The FLStudio 6.1 beta looks to have great features!!!

[audiojunkie]

On saving zips: unfortunately files that are loaded by vsti's are not zipped (eg sfz's sf2) but probably there's no way to do this?

Hmmmm.... true. I guess the best idea would be to put everything needed for a particular project into a single folder (as I mentioned previously), and then zip it in the end.

But at the very least, the audio in the project should be zipped with the flp.

--Sean

[audiojunkie]

so ...
nobody appears to be using the 'project bones' function , to save
automation, channels, effects, mixer and scores ?...

or perhaps you just haven't mentioned it ...

i find it quite handy ...

I use project bones all the time. Instead of a one click freeze I think this is even better because it is more flexible.Export project bones, render the high cpu track (disc arm,ctrl+r),delete the channel.Now if I need to make a change just open the browser and drag over what you need from project bones make my changes ,rinse,repeat.

The entire project bones part of the software is REALLY dated and needs to be entirely re-worked. Even worse, it can be REALLY difficult to even figure what part is what when going through there.
Another thing that bothers me is the archiving of projects within FLS. It doesn't archive everything (think audio). This is another part of the program that needs to be reworked AFAIC.

Overall though, this program keeps getting better and better though.

--Sean

i agree w/ this , up to a point ...

if you set out knowing you are going to use this function , it is imperative that you take the time to 'name' your channels with enough information to provide the clues you may need for identification ...

clunky , perhaps ...
but it does work ...

Hmmm.... Good point (naming of channels). I'm going to have to keep this in mind and try it again to see if this helps me out. However, unless I'm mistaken, project bones doesn't even save piano-roll data (it was either this or step sequencer data -I can't remember for sure). Surely that would be considered an essential "bone" for the project bones area. Also, I agree with the earlier post that a "save entire channel" bone would be a great addition.

Overall though, I still think it is hard to find exactly what you are looking for, without a lot of searching, and that needs to be made easier for the user in order to get me (and probably others) to use it more. So I still think that Project bones needs a rework job.

--Sean

it does save piano roll data ...
under ' scores ' ...

create some midi , in a piano roll channel ...
export it as a project bones ...
open a new project ...
insert a piano roll channel , in the new project ...
open the project bones > scores ...
drag & drop the score on the new piano roll channel ...

voila ...

i can't comment on the step sequencer , as i never use it ...

Hmmm... maybe it was the step sequencer then. I just seem to remember that there was a lot of discussion about one of those things not being saved in project bones. That's what left me with that opinion.

--Sean

[tony tony chopper]

I'd really like to know how Sonar:

-knows/saves whatever files a VST uses (since there's nothing in the VST specs about that, but there IS in the FL plugin specs)

-saves *plugins* in your archive. Even if it was possible (and it's not, plugins are rarely just random DLLs), it wouldn't even be any legual.

FL saves everything it can in zipped projects, and does save files FL plugins need (by asking them).

[audiojunkie]

heres one for you guys. im working on a project right now cant say what its about or called but the person is part owner of a popular remix site. he wants me to do some remix work for him and in
return hell do vocals for me. heres the kicker though. he says i need cubase because ill be more happier with the end results but tbh i hate cubases workflow and prefer fl studios way of doing multiouts, the pianoroll, mixer ect. this is all to common for people to say you need cubase to make good music. while the inbuilt effects are decent as is the features, fl studios just has it right as far as workflow goes. im often a critic of fl studio due to its lack of more expensive daw
features but i would never say fl studio sucks or is unprofessional but its slowly growing into a great daw and imo how fast fl studio grows is going to determine whether better competiton makes or breaks fl studio.

Sounds to me like a Cubase user telling a FLStudio user that the FLStudio user will like Cubase better just because the Cubase user likes Cubase better, while the FLStudio user is perfectly happy with FLStudio's workflow. Stick with what you like and don't be influenced into getting something you don't like because it isn't what other people say is best.

--Sean

[audiojunkie]

I'd really like to know how Sonar:

-knows/saves whatever files a VST uses (since there's nothing in the VST specs about that, but there IS in the FL plugin specs)

-saves *plugins* in your archive. Even if it was possible (and it's not, plugins are rarely just random DLLs), it wouldn't even be any legual.

FL saves everything it can in zipped projects, and does save files FL plugins need (by asking them).

Does it save the recorded audio tracks within the zipped file?

--Sean

[audiojunkie]

Yep - same thing in live - save as 'self contained', what I always do.

Exactly.

--Sean

[tony tony chopper]

yes, since they're sampler channels. That's the main reason behind the zipped projects: you DON'T want to save them in normal projects, so zipped projects were created (and zip is better than a proprietary format, since you can take out your data without asking the sequencer to).

[audiojunkie]

I'd really like to know how Sonar:

-knows/saves whatever files a VST uses (since there's nothing in the VST specs about that, but there IS in the FL plugin specs)

-saves *plugins* in your archive. Even if it was possible (and it's not, plugins are rarely just random DLLs), it wouldn't even be any legual.

FL saves everything it can in zipped projects, and does save files FL plugins need (by asking them).

I didn't say that Sonar saves the VSTs, or the samples within the VSTs, but it does mention which particular VST is missing, and offers the user a chance to point to the VST or to cancel the loading of the zipped file so that the VST can be loaded and then the zip file can be tried again.

