it can be difficult to determine what the motivation is...I always hope that I will get the same respect I give, but I've come not to expect it.

I'm saddened when someone I respect doesn't care for me, that's human and I'd be lying if I said other wise. But sometimes it's just not going to work. At the same time, when someone doesn't treat me with the same respect I treat them, that offends me. I wont stand offended, I will defend myself and my dignity. Again, that's human.

So you're wrong about me being like I was in high-school...I don't fear being wrong and I feel no shame in being wrong, in fact I know when I'm wrong 'm actually better for having been so. Being right is a hollow victory, it strokes the ego. But I can do that by playing, I can do that by taking pride in what selfless acts I am doing 24/7, I can do that by looking in the eyes of my children and grandchildren...if I want to stroke my ego there are plenty of ways.

But when I'm wrong it's not about ego, it is selfish (and it's okay), it's all about what new thing I have learned. So I cannot loose a debate, if I'm wrong I have lost nothing, but gained knowledge...in fact it could be said that the only person that walks away from a debate empty handed is the winner (unless of course he's smart enough to listen too)...

[hoffy]

f**k all of you.

[VaiHalen]

Vervil, do you try to help me? You call me cooky, poor stupid musician, ignorant etc When I posted the Van Halen sound I did take good note of people commentaries and the preset was improved thanks to those commentaries. I never have being cooky about myself, I never say what great guitar player I am; just wanted to share my euphoria with others about how much I enjoy GR2.
You are very arrogant and rude in your answer. I not consider myself a stupid ignorant. Hey I did write a classic piano composition! lol
I'm trying to get the guitar solo tablature of Symphony of destruction, so I could post the tone I'm talking about (hard solo btw). And please, I would like to read commentaries and ways to improve it.

[Vervil]

Hink, I have read your post, and I can understand from where you are coming from, but man, this is just internet... you have probably heard a thousand times anything I could comment about this, so I will just say, live and let go!
Cheers!

Vervil, do you try to help me? You call me cooky, poor stupid musician, ignorant etc

Nope. It was a sarcasm, "Poor stupid musicians that does not know secret like you and have to use expensive amps instead of just plugging into GR". Also I don't recall I have said "You are ignorant" specifically. Although what I do think, is that it is ignorant to talk about something and insist on our point even if no one is taking notice, and even if we can't back it up with results. So in my opinion, you were acting ignorant, but it does not makes you bad guy. It is not personal attack if someone says to you "Man, you are acting ignorant, don't do that". At least if you are ready to accept possibility of not being right.

When I posted the Van Halen sound I did take good note of people commentaries and the preset was improved thanks to those commentaries. I never have being cooky about myself, I never say what great guitar player I am; just wanted to share my euphoria with others about how much I enjoy GR2.

Posting few times in a row and insisting how your ton is sooooo great, that it there is no difference from listening to you playing song and some legendary guitarist is not cocky???
Man it was not about euphoria, you were insisting how it is great to have 50000$ of equipment in a plugin and that there is no difference in sound. It is just plain ridiculous. But I would just probably let it pass if you were not constant about it, insisting that this is fact. There are two possibilities: You are right and Marty Friedman is an idiot because he needs expansive amps to get this sound, and second you are wrong, cocky and do not understand the matter.
Finally it is easy to post here at K-V-R and say things like that because people here LOVE plugins, and the way they work gives in their eyes plugins a certain adventage. They are ready to close their eyes at some imperfections of software because it gives them some adventages... Not everyone can mic an amp at home, or buy messa boogie head. So having amp sim is CHEAP SUBSTITUTION, that can trick the listener and work in a lot of cases, and it is great to have those tools, naturally. But this is plugins site. Post at prosound or at andysneaps place or anywhere else where people are serious about recording guitars, and you will see that reactions will be similar like mine, and maybe even not that polite.

You are very arrogant and rude in your answer. I not consider myself a stupid ignorant. Hey I did write a classic piano composition! lol

If someone says something that is plain wrong and insists on that because of irrational belief in its own qualities, (or because of excess of hormons in blood caused by Guitar Rig Euphoria (C)) I have to say something in defence of common sense. You have defined your knowledge by your own words, not me. I know that you dont know enough because you have explained yourself in that way.

