I sure am maing music with the program. The fact that it has bugs does not stop me from using it. Sure, there are plug-ins (e.g. Music Lab) which I paid good money for and can not use to its fullest and the pianoroll has become a pain to work with and envelops does not respond the way they should, and V-Vocal causes crashes, etc etc.
Despite all these queries, I still use it.
The point is that the company has gone backwards. Only a year ago they would have responded to these queries. Now they ban you from their forum. That is just the direction they have gone.
Shall I go from Logic 5.5.1 to SONAR 6 Producer?
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- KVRAF
- 2401 posts since 29 Dec, 2002 from In the dark
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- KVRAF
- 3476 posts since 9 Apr, 2003 from NE Ohio, USA
That is definitely "competing with Steinberg" in the wrong prioritiesSepheritoh wrote:The point is that the company has gone backwards. Only a year ago they would have responded to these queries. Now they ban you from their forum. That is just the direction they have gone.
I'm not a heavy-duty Sonar user, so I've not hit the issues you mentioned, and I've never needed a lot of support for what I do, so I guess my perspective is "It's still better than Cubase" for now.
Doug
Logic is a pretty flower that smells bad - Spock, in "I, Mudd"
For a good time click http://www.belindabedekovic.com/video_fl_en.htm
For a good time click http://www.belindabedekovic.com/video_fl_en.htm
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- KVRer
- 1 posts since 27 Sep, 2006
As of now I am still using Logic 5.5.1 mainly because of two reasons a) It was still holding its own with the competition especially in conjunction with b) The enormous amount of effort I put into Logic setup - environments, patchnames (phew) and snapshots.
I tried Cubase 3.1 but was still disapointed somehow. It was much better than previous versions but I still managed to crash it ( something that I have always managed to do - just me )
Then I tried Ableton Live and this was really interesting especially for audio manipulation and seems very easy. However, I still have a lot of real MIDI instruments and Ableton's ability to control that setup was in a word hopeless. Shame really.
So then I tried Sonar 5.1. Calkwalk has always been good at MIDI but I never liked the interface. Now Sonar is really great to use.
1) I have three monitors but could only really use two in logic because the main window was and needs to be in the centre with the mixer on the right. To use the left screen you had to extend the right screen and arrange the windows in MS - this meant to move to the left screen you had to move the mouse all the way to the right. With Sonar all windows except the track view are floatable. So I can set up the tracks in the centre and console right and event list/score etc on the right. Using screen layouts and binding them to the NUM 1, 2 3 keys etc I can emuulate snapshots but not 99 of them.
Patchname conversion has always been a problem but in Logic I saved the names as text which just gives me a list of names. Then import in MS word and using the bullet numbering trick and setting up as 0= that solved the naming problem. Had them all converted in 3 hours. The rest of the setup was a breeze.
Sonar 5 I think has a very slight edge of logic 5.5.1 at this stage so any subsequent versions have got to only improve on this.
Sonar 5 I beleive has overtaken Logic 5 in all things audio and the things one can do to audio clips is so easy.
I certainly do not miss the logic environments anymore.
The ability to route sound is fantastic in Sonar as there are only audio objects. This can be a track or a bus or the master.
I am still working through the Sonar 5 demo but I will definitely be upgrading Logic 5 to Sonar 6.
One thing I do miss from Logic 5 is the MIDI-In on the transport which shows the actual note or controller values as played or moved - even the chord name if applicable.
Anonyrat
I tried Cubase 3.1 but was still disapointed somehow. It was much better than previous versions but I still managed to crash it ( something that I have always managed to do - just me )
Then I tried Ableton Live and this was really interesting especially for audio manipulation and seems very easy. However, I still have a lot of real MIDI instruments and Ableton's ability to control that setup was in a word hopeless. Shame really.
So then I tried Sonar 5.1. Calkwalk has always been good at MIDI but I never liked the interface. Now Sonar is really great to use.
1) I have three monitors but could only really use two in logic because the main window was and needs to be in the centre with the mixer on the right. To use the left screen you had to extend the right screen and arrange the windows in MS - this meant to move to the left screen you had to move the mouse all the way to the right. With Sonar all windows except the track view are floatable. So I can set up the tracks in the centre and console right and event list/score etc on the right. Using screen layouts and binding them to the NUM 1, 2 3 keys etc I can emuulate snapshots but not 99 of them.
Patchname conversion has always been a problem but in Logic I saved the names as text which just gives me a list of names. Then import in MS word and using the bullet numbering trick and setting up as 0= that solved the naming problem. Had them all converted in 3 hours. The rest of the setup was a breeze.