But that wasn't really my point. My understanding is that the audio tracks aren't saved with the zipped archive, which if this is truly the case, needs to be changed to save them.

--Sean

[Prajch]

Zipped loop packages have lost all the samples I've put inside them on more than one occasion... One day I open it up and they're gone. Maybe that's been fixed in v6; I haven't been using it because I don't really trust it anymore.

I think Edison could use a time ruler under the waveform. So far it looks very cool and useful though.

[audiojunkie]

yes, since they're sampler channels. That's the main reason behind the zipped projects: you DON'T want to save them in normal projects, so zipped projects were created (and zip is better than a proprietary format, since you can take out your data without asking the sequencer to).

So zipped projects save the audio tracks, samples, and such (within the project)?

--Sean

[fxe]

I think project bones really needs to include the flp and also copies of the audio files used in the project.

[Prajch]

yes, since they're sampler channels. That's the main reason behind the zipped projects: you DON'T want to save them in normal projects, so zipped projects were created (and zip is better than a proprietary format, since you can take out your data without asking the sequencer to).

So zipped projects save the audio tracks, samples, and such (within the project)?

--Sean

Yeah it'll save your audio files.

[grymmjack]

hitman tell us what version you are using ok?

i use the producer edition. i thought the xxl edition only has a bunch of bloated outdated synths. i didnt know you can emulate freeze in the xxl edition and i didnt know you can emulate a freezeing a synth and fx together. i recently started trying to learn fl studio inside and out. so theres things alot of things that i didnt know before that i do now. like changing the colour of grids, adding icons, shortcuts ect. so take my comments or complaints with a grain of salt as i admit i cant back up my mouth right now as far as advanced fl studio use goes

great, then i'm glad i took the time to post what i did. for sure, edison is awesome bro, it's a VST wave editor with full record capabilities. it's like tapeit and ez-editor ... it's really great. there are FREE OSR's (one shot recorders -- this is the acronym i was told anyway) that are by voxengo and tobybear. i recommend tobybears over voxengos just because it was a little less cryptic to use, but if you want a budget version that's got some great workflow features TapeIt2 is awesome, and i recommend it.

yep you can emulate freeze ... it really comes down to how you layout and plan your project. it's a very deep program and can quickly become almost counter productive if you dont plan things well. i was in the habit of recording automation on all different patterns until i read on looptalk (and went duh!) that before recording automation, to set my pattern to the automation data pattern which is part of every project -- so that i wouldn't have a hard time locating automation scattered all over the freaking place. this was before the excellent browser was integrated to find the automation and stuff so it was important to stay organized.

just so you know i was not and still am not ragging on you. freeze is definitely a great thing and most of us agree it would be completely cool in fl as well, but for now you can do it and get away cheap in the process with a little forethought and planning.

i know it's not fun to plan things, but once you get into the right habits your life becomes easier and less difficult and planning then turns into just second nature.. all the preparatory work you do can be saved as templates and so on ... definitely try it out. the tobybear OSR is nice.

i recommend highly the XXL stuff -- i frankly adore simsynth and it's unique character. it has a sort of hairy phatness to it's sounds and is very very easy to get up to speed with. the wasp is kick ass too, as is sytrus and so on. the dx10 while it's definitely not a powerhouse, fills a unique gap between basic fm and super sophisticated fm (sytrus) and i've found that i can achieve quite a bit of unique sounds just using DX10 alone. of course you must realize it's not meant to emulate any real instruments or acoustics, it's definitely a great tool to have though imo just the same. i've got 3 fm synths now sytrus, toxic3 (bought that because sytrus is very deep and i'm still learning fm and choose to learn on a less complex interface), and dx10. I think even though these are somewhat oldschool, they all rock in different ways. I own the vsti versions of them all as well which are suprisingly very versatile as they come with some nice effects -- fruity parameteric eq, reeeverb, chorus and delay all as modules bundled right in the plugins too.

also you don't have to go straight to the xxl unless you want to. IL gives price breaks based on how much you already own in a percentage, so the more you own the greater the discount, etc. i dig the entire line of image line products. to each their own though ...

get that OSR and try it out though, it's pretty sweet stuff. it's like realtime selective rendering depending on where you insert the plug in the effects rack. i find myself using it all the time.

[grymmjack]

On saving zips: unfortunately files that are loaded by vsti's are not zipped (eg sfz's sf2) but probably there's no way to do this?

automatically, probably not, but nothing is stopping you from appending those files to the zip archive. zip is universally accessible so you could just drag the sf2/sfz files right onto the zip file and if you have a decent archiver (there are free ones -- 7zip is awesome) it will pop up saying "add this to the zip file?" and you say ok, and then do a happy jig

[grymmjack]

Does it save the audio tracks or reference them? I would hope it would just reference them instead of saving them into the archive itself. For the obvious reason of diskspace..

I can't say I agree here. What's the point of archiving your stuff, if the audio tracks (part of the song) aren't archived with it? No, I don't agree at all on this one.

--Sean

half a dozen on one hand, sometimes i'd want this sometimes not. if an option "[x] include all external references" was given that would sort it out.

for me, i have a ton of samples that i never write to, just read from, and they are always at the same location on a separate disk so i'd prefer references instead of actual duplicates. it'd be nice to have an option.

edit: duh. of course that option is save as FLP or save as ZIP.