VSTis as good as hardware? Similar to Access Virus Quality?

[blaster78]

I have long suspected that the perceived quality of synths often is a result of its effects and filters, more than anything else. Turn off effects and filters on some of your favorite Virus patches, and see if you still think the sound is too amazing to be done by software.

not that i care, and i certainly don't want a virus, but that statement is really rather obvious.

its like saying that food is good cos of half the ingedients, or that a car is good cos of the tyres and gearbox. of course these things make them good, they are integral to the end result.

[oblagon]

1200 euros for NL2x is tooo much!I prefer Discovery (same sound about 99,5%)

Clavia would sue DiscoDSP and suppress Discovery if that was true. The similarity factor is in fact something like %30. Discovery sounds sort of like NL2. That's all.

Tested with both a real NL and Discovery with same patch (which discovery can load ), the sound WAY more than 30% alike

I owned NL2 and still have Discovery. 'Sounds sort of like NL' might be even stretching it. Square osc sounds completely different in NL,pwn modulation will give you completely different sound, FM is way more metalic and edgy in NL, filter and distortion sound different, 'dry' tone that NL has isn't there.

I'm not degrading the plugin. It's rather nice. But the hallmark of NL, tight oscS and filters, all kinds of edgy, metalic and shrill sounds aren't reproducible in Discovery.

Synth 1 is closer to NL than Discovery.

Are you kidding me? Discovery is at least 95% close to NL2 (try to use the oversampling option and you will hear those "edgy, metallic and shrill" sounds!)The only thing that is different in some patches is the low end..NL2 has more of it, but certainly i won't pay 1200 euros for details like this. If it would cost around 600 euros i would reconsider because it has very good build quality!

95%... Such claims are completely ludricious... Who cares what you're willing to pay ?? I'm comparing the sound here. I will repeat this again: Clavia didn't even bother to respond to DiscoDSP email about the legality of their plugin. That's what they think of the plugin 'emulation' and surely algos and preservation of the distinctive sound should be a top priority for any synth manufacturer.

[The Chase]

This is a stupid topic, if you can't hear the difference between a good hardware synth vs softsynths sound quality wise its because you either don't know what you are listening for or you simply can't hear the difference period.You are in the same boat as basically 99.9999% of the people who will listen to your music so who cares.

I doubt nuffink would deny the virus sounding different from anyhting else. It's just that what makes it different is not merely being digital hardware.

Same with analog vs digital synths, they sound totally different but no listening to the final product would care what made the sound, just if it sounds interesting or not.

No it's really not the same with analog and digital synths because analog and digital synths are different. But you are right by saying that no one listening to the final product would care what made the sound as long as they find it interesting.

[scottyp]

I have a virus and I haven't found any software that has the same filter characteristics, that's element that sets the virus apart.

[oblagon]

1200 euros for NL2x is tooo much!I prefer Discovery (same sound about 99,5%)

Clavia would sue DiscoDSP and suppress Discovery if that was true. The similarity factor is in fact something like %30. Discovery sounds sort of like NL2. That's all.

Tested with both a real NL and Discovery with same patch (which discovery can load ), the sound WAY more than 30% alike

I owned NL2 and still have Discovery. 'Sounds sort of like NL' might be even stretching it. Square osc sounds completely different in NL,pwn modulation will give you completely different sound, FM is way more metalic and edgy in NL, filter and distortion sound different, 'dry' tone that NL has isn't there.

I'm not degrading the plugin. It's rather nice. But the hallmark of NL, tight oscS and filters, all kinds of edgy, metalic and shrill sounds aren't reproducible in Discovery.

Synth 1 is closer to NL than Discovery.

Are you kidding me? Discovery is at least 95% close to NL2 (try to use the oversampling option and you will hear those "edgy, metallic and shrill" sounds!)The only thing that is different in some patches is the low end..NL2 has more of it, but certainly i won't pay 1200 euros for details like this. If it would cost around 600 euros i would reconsider because it has very good build quality!

As to the oversampling.. You won't reproduce NL2 sound with NL3 or modular becasue each machine that follows has more refined sound that looses the edge. The same goes for NL1 and NL2. So if you think you've got a 95% NL2 in form of a plugin then you're either misinformed, incapable of hearing the difference or you dwell in a fantasy land.

