V-Verb Pro - more examples

[Jason Brian Merrill]

sounds like gearslutz syndrome to me.

[Shigurui]

I bet in a few years he's probably gonna start sayin software is for idiots.
Well, too bad most of us don't have those GREAT ears he assumingly has.

[jplanet]

What kills me the most about Sammas is that the whole point of this thread was to listen to real examples, so that people who are familiar with a variety of gear can chime in with their experience for those who don't have the equipment to compare themselves. Yet he goes on accusing everyone of not using their ears.

[Sammas]

What kills me the most about Sammas is that the whole point of this thread was to listen to real examples, so that people who are familiar with a variety of gear can chime in with their experience for those who don't have the equipment to compare themselves. Yet he goes on accusing everyone of not using their ears.

I've listened to the examples, I found these ones to sound considerably poorer than the ones in the last thread... As I've already mentioned. I've also requested some shorter reverb examples but nothing as yet.

I have nothing wrong with people giving their experience on gear, I have nothing but dislike for people who give an opinion on gear that they've never heard or compared to anything else.

[JeffSanders]

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/showthread.php?t=78230

[jplanet]

I have nothing but dislike for people who give an opinion on gear that they've never heard or compared to anything else.

I agree. So how long have you been using the Behringer Reverb?

[Sammas]

BTW digital I/O have their differences as well due to some clock jitter thingy or something. I don't believe that these differences are audible to mortals, however.

You don't hear digital jitter, but rather the effect it has on the quality of audio. Good quality clocking will improve stereo image, depth and clarity of audio. Jitter will result in smeary stereo image, lacking depth and frequency specific things like muddy low end. Thats one of the reason why this doesn't mean a thing:

at least the EMU 1820m has the same converters as ProTools which is considered as professional. if thats not good enough, I don't know.

There is a whole lot more to digital conversion that just the converter chip. If i remember correctly RME converters and Metric Halo gear (and probably a whole lot more) uses the same chip. Its not the conversion chip's that define the quality of audio but their implimentation. Power supply, circuit layout, clocking and the analog stages give a converter its sound or lack there of. The analog stages of a set of converters are probably one of the most important parts, particularly whats called a sinc filter. This is the low pass filter that smoothes the waveform back into an analogous shape.

I agree. So how long have you been using the Behringer Reverb?

I haven't used it... but then again, I don't think I've posted an opinion on it.

[.jon]

BTW digital I/O have their differences as well due to some clock jitter thingy or something. I don't believe that these differences are audible to mortals, however.

You don't hear digital jitter, but rather the effect it has on the quality of audio. Good quality clocking will improve stereo image, depth and clarity of audio. Jitter will result in smeary stereo image, lacking depth and frequency specific things like muddy low end.

Yes, poor clocking of the D/A can and will affect the playback quality, but if you are running the signal digital from prosumer gear to another prosumer gear, the result in the receiving end will be very close to perfect. And the difference between Pro gear is negotiable. If and when most of the bits are received in the other end, output digital jitter has very little meaning.

[Kingston]

Yes, poor clocking of the D/A can and will affect the playback quality, but if you are running the signal digital from prosumer gear to another prosumer gear, the result in the receiving end will be very close to perfect. And the difference between Pro gear is negotiable. If and when most of the bits are received in the other end, output digital jitter has very little meaning.

if you're moving the audio signal digitally, then none of this converter/clocking talk applies. The signal will be perfect wether it's spdif(prosumer), AES (pro), or any of the adat etc variations.

..unless you have the digital sync signals set up wrong. It's pretty easy to screw up the master/slave relationships between those, and you'll have glitching galore.

[.jon]

Technically it does, the digital output is clocked by either the sending unit or externally - and the signal can be jittery "in the cable"... it just get's organised by the receiving unit, it's just data after all. This is not a very practical discussion

The S/PDIF standard defines jitter tolerance and jitter transfer along with other things, and if the signal jitter exceeds the receiver's tolerance limits it can lose clock, lose bits and go galore but I don't see this a real possibility with modern prosumer gear.

[Sammas]

When linking gear digitally, only one device will be set as the master. The rest are slaved to the master's clock. The biggest problem is that most digital audio gear doesn't have an internal clock designed to sync lots of extra external gear. When you run expanded setups with multiple devices like converters and digital effects that are all linked digitally, the clocking suffers, which as a result effects the quality of audio.

This is why dedicated clocks like apogee's big ben are popular when running multiple sets of converters. The big ben is designed to be a master clock in a large digital setup. Clocking a Rosetta 800 with a big ben might not yield any improvements in sound compared to using the rosetta's internal clock, but clocking 2, 3 or 4 rosetta's all linked together with the big ben will. Simply because the rosetta's clock won't maintain its quality when trying to sync multiple devices.

Every digital signal has a degree of jitter, it is just a question of how much... Sync'ing two pieces of gear probably won't affect much at all. If one device has a better internal clock than the other it may even improve things.

[politcat]

i will never fly on a plane with you peeps!

[jplanet]

Hi Sammas, thanks for remaining diplomatic through my challenging comments -- you know a lot about what you are talking about, I can learn a lot from reading your posts!

Cheers

[hifiboom]

hehe it starts with a reverb and ends with the data loss between digital-to-digital transfer due to synchronisation errors...


good that everybody calmed down a little...

[jplanet]

hehe it starts with a reverb and ends with the data loss between digital-to-digital transfer due to synchronisation errors...


good that everybody calmed down a little...

Now everyone's brain hurts too much to argue...