Sonar 5 I think has a very slight edge of logic 5.5.1 at this stage so any subsequent versions have got to only improve on this.
Sonar 5 I beleive has overtaken Logic 5 in all things audio and the things one can do to audio clips is so easy.
I certainly do not miss the logic environments anymore.
The ability to route sound is fantastic in Sonar as there are only audio objects. This can be a track or a bus or the master.
I am still working through the Sonar 5 demo but I will definitely be upgrading Logic 5 to Sonar 6.
One thing I do miss from Logic 5 is the MIDI-In on the transport which shows the actual note or controller values as played or moved - even the chord name if applicable.
Anonyrat
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- KVRian
- 1236 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Karlshamn, Sweden
As a Logic 5.5.1 user, this is some interesting reading.
I might try a demo of Sonar myself..
I might try a demo of Sonar myself..
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- KVRian
- 1121 posts since 8 Oct, 2005
so very true. i jumped ship. cakewalk sux!Sepheritoh wrote:Sonar...support has gradually deteriorated over the years. It ground to halt up to the stage where Cakewalk does not even bother to reply to my emails anymore.
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- KVRian
- 1236 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Karlshamn, Sweden
Tried the demo of Sonar, and nah..im hanging on to Logic still. 
Sure some plugins may not work (not that many, and i wouldnt use them even if they did work.), and the way u work with audio aint even close to cubase or sonar (S6 that is..), but hxll.. i mainly work with external gear, and i LOVE the logic plugins more than most new plugins.
So, for me personally, i dont see any reason to jump ship yet.
Please tell me if im wrong tho.
Sure some plugins may not work (not that many, and i wouldnt use them even if they did work.), and the way u work with audio aint even close to cubase or sonar (S6 that is..), but hxll.. i mainly work with external gear, and i LOVE the logic plugins more than most new plugins.
So, for me personally, i dont see any reason to jump ship yet.
Please tell me if im wrong tho.
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- KVRAF
- 4749 posts since 15 Jul, 2001 from Holmfirth, West Yorkshire, U.K
face it, you are going to have to get a Mac G5 and Logic Pro..
there is no getting away from it.
there is no getting away from it.
steffensen wrote:Tried the demo of Sonar, and nah..im hanging on to Logic still.
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- KVRian
- 1236 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Karlshamn, Sweden
I would if i could afford to. Without a doubt.
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- KVRian
- 591 posts since 5 Feb, 2004 from southwest england
I would suggest Sonar is the perfect choice.
The bugs are very avoidable (Vvocal is buggy but you can work around it - use melodyne instead
) and sonar works solid as a rock here.
I find the support to be fine, the forum is not an offical support forum and you'll only get banned if you start acting like a dick (swearing, verbally abusing people) - which I'm sure is true of most forums (apart from KvR of course ).
Kind regards
Dave Rich
The bugs are very avoidable (Vvocal is buggy but you can work around it - use melodyne instead
) and sonar works solid as a rock here.I find the support to be fine, the forum is not an offical support forum and you'll only get banned if you start acting like a dick (swearing, verbally abusing people) - which I'm sure is true of most forums (apart from KvR of course
).Kind regards
Dave Rich
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- KVRist
- 53 posts since 28 Jun, 2004 from Argentina
I was a hardcore Logic 5.5.1 user and I feel more comfortable with Cubase, but I know Sonar too and I see Sonar's audio routing more flexible than Cubase's, But Cubase's logic editor and MIDI inserts are a better replacement for Logic's Environment (I miss you!!!!) than Sonar's.
Both interfaces look heavier and overloaded compared to the simpler (and as functional as....) Logic Interface. and Logic's interface is still faster (for me) to work. Cubase look a bit more "serious" than Sonar, But the later is more "informative"
You will miss (in the most horrible way) the set of Plugins and instruments bundled with Logic. When you got used to this plugins, you will find Sonar's Sonitus pack and Cubase's plugin set just useless. Only Kontakt 2 + Waves diamond made me happy again.
Sidechaining is missing in both hosts and automation is good. I miss Step recording but I'm seeing Sonar6 has it.
I love Sonar audio stretch and comping abilities, but I like Cubase Midi editors a bit more than Logic's. You can't select a tool for the left mouse button and another one for the right, because the right button opens a menu, as with every windows app.
Both hosts have off-line bounce. Logic hasn't it (at least in 5.. versions) you will love it if drop-outs made you fail 1000000000 times (as me) a mixdown, And both have "freeze" functions. Sonar's freeze is better than Cubase's.
well.... This is what happened to me... Greetings...
