KVR Audio

MadPsyance · Post by **MadPsyance** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 6:29 am

I like to use the notes c, d#, and F# in a lot of my melodies....problem is I can find no c scale that this would fit into...does that mean it's not a c scale...where do these notes fit? I run into this problem all the time...I'm just starting to learn music theory, but I'm having a hard time understanding what kind of scale a lot of my melodies fit into so I can harmonize or whatever. Is there any easy way to figure out what scale I'm using when I have a melody?

Gregjazz · Post by **Gregjazz** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 6:58 am

C blues, C locrian, C half-whole, and a LOT more.

MadPsyance · Post by **MadPsyance** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:05 am

Well, is there a good way to figure this out or do you just memorize the intervals? Is there any resource that I can see what the C blues, C locrian, C half-whole scales look like? Most sources I can find only talk about major and three different minor scales.

MadPsyance · Post by **MadPsyance** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:09 am

Also, if I know the notes in the scale...do the rules of making triad chords still apply for example I-VII with each note in the triad skipping a third or is there some other rule for non major scales?

Gregjazz · Post by **Gregjazz** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:12 am

Well, I narrow it down.

Read up about modes, starting with major scale modes. That in itself will help you a lot, I think.

C blues: C Eb F F# G Bb
C locrian (7th major scale mode): C Db Eb F Gb Ab Bb
C half-whole: C C# D# E F# G A Bb

tee boy · Post by **tee boy** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:30 am

'vii' of C# Major?

This is a diminished arpeggio. You can extend it:

C, D#, F#, A

This arpeggio is totally symmetrical, and hence all its inversions are the same! It is great for making transitions between different thematic sections.

TB

tamahome · Post by **tamahome** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:55 am

Db Major

tee boy · Post by **tee boy** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 8:03 am

C - Eb - Gb in Db Major

OR

B# - D# - F# in C# Major

TB

tamahome · Post by **tamahome** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 8:07 am

Bumblefoot has a concept he calls 'warped scales', where you just alter any note you want, and then link every other note to form chords. If 2 notes are less than a minor third though, they'll be within the critical band and be dissonant (is dissonate a word?).

tee boy · Post by **tee boy** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 8:24 am

Sounds cool!

I guess there is no reason to revent one from selecting their own pitch material from where ever they like! Indeed, I think a few C20 composers did just that. Messiaen actually invented a system for it which I believe some people still use today.

TB

peejunk · Post by **peejunk** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 9:27 am

In some odd scales using quartal harmony works a lot better than using tertian (classic) harmony. Especially if you don't stick to rules of either but interpret chords as you see fit for the needed harmonic function.

Now let me try to 'box' you: If you're using a lot of minor thirds and tritones in your music, and have psy in your nick, I'm pretty safe assuming you're doing psytrance as lydian and locrian scales were very popular in old goa trance (i guess that's why so many metalheadz are into it), in which case you're better off learning some counterpoint rules than harmony as polyphonic composing works better than harmonic in goa/psy or any dance music that draws it's drive and feel from the dissonance of it's melodies and basslines (i.e. dark DnB as well).

Be it any way, modern music theory teaches us that quartal harmony usually works much better in places, styles and scales where polyphonic composition would work better than composition relying on functional harmony.

Toxikator · Post by **Toxikator** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:36 pm

Sounds to me like the Locrian.

I use bii and bV (or #iv) all the the time (though I prefer the Phyrgian even more, with the bv thrown in).

MadPsyance · Post by **MadPsyance** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 3:19 pm

MadPsyance wrote:Also, if I know the notes in the scale...do the rules of making triad chords still apply for example I-VII with each note in the triad skipping a third or is there some other rule for non major scales?

This question still stands. The only info I can find about forming triads is pertaining to major scales for some reason.

Oh btw, I don't do psytrance, but I do like some of it.

Thanks for all the replies guys!

rachmiel · Post by **rachmiel** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 4:03 pm

one very beautiful scale/mode that uses c d# f# is the diminished scale. there are two flavors; starting at the tonic (c, in this case) you have intervals of 1, 2, 1, 2 as in:

c c# d# e f# g a a# (c)

or of 2, 1, 2, 1 as in:

c d d# f f# g# a b (c)

it's a very exotic sounding scale full of possiblities for melody and harmony. :-)

Gregjazz · Post by **Gregjazz** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 4:14 pm

The best thing about the two diminished scales is that they're 8 note scales, not to mention they're also symmetrical scales, too.

Question about scales