I'm trying to get the guitar solo tablature of Symphony of destruction, so I could post the tone I'm talking about (hard solo btw). And please, I would like to read commentaries and ways to improve it.
Vai Halen

Going off topic:
I have seen one guitar player recently (a good one) playing that song with band... He made it hard even if it can be played more simple, he was struggling to play it right.
I don't have original tab book (although there are no guarantees that positions and tabs are right even in official tabs) but I have seen some tabs floating around on web, and they are hard to play because some phrases are tabbed wrongly. Even if that is the way Marty plays this solo, there is easier way. Just be sure that second part of the solo is played like you would play some blues licks, on two adjenced strings, picking higher string, puling off, and then picking adjenced lower string, then you just shift notes and positions. So it is not that hard, at least not as some other stuff.

[Hink]

Vervil, first I do live and let go, you really have no clue about my personal life and what's going on with me, the internet might actually mean more to me than you...and that's okay believe it or not.

Perhaps you believe "it's just the internet" and I can totally agree to a point...but I also can see that is somewhat narrowminded point of view as well, and a tad thoughtless..the internet is what you make of it...yeah it can be "just the internet" and that's fine...but then why bother with it if that's how you feel?...it also can be a tremendous tool for promotion, education, entertainment and communication...I myself try to get the most out of everything I do...So I dont care if it's the internet, my hometown, a club, driving on the roads, disrespect is not acceptable, and I really wish more people felt the same way... "just the internet" is a poor excuse for being disrespectful imo...in fact I contend that people who can have a reputation of being respectful most of the time on the internet (nobody is perfect) are also probably pretty respectful in the physical world, those who are disrespectful on a regular basis on the internet probably have issues in the real world...so if you feel people have the right to be disrespectful on the internet because it's just the internet I wonder what other times you feel being disrespectful is okay...too me it's never. I believe in carrying myself with pride and honor where ever I go...even on "just the internet"...

If someone says something that is plain wrong and insists on that because of irrational belief in its own qualities, (or because of excess of hormons in blood caused by Guitar Rig Euphoria (C)) I have to say something in defence of common sense. You have defined your knowledge by your own words, not me. I know that you dont know enough because you have explained yourself in that way.

Gee that would make perfect sense and I totally agree if it weren't for...

Hink, I have read your post, and I can understand from where you are coming from, but man, this is just internet... you have probably heard a thousand times anything I could comment about this, so I will just say, live and let go!
Cheers!

don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to start anything and I'll leave it with this...a little consistancy would be nice...

[VaiHalen]

Uf english is not my language but I'll do the best I can. With your tales about MilesAmstrong etc etc you were alluding me and read this is not very nice. I think know you are right and it's not possible to get the same tone from a 400$ plugin that from thousands in gear and professional studio work. But damn, I swear GR2 is fooling my ears! I have some presets for vintage Marshall style and OMG they are pretty good; Paul Gilbert's kind tone? Yes! I get it. But, again I'm sure now, after reading you, that it cant be true. But the tones I get are in most cases better than what you get with the average amp. At least I think so.

About the tablatures, yes, I got some but they are wrong. If you get some fine, please let me know.

[Vervil]

Vervil, first I do live and let go, you really have no clue about my personal life and what's going on with me, the internet might actually mean more to me than you...and that's okay believe it or not.

Perhaps you believe "it's just the internet" and I can totally agree to a point...but I also can see that is somewhat narrowminded point of view as well, and a tad thoughtless..the internet is what you make of it...yeah it can be "just the internet" and that's fine...but then why bother with it if that's how you feel?...it also can be a tremendous tool for promotion, education, entertainment and communication...I myself try to get the most out of everything I do...So I dont care if it's the internet, my hometown, a club, driving on the roads, disrespect is not acceptable, and I really wish more people felt the same way... "just the internet" is a poor excuse for being disrespectful imo...in fact I contend that people who can have a reputation of being respectful most of the time on the internet (nobody is perfect) are also probably pretty respectful in the physical world, those who are disrespectful on a regular basis on the internet probably have issues in the real world...so if you feel people have the right to be disrespectful on the internet because it's just the internet I wonder what other times you feel being disrespectful is okay...too me it's never. I believe in carrying myself with pride and honor where ever I go...even on "just the internet"...

