My Liquid Mix just fried after 48 hours

[egarrard]

my best advice for ANY device is NEVER pull the plug from the UNIT itself, and more importantly, NEVER plug the unit back in on the unit itself. Only unplug/plug into and from the wall.

Or just use a dedicated power strip and leave everything plugged up. Turn the power strip on and off to shut off the equipment. They're pretty inexpensive.

[whyterabbyt]

So the point of not having power switch is to not turn it off. That's why there's nothing mentioned in the manual stating leaving it on.

Unfortunately its just as likely to be a dumb cost-cutting issue. So it doesnt imply anything definitive about intended usage.

In case you don't know, constantly turning anything on & off shortens the unit's life span faster than just leaving it on.

Sort of true, but...

This is self evident with light bulbs. They always die when you turn them on, not when in use.

Not quite. Its due to the 'surge' from starting up in the first place, not because the lifespan has been 'shortened'.

[Jason Brian Merrill]

my best advice for ANY device is NEVER pull the plug from the UNIT itself, and more importantly, NEVER plug the unit back in on the unit itself. Only unplug/plug into and from the wall.

Or just use a dedicated power strip and leave everything plugged up. Turn the power strip on and off to shut off the equipment. They're pretty inexpensive.

indeed.

[OMNIFEX]

Unfortunately its just as likely to be a dumb cost-cutting issue. So it doesnt imply anything definitive about intended usage.

Can't say I believe it's a cost cutting issue. We are talking about a device that
operates on less than 120 volts.

Anyone that can go to Home Depot and buy
a rocker switch for $0.50

When you consider a company that buys
a lot of switches, it might cost them 5 cents tops.

Voltage may need to flow to maintain presets or something.

But in 2006, I find it hard to believe a company would skimp on a power switch if it was really needed.

In case you don't know, constantly turning anything on & off shortens the unit's life span faster than just leaving it on.

Sort of true, but...

This is self evident with light bulbs. They always die when you turn them on, not when in use.

Not quite. Its due to the 'surge' from starting up in the first place, not because the lifespan has been 'shortened'.

Well, if the light bulb wasn't switched
off & and on constantly, it wouldn't be
subjected to repeated surges. Which causes the lifespan to shorten.

[whyterabbyt]

Can't say I believe it's a cost cutting issue.

That doesnt really matter. It could still be the reason.

We are talking about a device that operates on less than 120 volts.

Not in the UK we arent.

And since when has the operating voltage defined whether or not an item has a switch?

Anyone that can go to Home Depot and buy a rocker switch for $0.50
When you consider a company that buys a lot of switches, it might cost them 5 cents tops.

It might. That doesnt mean they wont try and save that 5 cents though.

Voltage may need to flow to maintain presets or something.

Then they havent used flash memory - which would probably be a cost-saving issue.

But in 2006, I find it hard to believe a company would skimp on a power switch if it was really needed.

Unfortunately, these things do happen. Any costs saved are profits. $5000 mixing desks go out with 10 cent op-amps instead of the better 25 cent alternative. Its manufacturing economics...

Well, if the light bulb wasn't switched
off & and on constantly, it wouldn't be
subjected to repeated surges. Which causes the lifespan to shorten.

Indeed.

[kritikon]

So the point of not having power switch is to not turn it off. That's why there's nothing mentioned in the manual stating leaving it on.

That's extremely shakey logic.

How do you turn it off?
You turn off the wall socket switch, or the power board switch. If Focusrite seriously intend for their unit to never be turned off, then it should clearly state so in the manual. And if it doesn't state that, or any particular method of turning off, then if it goes phhhffft, it's their responsibility to replace or fix the faulty unit.

Personally If I saw any unit that stated it was never to be turned off...I wouldn't buy it in the first place. I wouldn't touch it with a huge bargepole. When I move house, move studio etc...I'm expected to buy a brand new unit, becuae it won't tolerate being turned off, and I'll break it when I do? That's commercial suicide for any company.

[plasticmoonrain]

Worth mentioning two things here about my fried Liquid Mix --

1) I only removed the plug and plugged it in ONCE. And that's all it took to do this.

2) If a unit is meant to be kept on and never unplugged, isn't it the burden of the manufacturer to say this, so as to not possibly damage a unit? What are we supposed to be, mind readers? It is the responsibility of the manufacturer to communicate the proper care and maintenance of their products. And if the manual says absolutely ZERO about turning the unit on or off (it pretty much assumes that it's on in the manual -- they don't even talk about the physical act of plugging it in), it is clearly their oversight, not mine.


Drew

[Jason Brian Merrill]

Worth mentioning two things here about my fried Liquid Mix --

1) I only removed the plug and plugged it in ONCE. And that's all it took to do this.

thats all it needs

[OMNIFEX]

Gentlemen.

I think your logic is quite different than mine. I would say it is due to owning numerous old rack mountable gear, that never offered a power switch or having it behind the rack prohibiting you to turn it off without digging your way behind the rack and feeling for a rocker switch.

I'm going to check one of my DBX manuals, and see if they state anywhere that the unit should be plugged out considering they didn't offer a power switch. I do have a few that are hard-wired, but this particular piece doesn’t follow the same rule.


whyterabbyt

Touché!

At times, I do forget that the Internet offers various participants from around the world!

