"Pure" Midi sequencers

[Rock Hardbuns]

Yes. I'm using XGworks lite 3.7 I think, that came with a synth a bought years ago. Updates for the lite vesion are still online.
Add in midi yoke and some microhosts or stand alone synths and you got a very stable set up. Surprisingly so.
I use it with two instances of luxonix purity stand alone version.
If you wan't to record what you make you need an audio card that can loop back the output, but most do now-a-days.

edit > the reson for this setup is that I've realized that the complexity of all the features and synths that go with a "normal" vst studio really inhibits my creativity. By limiting my self to a decent midi sequencer and one synth I get much more music done.

[Rock Hardbuns]

Another addition. I find that it kicks ass that I don't have any mastering capabilities built in to this setup. I make me A) mix right from the start and pay attention to levels and frequency instead of slapping limiters everywhere, and B) Master in a proper audio editor when the time is right for it.

[aMUSEd]

Yes. I'm using XGworks lite 3.7 I think, that came with a synth a bought years ago. Updates for the lite vesion are still online.
Add in midi yoke and some microhosts or stand alone synths and you got a very stable set up. Surprisingly so.
I use it with two instances of luxonix purity stand alone version.
If you wan't to record what you make you need an audio card that can loop back the output, but most do now-a-days.

edit > the reson for this setup is that I've realized that the complexity of all the features and synths that go with a "normal" vst studio really inhibits my creativity. By limiting my self to a decent midi sequencer and one synth I get much more music done.

Does 3.7 work in XP?

I don't need Midi yoke, loopbacks etc - Scope does all that The plan is to use the mdid sequencer as another "plug in" to the Scope environment to drive hard and soft synths (includong the ones in Scope) which also has a built in 8 track recorder and all the routing I need. I already do this with some algorithmic apps but want something a bit more like a fully featured sequencer too.

[Rock Hardbuns]

Just looked, it's 3.07e and yes it works in XP. I think thats what the last patch did. XGw lite seems to come with just about every yamaha product. I looked and found that I actually have three different copies of it.

I know nothing about scope. I just threw that in about midi yoke in case someone else feels like trying it.

XGw lite ins't really fully fledged though. It's got what I need but there's features missing.

But basically, with this kind of setup, you can try just about any sequencer from a while back (when they still made good sequencers).
I'm considering installing me old copy of DOPpro again too, seeing as this setup actually works.

[bro. miles]

I still use an older MIDI only sequencer from MOTU called Freestyle. It has a number of cool features including extracting tempo information from rubato preformances. I think you can still find a demo of it circulating at Shareware Music Machine or by digging around the MOTU FTP. Last version was 2.31. Win/Mac. Runs OK under XP.

Another powerful MIDI sequencer if you can locate it is Opcode Vision. That was the best thing going in it's day and has a ton of features no longer found in modern sequencers. Killed off by Gibson.

You also might want to check some of the old Atari platform sequencers, still used by some like FatBoy Slim. You can run these under an Atari emulator. That last might be a problem though, the way you intend to use it.

[pdxindy]

This reminded me how piss poor current crop of sequencers are, I mean XGworks is ooold and yet was better than what's offered today in many ways. I think sequencer programing is following an inverse evolutionary curve, they're not evoluting, they're devoluting...

Sad but true... It is odd too because it is just simple data that does not even require serious computing power to manipulate in complex ways.

[Rock Hardbuns]

A midi sequencer is not too tricky. A stand alone VST host is probably tricker, but still it's not tremdously difficult.
A VST host/DAW however is pretty tricky. It's typically pretty large, there's audio streaming and lots of crazy routing stuff added.
Before realtime effects, and even before audio recording, the developers could focus on making kick ass midi sequencing apps with optimized workflow.

Actually, the more I think of it, there should probably be a new standard for program interaction. Something like rewire, 'cept better and open and without the master/slave construct.
Then you could have a master control panel to which handles control and routing and plug in what ever midi sequencer you want. You could have a simple four track audio recorer without editing features up to some full enschillada audio multitracker. And racks for VSTis and effects.
Legacy audio and misi apps could be plugged in through driver level converters.
What would rock about such a scheme is that you could devote your setup to the stuff that interests you and save cpu cycles on the stuff that doesnt...
..but it will never happen.

[bullshark]

Before realtime effects, and even before audio recording, the developers could focus on making kick ass midi sequencing apps with optimized workflow.

YES! A lot of todays sequencers just looks like a bunch of features loosely bolted together with no sense of purpose and no regards for the end result that is desired.

And then they should make it reliable.

Actually, the more I think of it, there should probably be a new standard for program interaction. Something like rewire, 'cept better and open and without the master/slave construct.
Then you could have a master control panel to which handles control and routing and plug in what ever midi sequencer you want. You could have a simple four track audio recorer without editing features up to some full enschillada audio multitracker. And racks for VSTis and effects.
Legacy audio and misi apps could be plugged in through driver level converters.
What would rock about such a scheme is that you could devote your setup to the stuff that interests you and save cpu cycles on the stuff that doesnt...
..but it will never happen.

Nope, never happen.

[Atonal]

Perhaps not exactly what you're looking for but CAMPS (Computer Assisted Music Processing System) is a midi-only sequencer/compositional tool with some interesting features:

www.mxw.com/win4/index.htm

/Yoss

Thanks for this, am having a look now, looks very useful, if only my brain could keep up!

Yes that looks interesting - though Firefox won't load their shop page so I can't see how much it costs.

I've also found something called Onyx Arranger - anyone used that? Looks quite powerful.

I used CAMPS several years ago. It began to not be consistently suported, then it just floated off into the never-land. Haven't touched it for about 2+ years. Haven't heard anything from the developer either... last contact I made seemed to bother him by having to respond. I think this site may just be a fire-sale to get rid of their 3+ year-old software. Be careful, it may not be adequately supported anymore.

I have used Onyx. It's both fun, and creative. Some really nice 'arranging ' features and MIDI sculpting capabiility available. A bit of an uphill learning curve, but quite rewarding after that.

Jammer Pro has excellent MIDI editing capabilities. A good work-bench for MIDI.

good luck

-- atonal

[MattmaN]

Luna has a free version that should do the trick.
http://www.mutools.com/products.html

[alex zonder]

Another powerful MIDI sequencer if you can locate it is Opcode Vision. That was the best thing going in it's day and has a ton of features no longer found in modern sequencers. Killed off by Gibson.

Didn't know that one, searched for it & found this page:

http://www.opcodeusers.com/opcode/vision.html

[DaveL60]

I don't know anything about Scope, so maybe this won't fit, but: have you looked at Computer Muzys? Comes with every issue of Computer Music, is a very capable MIDI sequencer along with other features you can ignore since they don't fit your needs. It took me a little while to grok it, but it's loaded with enormously powerful MIDI editing and control features.

DaveL

[Yossarian]

This might be something to keep an eye on:

www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=143803

/Yoss

[aMUSEd]

Yes - just seen the front page - this is exactly what I was looking for Looks very promising.

[aMUSEd]

Another powerful MIDI sequencer if you can locate it is Opcode Vision. That was the best thing going in it's day and has a ton of features no longer found in modern sequencers. Killed off by Gibson.

Didn't know that one, searched for it & found this page:

http://www.opcodeusers.com/opcode/vision.html

http://www.fm-music.com/v/text_target.html

Dan Timis eh? - ring any bells? (hint Receptor)