If someone says something that is plain wrong and insists on that because of irrational belief in its own qualities, (or because of excess of hormons in blood caused by Guitar Rig Euphoria (C)) I have to say something in defence of common sense. You have defined your knowledge by your own words, not me. I know that you dont know enough because you have explained yourself in that way.

Gee that would make perfect sense and I totally agree if it weren't for...

Hink, I have read your post, and I can understand from where you are coming from, but man, this is just internet... you have probably heard a thousand times anything I could comment about this, so I will just say, live and let go!
Cheers!

don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to start anything and I'll leave it with this...a little consistancy would be nice...

Hehehehehe LOL! You do love to argue! ...I am consistent. Your argument with killvehicle is dragging around thru several threads, so I am telling you "Just let it go" because it is obvious that
a) you two are too different to get along
b) it is something that you keep on arguing about.

It's not worth it.

On the other hand, in case of VaiHalen and me, it is just this thread and as you see it is finished, it was not like I am constantly pushing the guy for no reason etc. I do have my ideals, things I will stand for and argue about with anyone, but I am choosing my battles. I would never argue with killvehicle on your place, and vice versa, with you on killvehicles place, because it is obvious that nothing good can come from it. I am spending some of my time by helping young cocky guitarists too to become great young cocky guitarists, you know

I agree about internet stuff, etc, what you have told at the beginning of your post, but again, we should choose our battles. You are not moderator here. This is not your site... It is not your role here to make it better place. You have responsability in your private circle, and this forum is not that. What is possilibity that you can change anything for real here? It is noble idea, but you have to put yourself in certain position to make a change.
As far as your private life goes, yes, you may have some problems I am not aware of... I don't have any clue. I may have also some problems you are not aware of. But I do not think that principle of choosing your battles, choosing when and where to invest our energy to make most of it is dependent on life situation. So even if I agree with what you say...theoretically, and even if I think that I share a lot of views with you, maybe you could save yourself from hassle of arguing in a way that just wastes your time and energy...

Cheers again Hink!

[Vervil]

Uf english is not my language but I'll do the best I can. With your tales about MilesAmstrong etc etc you were alluding me and read this is not very nice. I think know you are right and it's not possible to get the same tone from a 400$ plugin that from thousands in gear and professional studio work. But damn, I swear GR2 is fooling my ears! I have some presets for vintage Marshall style and OMG they are pretty good; Paul Gilbert's kind tone? Yes! I get it. But, again I'm sure now, after reading you, that it cant be true. But the tones I get are in most cases better than what you get with the average amp. At least I think so.

About the tablatures, yes, I got some but they are wrong. If you get some fine, please let me know.

Yes I was aluding at you. That was because I was thinking that your behaviour is not very nice Yes you can get better tone gr2 than you would get with some cheap amp and microphone, so if you don't have means to do it like big guys, you can make nice recording with guitar rig, why not?
About tablature, I will check what I have here, and will PM you if I find tabbed version of solo that is ok, no problem.

[VaiHalen]

Still I cant see why you thinked my behavoir is not nice. I cant understand why you dont see a good thing that someone is glad with his guitar tone and wants to share it with others. His opinion can be wrong but that is not excuse to bash him. But well, you said your reasons to do that. Cooky for tryng to emulate Van Halen sound?? You are wrong; I admire the damn Van Halen! It's a tone and guitar playing well known and for this reason I posted a try (good try) of gettin his tone. Are you visited my songclick page? Do you think the tones in the Quenn cover, the Van Halen 2, the Gary Moore tracks are bad? I think they are good, very good. I'm always talking about tone, not my playing. And maybe others can enjoy this plugin like I do.
Maybe you live in a very competitive and paranoid world, where everybody wants be number one?!

And thanks for the tablature, I almost have figured out the solo but the end of the first part, the arpeggio where Marty accelerate the playing (Marty's old technic to create a great sense of speed) it's the most hard to me to figure out.

[Hink]

Vervil, first I do live and let go, you really have no clue about my personal life and what's going on with me, the internet might actually mean more to me than you...and that's okay believe it or not.

