Guitar Synth Player CONTEST: Deadline Thurs Oct 5th

[autodafe]

Hi Admiral:

I have tried recording something for you...
it's "Poor man" rendition of Steve Vai'S "For the Love of God...just a single riff, not the whole song...

I have recorded the MIDI part, a MP3 File (using Amplitube2) and a CLEAN (no effects, just direct Guitar Output).
Guitar is a '79 Stratocaster
GR-50 Bend was set to 12 semitones...


MIDI FILE

MP3 FILE

CLEAN MP3 FILE

I'm not really sure about the .MID File, it should have 6 MIDI Channels into one track, but, listening with differnts VSTis, I wasn't able to hear the bending...

Hope It helps. Pls tell me what I did wrong if not....

[selfconstruct]

I'm just playing around with Cubase at the moment and discovered the "input transformer" (I'm pretty lazy when it comes to midi - I should have known about this before). I have a channel per track now (and hence an instrument per string in real time).

[AdmiralQuality]

I'm just playing around with Cubase at the moment and discovered the "input transformer" (I'm pretty lazy when it comes to midi - I should have known about this before). I have a channel per track now (and hence an instrument per string in real time).

Yep, you can use the input transformer to filter the channel you want during record-time onto each of the 6 tracks. OR just record all 6 channels on all 6 tracks, and use the MIDI transformer insert (functions just like the input transformer, only different ) to filter which channel comes OUT. (I suggest this method just because it's nice to have one instrument's performance on one track... though I can see lots of cases where you might want them split up too.) Anyway, now that you've found it, have fun with that! Very powerful feature, solves a lot of problems.

autodafe, I got your files, thanks! Will check em out and get back to you a little later. OH! And you need to tell me what your controller's pitch bend range is set to!!! C'mon people, read the instructions!

[autodafe]

OK, i'm going out now wil be back in some hours... cheers

[AdmiralQuality]

OK, i'm going out now wil be back in some hours... cheers

Oops autodafe! That's in MIDI Poly mode (everything is on channel 1). Can you set your MIDI-guitar converter to Mono mode and try it again?

Thanks!

EDIT: Oh and by the way autodafe, there IS pitchbend data in that file, but it's very subtle. So sounds to me like your guitar controller is set to a very wide pitchbend range (which isn't uncommon). What kind of controller are you using again?

Ooooooh, I just read in the GI-20 manual that it can have different bend ranges PER STRING! AND... that it sends an automated MIDI CC message setting the bend range (only to synths that respond to that message, of course. But I'll be making sure mine DOES! So it will allow different bends ranges on all channels/strings. Cool!!!)

[krraqk]

Hey krraqk, your 2nd track, "solo synth", is in Poly mode. Everything is on channel 1. (I doubt you played those leads all one one string! ) It's the one that's got the best pitch bends in it so it's too bad I can't use it as an example.

The track is in 6 channels already, but has been set to play only in one channel. Then when I exported the midi file it converted the different midi channels in midi channel 1.

I have set the track to midi channel 1 in order to play the synth in pure Mono, because that was the only way to have a mono legato synth sound, otherwise it wouldn't be possible to have mono legato but a 6 note polyphonic sound, and that wouldn't have been the same result.

Even for a "solo" voiced track, you should prefer Mono mode. Guitars of course are only ever as monophonic as your playing.

The axon is set to mono mode (very string to 1 midi channel) but has I have said, if you want to play a mono legato synth sound the best form me at least is to set the track in cubase to only one channel. Maybe with a synth capable of that mono midi guitar mode it would be possible to obtain a mono synth sound sending a midi channel by string, but I don't have Imposcar to try it.

If you can get me another version that's not mashed down to Poly mode, that would be great.

No problem, there is the original track in 6 midi channels :
http://www.rogepost.com/dn/q9vp/solo+synth+mono.mid

I have taken your Electric Piano track though and ran it off on 6 instances of a soft-synth (not mine) just to test it... and it came out like this:

http://www.admiralquality.com/mp3/krraq ... p3?contest

That was NOT easy to set up! I had to copy the track to 6 opies of itself, filter the extra channels out of each copy, and then run those to 6 separate instances of the soft synth. But just to prove you CAN do this the "hard way" with virtually ANY soft synth. Definitely not fun though.

I have done it setting 6 instances of the same electric piano patch in a multitimbral vsti. Worked great.

If your vsti is not multitimbral then you can do it in various ways depending of what vsti you use. For example using sends in the midi track (you would need 2 tracks because there are only 4 sends per track).

[autodafe]

Oops autodafe! That's in MIDI Poly mode (everything is on channel 1). Can you set your MIDI-guitar converter to Mono mode and try it again?

what the ??? I'm pretty sure I have set it to MONO mode...
and also pitch bend settings were showing "12 semitones"

maybe my controller have 2 parts and i was using the wrong one...

I have a GR-50 with a GK2...

i'll try again and double check everything---

[autodafe]

OH! And you need to tell me what your controller's pitch bend range is set to!!! C'mon people, read the instructions!

I told you in my post

[AdmiralQuality]

Thanks krraqk, got it. Works. (You might just consider running 6 instances of your synth in Mono mode. You get legato as long as it's on the same string... and nice release overlaps between strings. Just like a guitar! )

And yes autodafe, I just doublechecked. All events are on channel 1 in that file. What host are you using to record with? Maybe it's doing something unwanted at export time? Also check that it's not somehow forcing a new channel onto what you record.

Thanks guys!

EDIT: Oh! Sorry autodafe, yes you did tell me. Missed it somehow.