[george]

I will repeat this again: Clavia didn't even bother to respond to DiscoDSP email about the legality of their plugin.

As a matter of fact we have received several mails from Clavia. Of course I'm not going to disclose what happened.

[pdxindy]

When we have though a vsti that its quality is 95% close to a hardware synth's quality, then its absolutely normal to get rid of that hardware and get the software.

Digital hardware is no better than digital software cause they are the exact same thing. 1's and 0's

As you point out, there are a ton of softsynths that are lesser sound quality, but there are also a ton of hardware synths which you can buy at garage sales for $10 that sound like total crap, worse than any of those soft synths.

Hardware synths are better integrated with the controller (obviously) with the presets making more use of knobs, ribbons, xy pads etc while softsynths do not know what controller the player will use. Of particular note, the hardware synth usually is better balanced on its output in relation to keyboard velocity curves and across the keyboard range.

I do think there is a polished quality from hardware synths. I've noticed with softsynths, even high quality ones, I would have to go into a preset to adjust it so that the volume is even across the keyboard range etc. So I think the presets in quality hardware synths are overall somewhat more refined in such details. Partly that has to do with having control over controller/synth interaction while the softsynth developer has no idea what controller the musician will be using.

When I take my headphones, and go into the music store and play around with the latest digital hardware synths, I walk away feeling really happy with my softsynths.

[oblagon]

I will repeat this again: Clavia didn't even bother to respond to DiscoDSP email about the legality of their plugin.

As a matter of fact we have received several mails from Clavia. Of course I'm not going to disclose what happened.

In one of your posts you stated something different. That was a while ago though. Sorry about being presumptuous. Discovery is a fine synth in its own right.

[Algorythm]

Oblagon i still believe that Discovery is veeery close to NL2. I've tested them too!When a company doesn't advertise that its product sounds like an NL2, but it implies it with the structure of the synth, then it isn't necessary to not sound like an NL2. It could be a "possibility of similarity".. If i make a soft synth that its name is Rasglop and it has the same routing with a hardware (but i don't advertising that it has the same routing) and i advertise it like a new synth, then i believe that nobody can stop its production if it sounds the same with the hardware..i can claim that it was a coincidence..Discovery is 5% different to me.I'm not deaf and i'm not walking in a fantasy world!Maybe i'm wrong about the percentage, but the difference is very little.

[snooky]

I owned a NL1 some time ago, had it for a few years, sold it and then I tried Discovery.
it sounded Very much alike!

the filter and FM sounds almost identical and I had such a pleasure dialing in patches I hadn't been able to make earlier with other software.

[snooky]

I will repeat this again: Clavia didn't even bother to respond to DiscoDSP email about the legality of their plugin.

As a matter of fact we have received several mails from Clavia. Of course I'm not going to disclose what happened.

In one of your posts you stated something different. That was a while ago though. Sorry about being presumptuous. Discovery is a fine synth in its own right.

why this hate for fine software that DO sound like it's counterpart?!

Are you an elitist WANKER!?!?!?!?

[tony tony chopper]

anyone tried babya virus?

[vvanrij]

Yeah I agree too, also owned a NL2, and indeed it sounds very much alike, enough for me and my productions anyways! And the virus filters are great, but so are the novation filters and the roland (8080)'s. But also topic wise, its not that usefull to say that 'nothing sounds like a virus filter', cause the man is searching for something 'similar', so better would be to state which softsynth's filter is closest to the virus'. But imo the filter and all are great in a virus, but for me its more about the ridicilous amount of options I have with it.

-Victor

[vvanrij]

@snooky, maybe cause somepeople pay alot of money for the hardware, and then see some cheap software popup, it can be quite harsh for them to take. Not saying that is the case with oblagon, but it could be

@tony, babya sucks, try mcaffee!

@vvanrij, I totally agree

[snooky]

@snooky, maybe cause somepeople pay alot of money for the hardware, and then see some cheap software popup, it can be quite harsh for them to take. Not saying that is the case with oblagon, but it could be

yes!
it's usually like that, but saying so get's one flamed...
damn kids these days.