Perhaps you believe "it's just the internet" and I can totally agree to a point...but I also can see that is somewhat narrowminded point of view as well, and a tad thoughtless..the internet is what you make of it...yeah it can be "just the internet" and that's fine...but then why bother with it if that's how you feel?...it also can be a tremendous tool for promotion, education, entertainment and communication...I myself try to get the most out of everything I do...So I dont care if it's the internet, my hometown, a club, driving on the roads, disrespect is not acceptable, and I really wish more people felt the same way... "just the internet" is a poor excuse for being disrespectful imo...in fact I contend that people who can have a reputation of being respectful most of the time on the internet (nobody is perfect) are also probably pretty respectful in the physical world, those who are disrespectful on a regular basis on the internet probably have issues in the real world...so if you feel people have the right to be disrespectful on the internet because it's just the internet I wonder what other times you feel being disrespectful is okay...too me it's never. I believe in carrying myself with pride and honor where ever I go...even on "just the internet"...

If someone says something that is plain wrong and insists on that because of irrational belief in its own qualities, (or because of excess of hormons in blood caused by Guitar Rig Euphoria (C)) I have to say something in defence of common sense. You have defined your knowledge by your own words, not me. I know that you dont know enough because you have explained yourself in that way.

Gee that would make perfect sense and I totally agree if it weren't for...

Hink, I have read your post, and I can understand from where you are coming from, but man, this is just internet... you have probably heard a thousand times anything I could comment about this, so I will just say, live and let go!
Cheers!

don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to start anything and I'll leave it with this...a little consistancy would be nice...

Hehehehehe LOL! You do love to argue! ...I am consistent. Your argument with killvehicle is dragging around thru several threads, so I am telling you "Just let it go" because it is obvious that
a) you two are too different to get along
b) it is something that you keep on arguing about.

It's not worth it.

On the other hand, in case of VaiHalen and me, it is just this thread and as you see it is finished, it was not like I am constantly pushing the guy for no reason etc. I do have my ideals, things I will stand for and argue about with anyone, but I am choosing my battles. I would never argue with killvehicle on your place, and vice versa, with you on killvehicles place, because it is obvious that nothing good can come from it. I am spending some of my time by helping young cocky guitarists too to become great young cocky guitarists, you know

I agree about internet stuff, etc, what you have told at the beginning of your post, but again, we should choose our battles. You are not moderator here. This is not your site... It is not your role here to make it better place. You have responsability in your private circle, and this forum is not that. What is possilibity that you can change anything for real here? It is noble idea, but you have to put yourself in certain position to make a change.
As far as your private life goes, yes, you may have some problems I am not aware of... I don't have any clue. I may have also some problems you are not aware of. But I do not think that principle of choosing your battles, choosing when and where to invest our energy to make most of it is dependent on life situation. So even if I agree with what you say...theoretically, and even if I think that I share a lot of views with you, maybe you could save yourself from hassle of arguing in a way that just wastes your time and energy...

Cheers again Hink!

all I ask is one thing...would you please tell me what my argument with KillVehicle is?..I only used that exchange as one example and in fact my points do refer to other people entirely so I have not a clue where you are coming from. True, I do not care for the way KV talks to people...and I'm far from alone there...but it seems you and he think I have a beef with him when in fact I do not...please go read my responses to him and posts to him...I have said I respect his opinion's have said that even though his choice of genre isn't the same as I mine I have on more than one occasion said it still was good for the genre...I have never called KV any names though he claims I have trashed him and his music...and I would like to see any proof of that...he has in fact swore at me many times for which I shrug off, he has in fact called me a coward and stupid...and yet I still respect his opinion...but like I said before I don't always agree with how he delivers his opinions.

So I have no issue with him at all except I hope he will treat people with a little more respect when he talks to them, if he doesn't I will adapt...I am talking about those who attack and judge other people's music and put's themselves above people, KillVehicle has not done that from what I have seen...you have no right what so ever to put words in my mouth or say how I feel about someone. My points about disrespectful comments came from different members entirely...so you are dead wrong and assuming the way you have you have puts me in a bad light that I do not deserve...perhaps you should keep your armchair physcoanalysis to yourself until you are sure you know what you are talking about, because you have not a clue this time what you are talking about.

[Hink]

my apologies to KillVehicle for being dragged in this for no reason, it is not about him and his name never should of been mentioned.