Getting back to the switch. Items that generate heat, and/or consume a lot of current generally offer a switch. Processing equipment which generate very little heat (If any) and don't consume a wealth of current generally don't require a power switch, or keep them in the back along with the input connections. I’m referring to rack mountable gear.

But, things could be different on your side of the world.

kritikon

It’s a great possibility (As someone stated) that the unit went chaotic because it was plugged in while it was connected to the firewire of the computer.

Who knows what relationship those two have?

My example is based on processors offering no power switches or switches inaccessible due to having them mounted in the rear of the rack mounted chassis. Not all the time a Power switch is necessary. Especially when the unit doesn’t generate a lot of heat, or pulls a lot of current.

It can stay there and remain on at all times. Instead of turning on and off when need be.

[Robr]

I've heard of people having the same problem with the Powercore Compact which is also firewire and has no on/off switch. Strangely enough the full size Powercore Firewire does have an on/off switch and seeing as both units are firewire I can't see any other reason for it other than cost.

[timobrien]

OK, stand back for a moment.

Doesn't matter if you're buying a toaster, a microwave oven,
a TV, a car or an expensive piece of audio gear..... the first week
or so is ALWAYS the most likely time that it will go belly-up
if it has any manufacturing faults.

That's why you have a WARRANTY on ANY electronic item.....

Send it back!

[camsr]

my best advice for ANY device is NEVER pull the plug from the UNIT itself, and more importantly, NEVER plug the unit back in on the unit itself. Only unplug/plug into and from the wall.

Theres an AC filtering capicitor in the power supply (wall adaptor) that discharges into the device when unplugged from the wall. This will give a smooth voltage transition instead of a sudden jolt as when you unplug from the device itself.

But as you said you just plugged it in once, it's definately defective. Just send it back, at MINIMUM there is a 30 day warranty on almost anything you buy over 50$ these days.

[plasticmoonrain]

The guys who sold it to me -- audioMIDI.com -- so far have been cool. They e-mailed me a prepaid UPS slip to ship the thing back and told me they had plenty of Liquid Mix's in stock, and would send me another one. Then I got an e-mail from them saying it would ship tomorrow. Let's see how it all goes -- I think when I get the replacement, I'm just not going to unplug it -- ever. Why chance it? However, I do feel I've got to contact Focusrite and let them know what happened, for their own benefit as well as other customers.

And kudos to audioMIDI.com if they handle this painlessly.

Drew

[Jason Brian Merrill]

Something tells me it isnt as defective as it seems, just not well thought out...

with your new one, just never unplug it from the box -- unplug it at the wall, or use a power strip.

[kritikon]

My example is based on processors offering no power switches or switches inaccessible due to having them mounted in the rear of the rack mounted chassis. Not all the time a Power switch is necessary. Especially when the unit doesn't generate a lot of heat, or pulls a lot of current.

Likewise, I've used alot of rack units in the past, some of which didn't supply switches. I can remember my old Lexicon Alex...no power switch. Now...whether that was simply badly thought out, whether it was simply cost-cutting (it was Lexicon's first foray into the real budget market) or whether it was a deliberate ploy along the lines of "you don't get fancy things like switches because it's a budget unit...upgrade to our midrange units and you'll get a switch" a strange kind of tempter..I don't know and never will. But all of the units I've ever used without power switches have never once recommended in their manuals that they don't have power switches because you houldn't turn them off.

It's not a s/w viewpoint. My own personal viewpoint was shaped in the h/w world. I didn't like lack of switches then, and don't now.

Especially when the unit doesn't generate a lot of heat, or pulls a lot of current.

Using the Lexicon as the same example...it came with a transformer, as did many other uinits without switches. Transformers all create heat that is obvious and palpable. That means they are drawing power even when you are not using the unit. That is not acceptable, that you have to pay for power when not in use. Even more so for a business, where profits may be marginal.

It can stay there and remain on at all times. Instead of turning on and off when need be.

And what if you have a project studio and a main studio? And you want to interchange units between the two. You are forced to buy 2 units instead of one? Again...unacceptable. If I have an Eventide or whatever...I am not going to buy two when one can service both rooms. Multiply that by several units.


Focusrite are a company that traditionally has aimed at the studio and pro markets. They will know not to expect studios to swallow that type of marketing and lack of service.


Just for my own personal studio, at the time I had the most h/w, I had a 20U rack full, and the odd extra unit and doodad lying around. I had 5 or 6 synths all being used at the same time. I remember distinctly that I almost always had a minimum of 10 midi units chained together...because it sticks in my mind that it was a hassle finding midi thru units that actually worked properly. Plus the mixers and amps etc. That lot consumes a reasonable amount of power if they were all to be on transformers and left on all the time. It really would influence my buying decisions. If I were forced to leave a unit on, I would not buy it. I doubt I am alone. It has never been acceptable to expect to leave units on. If nothing else...I know personally that I would not want to leave all my units plugged into the wall if I were absent, even if only to reduce the risk of a lightning strike destroying tens of thousands-worth of equipment.

It's a great possibility (As someone stated) that the unit went chaotic because it was plugged in while it was connected to the firewire of the computer.

That's the most probable, I suspect.
But it's still Focusrite's problem. And if they can't fix the problem because of the nature of firewire, then it's their problem to warn users in the manual...if for nothing else than to avoid liability.[/quote]