[krraqk]

Thanks krraqk, got it. Works. (You might just consider running 6 instances of your synth in Mono mode. You get legato as long as it's on the same string... and nice release overlaps between strings. Just like a guitar! )

I have done it already, of course it has great advantages, but you cant get a true mono legato sound in all the fretboard. Thats something that I like many times when I play a solo with a synth or similar sounds, its playing like a horn or keyboard, the lines become more fluid. When embracing the midi guitar synth I want to inmerse myself with the sound played as much as possible. Every sound requires some type of adaptation and to tweak the mode how the axon and the vsti interact.

[krraqk]

This weekend I will try to make another midi record with the axon and the guitar simultaneously. You requested it, so if it helps you to implement the midi guitar in your synth, I will try to do it.

[AdmiralQuality]

This weekend I will try to make another midi record with the axon and the guitar simultaneously. You requested it, so if it helps you to implement the midi guitar in your synth, I will try to do it.

Could you run one off that's more just a test than a piece of music? While your piece was very nice, it didn't really give me all the things I need.

1. I need one string bending while some others sustain. Preferably examples of few different strings. I know it's near impossible to bend the 4th, 5th and 6th strings... but a few of 1st, 2nd, and 3rd would be nice. Again, best if there's another string going that you're bending into unison or harmony with. But also do some slow bends of just one string alone... what I need to test is that the pitch tracks accurately all through the bend. So slow is good.

(A friend showed me the "Chuck Berry thing" a few weeks back... it consisted of holding down the 1st and 2nd strings at any given fret with your index finger, then using the next 2 fingers to both fret the 3rd string at 2 frets up from the others, and then also bend it up a wholestep while you strum all 3 strings... over and over. Rock n Roll! What's good about that example is you're bending the 3rd into unison with the 2nd. So if it's off, it'll be easy to hear.)

2. Some chords strummed.

3. Some solo style playing with lots of bending and moving between different strings. Mostly one note at a time stuff but the odd harmony thrown in would be nice too. Some occasional finger vibrato would be nice too.

4. I forget, do you have a whammy bar? If so, give me some slow and extreme down bending of the whole guitar playing just an E chord or something (and here your guitar audio reference will come in handy, as very few whammys bend with all the strings in tune). Then do it again, one string at a time. If you don't have a whammy, don't worry about it.

Also, if you can, try setting up 12 semitone pitch bend. I know it's pretty much impossible to bend an octave, even with whammy, but the extra range will help me know if my synth is tracking accurately. I feel 2 semitones is definitely too small a range though -- even though that's the range of most bends as performed, you won't hear if you bend too far because the limit is right at 2. Make sense?

Thanks again guys!!!

[autodafe]

And yes autodafe, I just doublechecked. All events are on channel 1 in that file. What host are you using to record with? Maybe it's doing something unwanted at export time? Also check that it's not somehow forcing a new channel onto what you record.

ok, I'll try again, double-checking everything. I'm using Cubase SX 2.2...maybe the export function in Cubase exports on 1 channel or mixes up everything...see you soon

[AdmiralQuality]

And yes autodafe, I just doublechecked. All events are on channel 1 in that file. What host are you using to record with? Maybe it's doing something unwanted at export time? Also check that it's not somehow forcing a new channel onto what you record.

ok, I'll try again, double-checking everything. I'm using Cubase SX 2.2...maybe the export function in Cubase exports on 1 channel or mixes up everything...see you soon

Not sure if this would be it, but make sure your track's MIDI output channel says "ALL" and not any of the channels from 1 to 16.

[krraqk]

This weekend I will try to make another midi record with the axon and the guitar simultaneously. You requested it, so if it helps you to implement the midi guitar in your synth, I will try to do it.

Could you run one off that's more just a test than a piece of music? While your piece was very nice, it didn't really give me all the things I need.

1. I need one string bending while some others sustain. Preferably examples of few different strings. I know it's near impossible to bend the 4th, 5th and 6th strings... but a few of 1st, 2nd, and 3rd would be nice. Again, best if there's another string going that you're bending into unison or harmony with. But also do some slow bends of just one string alone... what I need to test is that the pitch tracks accurately all through the bend. So slow is good.

(A friend showed me the "Chuck Berry thing" a few weeks back... it consisted of holding down the 1st and 2nd strings at any given fret with your index finger, then using the next 2 fingers to both fret the 3rd string at 2 frets up from the others, and then also bend it up a wholestep while you strum all 3 strings... over and over. Rock n Roll! What's good about that example is you're bending the 3rd into unison with the 2nd. So if it's off, it'll be easy to hear.)

Well Im not a rocker, heheh, and I use 011 string set, so I doubt I can bend 2 or 3 strings at the same time very much. The elec piano track has pitch bend in some strings, not a radical bend, but yes some small ones.

2. Some chords strummed.

The elec piano track is played with a pick, so all the chords are strummed really.

3. Some solo style playing with lots of bending and moving between different strings. Mostly one note at a time stuff but the odd harmony thrown in would be nice too. Some occasional finger vibrato would be nice too.

The solo track is plenty of bendings, vibratos, legatos, etc. Its not?

4. I forget, do you have a whammy bar? If so, give me some slow and extreme down bending of the whole guitar playing just an E chord or something (and here your guitar audio reference will come in handy, as very few whammys bend with all the strings in tune). Then do it again, one string at a time. If you don't have a whammy, don't worry about it.

Sorrry I dont have whammy bar in my midi guitars actually.

Also, if you can, try setting up 12 semitone pitch bend. I know it's pretty much impossible to bend an octave, even with whammy, but the extra range will help me know if my synth is tracking accurately. I feel 2 semitones is definitely too small a range though -- even though that's the range of most bends as performed, you won't hear if you bend too far because the limit is right at 2. Make sense?

Yes I can set it to 12, many times I do it, but i change to 2 depending the response of the vsti (which i set to 2 or 12 acordingly). Again, I use 011 strings set, so Im not a hard bender , normally max is a whole tone.