V-Verb Pro - more examples

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hifiboom wrote:
Sammas wrote:
hifiboom wrote: the emu 1820m does have one of the best a/d-converters out there.
*sigh* :dog:
believe it or not Sammas,
its no joke...

do some search on the i-net and you'll know this too ...

No, really... it is a joke! For exactly the reasons you have just stated. Uninformed BS that spreads through the internet like wildfire. I guess you haven't actually heard on yourself then?

There is a huge difference between good value for money and the best A/D converters. Im sorry but it is so unbeleivably misguided that it is just ridiculous. The 1820m has a smeary low end, thin top end and a considerably narrow stereo image. It is "prosumer" gear.

It is pretty obivous that you have never heard professional quality converters. The likes of apogee, mytek, lavry, benchmark, etc... The sound quality of these units is nothing short of remarkable. Seriously, if you think the 1820m is one of the best sets of conversion out there then prepare to scoop your bottom jaw off the floor when you hear something like the Lavry Blue Series.


Here is the thing, audio quality is all relative. Something sounds great until you hear something better... If you are stuck spending your time listening to prosumer quality audio like the 1820m or M-audio gear, or protools|LE then naturally you will consider it to sound great because you have never heard anything better. It is the very reason why phrases like "your mileage may vary" and "take it with a grain of salt" were coined.

I don't need to search the internet, I've used my ears and have already determined that it is closer to terrible than it is too being good. Don't let me rain on your parade though, people get different things out of recording... I am sure there are plenty of happy people using the 1820m. its all about the music in the end, isn't it.

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Sammas wrote:
hifiboom wrote:
Sammas wrote:
hifiboom wrote: the emu 1820m does have one of the best a/d-converters out there.
*sigh* :dog:
believe it or not Sammas,
its no joke...

do some search on the i-net and you'll know this too ...

No, really... it is a joke! For exactly the reasons you have just stated. Uninformed BS that spreads through the internet like wildfire. I guess you haven't actually heard on yourself then?


I don't need to search the internet, I've used my ears and have already determined that it is closer to terrible than it is too being good. Don't let me rain on your parade though, people get different things out of recording... I am sure there are plenty of happy people using the 1820m. its all about the music in the end, isn't it.
:lol: :roll:

Anyways, more examples please... :wink:

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Yeah Sammas you are a bit off, those hi-end converters are not available on common audio interfaces. That said, Focusrite Saffires were ranked above EMUs by some magazine.

I've only heard prosumer stuff and so far it's been good enough for me. And for that reason I'd rather not hear any of those +3K converters, they don't make sense outside professionally built studio environments.

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Sammas implication is just

high-end must be really expensive, else it is not high-end.

So why hop around in stupid threads about Behringer units.

Just go out and buy a Lexicon 960L. I'm sure you are satisfied with it....just because of its price and the pro-signature.

LOL

I'm sure you also will ask next time, if we are using good quality digital in/outs....

:)

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I don't think he meant that, it's just that AD conversion is a delicate process requiring scientific research, very good, stable components and interference-free design in an external housing, making the best constructs too expensive for the consumer market.

With digital reverbs this is not necessarily the case.

BTW digital I/O have their differences as well due to some clock jitter thingy or something. I don't believe that these differences are audible to mortals, however.

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at least the EMU 1820m has the same converters as ProTools which is considered as professional. if thats not good enough, I don't know.

Anyway my sound samples were done with the dig-in/outs and using Cubase realtime mixdown feature which means it was completly digital.

So theres not to much difference compared to a VST reverb plug-in.

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Yes, but when using the analog I/O on the V-Verb the signal is converted twice by the Behringer converters as well as the EMU, and even with prima converters that means bad for the signal quality. Sammas questioned V-Verb converter quality based on his general opinion about the B brand, which can be false of course, but possibly in the right direction.

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Are the rack-mount "ears" removable btw?

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.jon wrote:Are the rack-mount "ears" removable btw?
yes it seems so, as there are two screws on each metal plate on every side of the unit. so I think you can remove it without problem...

By the way, when I get the CSR package I will extensive compare those two reverbs against each other....
And give some statement where they differ and who...

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Thanks, I'd probably place it under my notebook as I don't have a rack.

I'd be interested in comparisons between that and Arts Acoustic Reverb, as they are in the same price class.

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As I have also extensivly tested AA reverb, I would set the V-Verb on top of the AA Reverb... AA has a slightly metalic character that I do not like... V-Verb sounds more clean in the reverb tail.

Broks long thread about the AA reverb and that no reverb can compete to it, I think it is just a little bit unfair comparison...

The AA has that special modulation that may sound nice with just one synth sound (kind of chorus combined with reverb).

But thats not the case to judge over a reverb unit...

I like the V-Verb more than the AA reverb.

But the AA may be the best tool for a special task like broks lush synth reverb.

just my 2 cent
Image

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Hi All,

Since kmonkey used a preset called 'vintage 250' for a reverb test, I thought I might do some tests with my EMT250 - and here we go.

www.relab.dk/EMT250_OUT1+4_Drumloop.wav
www.relab.dk/EMT250_OUT2+3_Drumloop.wav
www.relab.dk/EMT250_OUT1+4_Brok.wav
www.relab.dk/EMT250_OUT2+3_Brok.wav

The EMT250 is a mono->4 channel reverb - therefore 2 different wav files for each test.

The settings : Time = 4.5s / Low = x1.0 / High = x0.33 / Predelay = 0ms / Mix = 50%/50%

Cheers

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Hey Warp69! Very nice indeed. I dont have access to V-Verb now (i am not at home) but i can remember that vintage250 preset had about 13 ms of predelay and decay is about 3s. Though it isnt important anyway. This is very very nice sound. Thanks.

Regarding converter things - please dont hijack this thread. I am pretty happy with my soundcard and i dont think that i am missing something big from your/their apogee or whatever brand. And i am pretty happy and can live with fact that i will loose some quality in conversion(because i cant hear it, i am not interested in this and i believe that in final mix i wont notice this anyway). It does not itch me at all. Move that things to another thread please. This is about reverbs and how they sound.

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kmonkey wrote:Hey Warp69! Very nice indeed. I dont have access to V-Verb now (i am not at home) but i can remember that vintage250 preset had about 13 ms of predelay and decay is about 3s. Though it isnt important anyway. This is very very nice sound. Thanks.

Regarding converter things - please dont hijack this thread. I am pretty happy with my soundcard and i dont think that i am missing something big from your/their apogee or whatever brand. And i am pretty happy and can live with fact that i will loose some quality in conversion(because i cant hear it, i am not interested in this and i believe that in final mix i wont notice this anyway). It does not itch me at all. Move that things to another thread please. This is about reverbs and how they sound.
:tu:

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.jon wrote:I don't think he meant that, it's just that AD conversion is a delicate process requiring scientific research, very good, stable components and interference-free design in an external housing, making the best constructs too expensive for the consumer market.
Well I have not heard any of those "reference" converters yet, but I have heard quite a few
soundcards considere "pro" (stuff like RME, Sydec...) and I also own the Emu 1212m and actually
it smoked everything I heard up to this point. So perhaps it's not high-end stuff, but definately
a big step above "prosumer".

Sure - there is always stuff that is better (and probably 10-50 times more expensive), but if you
can't get a decent result in terms of sound-quality with the 1212m or the 1820m, you should quit
music-production as a hobby or as a profession because there are other reasons why you can't cut it...

Best regards,
Tobias

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