Both interfaces look heavier and overloaded compared to the simpler (and as functional as....) Logic Interface. and Logic's interface is still faster (for me) to work. Cubase look a bit more "serious" than Sonar, But the later is more "informative"
You will miss (in the most horrible way) the set of Plugins and instruments bundled with Logic. When you got used to this plugins, you will find Sonar's Sonitus pack and Cubase's plugin set just useless. Only Kontakt 2 + Waves diamond made me happy again.
Sidechaining is missing in both hosts and automation is good. I miss Step recording but I'm seeing Sonar6 has it.
I love Sonar audio stretch and comping abilities, but I like Cubase Midi editors a bit more than Logic's. You can't select a tool for the left mouse button and another one for the right, because the right button opens a menu, as with every windows app.
Both hosts have off-line bounce. Logic hasn't it (at least in 5.. versions) you will love it if drop-outs made you fail 1000000000 times (as me) a mixdown, And both have "freeze" functions. Sonar's freeze is better than Cubase's.
well.... This is what happened to me... Greetings...
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- KVRian
- 1008 posts since 9 Aug, 2004 from helsinki rock city
cubase has step recording, too, and it's actually better than sonars. too bad i hate cubase for its unflexibility. i will not use it.
i find it really hard to get grips with the generic functionality in sonar. nothing seems to work how i expect it to, and aiui this is a common problem? but i think i will get used to the way sonar works .. i hope.
otherwise my only hope is xt2. not that i'd have anything against having xt2 as my "the" host, but it's not out yet, so i can't say if it's perfect for me or not, so if sonar fails i have to keep living in tension and/or possibly even settle for a host i'm not really satisfied with.
well, good thing that samplitude will get step recording in the near future, i've heard. so that's one more possible safetynet =)
but those of you who are thinking of moving to another host. PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, for your own sake, try energyxt. i'd say you'll notice if you like it or not pretty fast (so you won't waste that much time). for me it was almost instant love. i love the way it handles. too bad it doesn't yet do everything i need, but it's damn close. and i think xt2 will.
xt <3
i find it really hard to get grips with the generic functionality in sonar. nothing seems to work how i expect it to, and aiui this is a common problem? but i think i will get used to the way sonar works .. i hope.
otherwise my only hope is xt2. not that i'd have anything against having xt2 as my "the" host, but it's not out yet, so i can't say if it's perfect for me or not, so if sonar fails i have to keep living in tension and/or possibly even settle for a host i'm not really satisfied with.
well, good thing that samplitude will get step recording in the near future, i've heard. so that's one more possible safetynet =)
but those of you who are thinking of moving to another host. PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, for your own sake, try energyxt. i'd say you'll notice if you like it or not pretty fast (so you won't waste that much time). for me it was almost instant love. i love the way it handles. too bad it doesn't yet do everything i need, but it's damn close. and i think xt2 will.
xt <3
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- Banned
- 22457 posts since 5 Sep, 2001
[DELETED]
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- KVRist
- 53 posts since 28 Jun, 2004 from Argentina
In EnergyXT I can enter MIDI notes with Cursor keys and the spacebar, like in a spreadsheet. I love it. Lightspeed MIDI sequencing. I make the MIDI files in EXT and then import them in cubase. I wish all hosts had this handy tool...
[Error: You need to install "this plugin" to show such a cool signature]
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- KVRian
- 1008 posts since 9 Aug, 2004 from helsinki rock city
have you investigated cubase's step recording keyboard shortcuts? you have to program them in yourself iirc.
though its far from perfect, it's as advanced you get from any windows-compatible up-to-date sequencer.
that leaves out the trackers and logic, which is more advanced than cubase.
i'd prefer the pianoroll step recording/sequencing/editing having the same kind of touch than trackers, but none of them have pdc or freeze.
logic seems to be next best, but i wasn't 100% confortable with it .. it didn't do everything as i wanted it to.
then comes cubase ..
then sonar ..
i'm having big hopes for xt2, as the default keyboard shortcuts in ext aren't that optimal.. (as energyxt2 lets you specify your own)
though its far from perfect, it's as advanced you get from any windows-compatible up-to-date sequencer.
that leaves out the trackers and logic, which is more advanced than cubase.
i'd prefer the pianoroll step recording/sequencing/editing having the same kind of touch than trackers, but none of them have pdc or freeze.
logic seems to be next best, but i wasn't 100% confortable with it .. it didn't do everything as i wanted it to.
then comes cubase ..
then sonar ..
i'm having big hopes for xt2, as the default keyboard shortcuts in ext aren't that optimal.. (as energyxt2 lets you specify your own)
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- KVRian
- 1008 posts since 9 Aug, 2004 from helsinki rock city